The MR Literary Society

FlorenceArt · 05-03-2011, 03:32 PM

Hi All,

I am starting this thread in the hope that, like me, others feel the need to set aside a space to discuss "serious" or quality literature. If not, well, this thread will simply sink to oblivion, but at least I will have tried

I have nothing against escapist or purely recreational reading. For me it has completely replaced television in the last few years. It's great to be able to come home from a hard and stressful day and just pick up an undemanding and enjoyable book.

But reading is also a way to travel in time and space, to expand our horizon, to learn something about ourselves and others. And sometimes also to simply bask in the warm glow of language, wonderful, treacherous, unreliable, musical language.

I am a bit saddened to see that the same books, or types of books, keep popping up over and over in discussions, when there is a whole world to discover out there. We are incredibly privileged to have at our disposal several millenniums of books from all over the world. I don't think any human society has ever had so many, so easily available. Teenage sorcerers, dragon tamers and vampires are great, but there are so many more stories out there!

So let's pick up a fork and dig in! As my mother used to say, don't say you don't like it until you have tried it at least once.

I won't attempt to define "serious" or "quality" literature. It's been discussed before, and I don't think it's very useful really. There is no universal definition, and even if two persons could come to an agreement on that definition, there will always be at least one book on which they disagree. And that's fine! I'm just trying to start a discussion, not a catalog

So, finally I come to the point and start by offering my current read, Roberto Bolaño's The Savage Detectives. Here is one book that will make you travel: from the streets of Mexico City to those of Barcelona and Paris, with a lot of topographical details. It's like the author wrote his book with a street map of each city before him, and he describes the characters' long rambling walks so that you could follow it on the map (which I haven't tried but I assume you could).

I'm about halfway through and liking it more and more. The first part was only so-so for me, but the second part suddenly expands the points of view (it's presented as a series of interviews of many different people), and also expands geographically (as I said, between Mexico and Europe) and in time. It's a bit overwhelming at first, but I am now in the thick of it and loving it

So, let's hear from you guys!

TGS · 05-03-2011, 04:18 PM

Would like to add my support - though cannot promise to always read the chosen book, (I say this having tried The Savage Detectives last year and it being one of the few books I have abandoned!) Not quite as literary but I'm reading Blood Meridian by Cormac McCarthy at the moment.

FlorenceArt · 05-03-2011, 04:28 PM

Welcome to the MRLS, TGS!

I certainly wouldn't presume on choosing books for anyone!

And I think Blood Meridian is quite as literary. And it happens that I read it just before The Savage Detective. I loved it, though I preferred the more sober style of The Road, which I read a few months before.

covingtoncat73 · 05-03-2011, 04:37 PM

Well, a literary fiction I read recently was The Thousand Autumns of Jacob de Zoet. It was amazing. It is about a Dutch clerk with the East India company in 1799 Japan (when the story opens). He meets a Japanese midwife with a scarred face. It isn't a romance in the genre sense at all, though. It is one of the best things I have read in recent years

TGS · 05-03-2011, 04:38 PM

Well, for those who might like to know more about Blood Meridian - and it is not an easy novel to summarise other than to say it's set in the middle of the nineteenth century in the American west - a quite enlightening review and discussion can be found here.

TGS · 05-03-2011, 04:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by covingtoncat73

Well, a literary fiction I read recently was The Thousand Autumns of Jacob de Zoet. It was amazing. It is about a Dutch clerk with the East India company in 1799 Japan (when the story opens). He meets a Japanese midwife with a scarred face. It isn't a romance in the genre sense at all, though. It is one of the best things I have read in recent years

I read it recently too and thought it was excellent. I'm not one for "love stories" but the love story aspect of this was one of the most poignant things I've read for a long time.

FlorenceArt · 05-03-2011, 04:42 PM

I have nothing against love stories, in fact I will happily read trashy love stories, but if they are well written it's even better!! I've read about this Jacob de Zoet book before, I'll check it out.

issybird · 05-03-2011, 05:51 PM

Chiming in with my support. I think MR is a fantastic community, but the books overall seem to tend toward fantasy/sf, which was never my cuppa. On the recommendation of a friend, I've recently started reading fantasy literature and while it keeps me turning the pages, it doesn't nourish my soul--not presuming to speak for anyone else's soul. I'll add that I'm currently in the middle of Jacob de Zoet. We may need a thread for that.

