AAArrgghhh! I hate editing!

[rhadin]

Originally Posted by MrPLD

Aaah, editors (and proof readers)... expensive but frequently essential.

We spent thousands of dollars and that was a "medium priced" editing.

Despite all that, it wasn't until it hit print that we found another 10 or so mishaps in a 380 page / 200,000 word book. Considering it was our first book I'm quite pleased overall as we were rather distracted learning all the in and outs.

Perhaps the worst thing you can do is edit your own work - you're effectively too blind to see anything.

I've been a professional editor for 26 years and have edited hundreds of books over that time (not fiction, however; I do not edit fiction) and can tell you that no matter how careful an editor is and no matter how careful the proofreader is, there will invariably remain a few errors in a book. It is the nature of being human.

I wrote about this phenomenon on my blog in The WYSIWYG Conundrum: The Solid Cloud.

As for self-editing, that is almost always a mistake, not only because of the WYSIWYG Conundrum but because it can lead to great embarassment and doesn't reduce the cost of professional editing (see I Published My Book But Readers Keep Finding Errors).

Whether or not authors should invest in professional help is an ongoing debate. As an editor, I definitely think they should and posed the question in this blog piece: Question of the Day: Investing in eBooks by Authors & Readers.

I also have written about the difference between a professional editor and the neighborhood editor in these 2 articles: Professional Editors: Publishers and Authors Need Them (Part 1) and Professional Editors: Publishers and Authors Need Them (Part 2).

Again, just so it is clear, I'm not looking for work nor making a pitch that an author on Mobile Read should be contacting me to be their editor: I only work for publishers, only in nonfiction, and almost exclusively in the fields of doctor-to-doctor medicine and educator-to-educator education. I present the above perspectives because I think they would be helpful to Mobile Read authors.

[M. R. Mathias]

Originally Posted by HarryT

With the greatest respect, Mr. Mathias, you asked for criticism of your work. Right here:

https://www.mobileread.com/forums/sho...00&postcount=2

You said:



But then when someone does what you ask, you fly off the handle. If you don't want people to point out mistakes to you, why ask in the first place? You are of course very welcome to disagree with my point of view, but I'm afraid that I stand by the view that to advertise a forthcoming book with a poorly-worded banner ad is a mistake. Now I know, though, that you are not in fact interested in receiving constructive criticism, I certainly shan't waste your time and mine by offering it again.

I did, BUT....
You should have given it right there! Not here, and the post three posts after that says that I was being sarcastic.

[rhadin]

Originally Posted by HarryT

You may wish to edit your banner - it doesn't make any grammatical sense. "Coming October 2010" and "Are you ready?" should be two separate sentences.

I read the short story you posted recently, "The Blood of Coldfrost" and, to be honest, you really, REALLY need to get help from a professional editor to give you some guidelines. Although it was a good story, the grammar was just ghastly. No matter how good a storyteller you are, grammar is a writer's toolbox, and if you don't know how to use those tools properly, people aren't going to read your books.

Harry, I wish you hadn't written this -- I just bought his fantasy for $9 on Smashwords after looking at the first few pages, which were fine. I don't have the patience to read the samples, although in this case, if I bought a lemon it is my fault because he did provide a very generous sample.

FWIW, I'm working my way through the new Brandon Sanderson epic, The Way of Kings. It has several errors, albeit minor, in the first 300 pages, such as wrong word, dropped articles, and the like -- at least in the ebook version (I haven't checked it against the print version, which I also bought), but the biggest problem with the Sanderson ebook is the inability to read the illustrations, which are integral to the story. I wrote about this problem last week in The Problem Is: Publishers Don’t Read eBooks!

I keep reading Sanderson's book but can't decide if it is good, bad, or indifferent. Hopefully I'll know by the end .

[M. R. Mathias]

Originally Posted by Bilbo1967

Added to my Ignore list, reason; crimes against the English language (the country that is unfortunate enough to have Mathias as a resident and the year are irrelevant - it most definitely is English he's mangling) and extreme f**kwittery.

Its the "year is irrelevant"... Who is mangling now?

[Bilbo1967]

Originally Posted by M. R. Mathias

Its the "year is irrelevant"... Who is mangling now?

Boy, am I glad that I didn't get round to ignoring you yet!

The full sentence states that the country of residence and the year are irrelevant. That's two things (count them) that are irrelevant, hence the are.

It would appear that your ability to even comprehend, let alone write, simple grammatical sentences is practically non-existent.

[HarryT]

Originally Posted by M. R. Mathias

Its the "year is irrelevant"... Who is mangling now?

The sentence has two subjects: "the country" and "the year", therefore a plural verb is entirely correct.

[M. R. Mathias]

Originally Posted by rhadin

Harry, I wish you hadn't written this -- I just bought his fantasy for $9 on Smashwords after looking at the first few pages, which were fine. I don't have the patience to read the samples, although in this case, if I bought a lemon it is my fault because he did provide a very generous sample.

