Book publishers see their role as gatekeepers shrink

[James_Wilde]

Originally Posted by nashira

Honestly as long as I can read samples and the prices are decent? I'm quite happy to decide what I like, for myself. I don't really care what big publishing houses do with themselves

I agree, Nashira, from the reader's point of view. But not so hot from the writer's point of view. Even if the reader reduces their choices by selecting their favourite genres, there are still an awful lot of books to wade through in the search for a good sample, which makes each author's chance of being selected a vanishing probablity, unless (s)he can find a way to move the book up the list and in front of the reader.

[nashira]

Originally Posted by James_Wilde

I agree, Nashira, from the reader's point of view. But not so hot from the writer's point of view. Even if the reader reduces their choices by selecting their favourite genres, there are still an awful lot of books to wade through in the search for a good sample, which makes each author's chance of being selected a vanishing probablity, unless (s)he can find a way to move the book up the list and in front of the reader.

I suppose it's all relative - I can get to a lot more different kinds of ebooks that none of the shops around here with dtb's would have stocked, even if it was a best seller. Plus the cost of books in some places is prohibitive or enough people just aren't interested. If a reader is too lazy/doesn't have enough time too look... they'd probably have missed a bunch of good books in paper, too, even with big publishers behind the authors.

Edit: There's also the fact that authors are loosing readers because of other issues in the ebook world, such a DRM (won't buy into it, and neither will a bunch of others), format (wouldn't be an issue without drm), REALLY crappily formatted books (even from big houses) and my other personal favourite aside from DRM (not) geographical restrictions - to which I am subjected a plenty by big houses if I even just want the sample of the book.

[Steven Lyle Jordan]

Originally Posted by K-Thom

Well, I don't know how you exactly define "successful", but this indie author seems to be doing fine.

Sure, he is but one, and maybe the first, but there will eventually be a second, a third, etc.

Yes... I do define that as successful, but I don't define that as a "breakthrough of indie authors." At this point, Pratt counts as an anomaly among indie authors, still incredibly rare among successful grads of the publishing "castle." Obviously that doesn't detract from his success... it's just not a sign that other indies are right behind him, about to mirror his success and become the trend.

[tompe]

Originally Posted by nashira

Honestly as long as I can read samples and the prices are decent? I'm quite happy to decide what I like, for myself. I don't really care what big publishing houses do with themselves

It's not like they've never rejected anything that later became ridiculously popular and loved - Harry Potter, for one. I think it was rejected like ten times, off the top of my head?

And it was finally published by a publisher. So the system works.

[mr ploppy]

Originally Posted by James_Wilde

I agree, Nashira, from the reader's point of view. But not so hot from the writer's point of view. Even if the reader reduces their choices by selecting their favourite genres, there are still an awful lot of books to wade through in the search for a good sample, which makes each author's chance of being selected a vanishing probablity, unless (s)he can find a way to move the book up the list and in front of the reader.

You need a cover image that stands out when displayed at postage stamp size (and also in black and white for people browsing on ebook readers). Once you have one of those you will get more people looking at your cover blurb (not sure what that is called for ebooks?). Make that enticing enough and people will look at the sample.

[mr ploppy]

Originally Posted by tompe

And it was finally published by a publisher. So the system works.

And led to a glut of boy wizard type books being published as everyone tried to cash in on its unexpected success. Meanwhile, lots of other books were rejected because they didn't contain any boy wizards.

[tompe]

Originally Posted by mr ploppy

And led to a glut of boy wizard type books being published as everyone tried to cash in on its unexpected success. Meanwhile, lots of other books were rejected because they didn't contain any boy wizards.

Meanwhile a lot of other books got published because of all the income from the boy wizard books.

[nashira]

Originally Posted by tompe

And it was finally published by a publisher. So the system works.

Yes but it just as easily could have been rejected, and JKR could have cut her losses and the world would be short a series of books that for better or worse got a new generation back to reading.

That was more luck than the system working. A lot of people, even if they're good writers, might well give up before lucky number eleven.

[tompe]

Originally Posted by nashira

Yes but it just as easily could have been rejected, and JKR could have cut her losses and the world would be short a series of books that for better or worse got a new generation back to reading.

Why do you believe that? A common reason to reject a book is that it does not fit the current plan. And you can never predict a best seller. But if it is good enough to be published it usually is.

[nashira]

Originally Posted by tompe

Why do you believe that? A common reason to reject a book is that it does not fit the current plan. And you can never predict a best seller. But if it is good enough to be published it usually is.

Because if ten other publishers though "eh, no." or whatever, it's logical that another could have just as easily thought so, too. It could have not fit their plan, their agenda, their whatever reason they might otherwise take it.

Obviously it wasn't rejected and is hugely successful, but it's hardly a given that it was going to be even published, ever.

[Elfwreck]

Originally Posted by mr ploppy

You need a cover image that stands out when displayed at postage stamp size (and also in black and white for people browsing on ebook readers). Once you have one of those you will get more people looking at your cover blurb (not sure what that is called for ebooks?). Make that enticing enough and people will look at the sample.

Currently, I browse Smashwords with the cover images turned off because so many of them are either badly made, or a bit too lurid to deal with at work. I've been trying to pick ebooks by descriptive blurb and ignore the covers.

[Steven Lyle Jordan]

Originally Posted by Elfwreck

Currently, I browse Smashwords with the cover images turned off because so many of them are either badly made, or a bit too lurid to deal with at work. I've been trying to pick ebooks by descriptive blurb and ignore the covers.

So... putting Hustler centerfolds on my covers would be a bad idea?

[Elfwreck]

Originally Posted by Steven Lyle Jordan

So... putting Hustler centerfolds on my covers would be a bad idea?

Heh. I suspect a lot of people still use covers to decide what to buy or read. I approve of using artistic arrangements of human anatomy to increase book sales; I suggest using title text arrangements to cover up any bits that would be illegal to display in public.

Of course, if your books are gritty westerns and buyers complain that the cover was misleading, that's your problem. (Insist that the covers were an abstract representation of the content. Get a third-year philosophy student to provide the explanation; offer him credit as a "literary analyst.")

[DMcCunney]

Originally Posted by Elfwreck

Of course, if your books are gritty westerns and buyers complain that the cover was misleading, that's your problem. (Insist that the covers were an abstract representation of the content. Get a third-year philosophy student to provide the explanation; offer him credit as a "literary analyst.")

"Community standards", anyone?

Once upon a time, porn was problematic, and the buzzwords were "redeeming social value", so the porn houses would hire someone entitled to put PhD after their name to write an introductory essay explaining the redeeming social value of the work. It was nonsense, of course, and the essays were often nearly as badly written as the work they introduced, but they had that essay, and the porn house could point at it and say "Not porn, art! See? A PhD says so!"
______
Dennis

[tompe]

Originally Posted by nashira

Because if ten other publishers though "eh, no." or whatever, it's logical that another could have just as easily thought so, too. It could have not fit their plan, their agenda, their whatever reason they might otherwise take it.

Obviously it wasn't rejected and is hugely successful, but it's hardly a given that it was going to be even published, ever.

Look at the probabilities instead. Say that it is 30% chance that a specific publisher misses something that ought to be published. The probability that 20 publisher all will miss it is rather small.