FWIW, I'm working my way through the new Brandon Sanderson epic, The Way of Kings. It has several errors, albeit minor, in the first 300 pages, such as wrong word, dropped articles, and the like -- at least in the ebook version (I haven't checked it against the print version, which I also bought), but the biggest problem with the Sanderson ebook is the inability to read the illustrations, which are integral to the story. I wrote about this problem last week in The Problem Is: Publishers Don’t Read eBooks!


I keep reading Sanderson's book but can't decide if it is good, bad, or indifferent. Hopefully I'll know by the end .

Thanks for the purchase. I'm sure you will enjoy it. The Blood of Coldfrost was a 1500 word flash fiction project I did and it was edited by 4 other authors. It was written and uploaded cover and all in less that 12 hours. If it has flaws I can't find them. But then again if you read this thread you would know that my editing sucks and that my novels were professionally edited. You should be OK with The Sword and the Dragon.

[Lemurion]

I edit everything I write; I also edit a lot of things other people write.

While I do see why someone might not want to put the same effort into something they're giving away as something they're selling, I don't think putting out unedited short stories is a good idea. If the purpose of the stories is to get people to read the novels, then they should be of the same level of quality.

I know if I don't like a sample, I'm not going to buy the full version in the hope it's going to be of higher quality.

I just don't see the point to putting out lower quality work to try and get people interested in your products. I think it's counter-productive.

[rhadin]

Originally Posted by M. R. Mathias

Ah my friend you must not be a professional editor... LMAO 'Coming October 2010' would be an incomplete sentence.

It's an ad in a logo get a grip. Why would I pay to edit a story I give you for free. That would be redundant... lmao. You really should learn to enjoy the 'story.' Before there was even a written language the best stories were being told. Who edited those?

And my Reading enthusiasts friend, have you bought an ebook lately... Most of them have crap scanned editing. You're welcome for the free story though, next time I'll charge you to read my work. If I did maybe I could afford the cost of editing.

When life starts to make grammatical sense I'll give you a call. Like anything in life makes makes grammatical sense. AGAIN...LMAO LOL PDQ FYI where's the grammar at now? the 1900's are over get a grip

PS.... I can name you 100 novels and stories with perfect editing that SUCK, but I can give you one that is entertaining that doesn't even have a punctuation in it.

By the way the story "The Blood of Coldfrost" was a project story edited by several Kindleboards authors.

I didn't edit it! Four authors did. I did write it though, so thanks for the compliment.

I hope the book your editing does not SUCK cause a GOOD EDIT CAN NOT MAKE A BAD STORY GOOD! However a good story can transcend a bad edit! That's the facts Jack!

For somebody who wants to encourage people to buy his books, you have a very poor attitude towards readers. I resisted the urge to tell you to rethink your approach toward readers in the thread inquiring about the price of the first book in your trilogy and bought the book despite your attitude, but your rants have made me rethink the wisdom of my purchase.

Your attitude would be appropriate if you were truly a master of the writing craft, but you can take solace that anyone with a computer can call themselves a writer. The proof of their mastery will be in whether they sell enough books to "afford the cost of editing."

[M. R. Mathias]

Originally Posted by HarryT

The sentence has two subjects: "the country" and "the year", therefore a plural verb is entirely correct.

I was just trying to see if you really put me on ignore. Either way it sounds terribly wrong and was disruptive to the flow of your post.

[HarryT]

Originally Posted by M. R. Mathias

I was just trying to see if you really put me on ignore. Either way it sounds terribly wrong and was disruptive to the flow of your post.

I didn't say that I was going to ignore you; I merely said that I would not offer you any more advice on your writing since, despite asking for it, you clearly don't actually want it.

[Bilbo1967]

Originally Posted by HarryT

I didn't say that I was going to ignore you.

I think he means me, Harry. I have put him on ignore now, but can still see his posts when somebody else quotes them.

If we all have to word our posts in a way that make them explicable to somebody so grammatically challenged then we may as well give up. I'll keep posting under the assumption that others can understand basic English; I think it's true of most people here.

[M. R. Mathias]

I want any of you to go find the flaws in anything you are saying isn't edited. A bunch of people jumping in a band wagon who have not even read what they are talking about is all I see. There are not that many flaws in my stories. There may be a few because I am human, but to act like its blatant crap just shows anyone who bothers to read the material how silly you are. Find the errors... Lets point them all out right here. I asked for it in the other thread. Not here, but now I am challenging you here. I'm calling you out. Go find the errors in The Blood of Coldfrost and Oathbreaker. Please come post them here so others can see how great of an editer you people think you are.

[HarryT]

Not me, my friend. I may, as you claimed, be retarded, but I am not sufficiently retarded to want to come back for more insults.

[M. R. Mathias]

I'm talking to all of you, but Bilbo especially.