Two logistical questions: does non-fiction qualify? I'm assuming yes. More of my recent great reads have been in that category. A tougher one: what about DTBs? Too many books fall into that chasm between current lit and public domain.

covingtoncat73 · 05-03-2011, 06:06 PM

Oh, and if any of you like Jacob de Zoet, I can also reccomend The Coffee Trader by David Liss. I am not too much on Sci-Fi but I love dark fantasy/horror (Gaiman, King, and Joe Hill are pretty tops with me). But I do also love historically-set literary fiction.

Fbone · 05-03-2011, 06:10 PM

Not quite sure if this is "quality."

Last year I read Shadow of the Wind and thought the writing was wonderful. The story wasn't action-packed but the artistry was excellent even translated from Spanish. I understand the original Spanish edition is even better; poetic even.

jgaiser · 05-03-2011, 07:41 PM

Ok, as long as we don't have read Joyce....

(Someday I'm going to get through Ulysses).

While a do read a lot of mindless fiction, I'm also interested in expanding my horizons. As with TGS, I might not read everything but I'm willing to give more literary fiction a chance.

poohbear_nc · 05-03-2011, 08:10 PM

Brilliant! I'll be joining in too! David Mitchell is one of my "must read" authors.

I too enjoy both "serious" reads [currently on a read though of the entire Henry James canon] and "trashy" thrillers/dark fantasy, etc. My tastes are MOST eclectic!

straygator · 05-03-2011, 08:17 PM

Excellent thread. And thanks, all, for the heads-up on Jacob de Zoet and The Savage Detectives. I'm tracking those down asap.

I tend to ignore a work's 'genre' and labeling and seek out fiction that goes beyond who did what to whom - that explores the 'whys,' and how those 'whys' relate to (and should be important to) the reader.

Blood Meridian is excellent. As I posted on the literary fiction thread a few days ago, I just started Tea Obreht's The Tiger's Wife, and the writing is phenomenal. Also, a recent, quirky re-read that surprised me was Peter Matthiessen's Far Tortuga.

jgaiser · 05-03-2011, 09:32 PM

In February SF Signal (a Speculative Fiction website) posted an article on 10 Literary Novels for Genre Readers. The list includes Vladimir Nabokov, Thomas Pynchon, Cormac McCarthy, and Margaret Atwood. Do any of these titles fit into anyones definition of literary fiction?

poohbear_nc · 05-03-2011, 09:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jgaiser

In February SF Signal (a Speculative Fiction website) posted an article on 10 Literary Novels for Genre Readers. The list includes Vladimir Nabokov, Thomas Pynchon, Cormac McCarthy, and Margaret Atwood. Do any of these titles fit into anyones definition of literary fiction?

Oh indeed - all - into my definition.

05-03-2011, 03:32 PM	#1
FlorenceArt High Priestess Posts: 5,761 Karma: 5042529 Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Montreuil sous bois, France Device: iPad Pro 9.7, iPhone 6 Plus	The MR Literary Society Hi All, I am starting this thread in the hope that, like me, others feel the need to set aside a space to discuss "serious" or quality literature. If not, well, this thread will simply sink to oblivion, but at least I will have tried I have nothing against escapist or purely recreational reading. For me it has completely replaced television in the last few years. It's great to be able to come home from a hard and stressful day and just pick up an undemanding and enjoyable book. But reading is also a way to travel in time and space, to expand our horizon, to learn something about ourselves and others. And sometimes also to simply bask in the warm glow of language, wonderful, treacherous, unreliable, musical language. I am a bit saddened to see that the same books, or types of books, keep popping up over and over in discussions, when there is a whole world to discover out there. We are incredibly privileged to have at our disposal several millenniums of books from all over the world. I don't think any human society has ever had so many, so easily available. Teenage sorcerers, dragon tamers and vampires are great, but there are so many more stories out there! So let's pick up a fork and dig in! As my mother used to say, don't say you don't like it until you have tried it at least once. I won't attempt to define "serious" or "quality" literature. It's been discussed before, and I don't think it's very useful really. There is no universal definition, and even if two persons could come to an agreement on that definition, there will always be at least one book on which they disagree. And that's fine! I'm just trying to start a discussion, not a catalog So, finally I come to the point and start by offering my current read, Roberto Bolaño's The Savage Detectives. Here is one book that will make you travel: from the streets of Mexico City to those of Barcelona and Paris, with a lot of topographical details. It's like the author wrote his book with a street map of each city before him, and he describes the characters' long rambling walks so that you could follow it on the map (which I haven't tried but I assume you could). I'm about halfway through and liking it more and more. The first part was only so-so for me, but the second part suddenly expands the points of view (it's presented as a series of interviews of many different people), and also expands geographically (as I said, between Mexico and Europe) and in time. It's a bit overwhelming at first, but I am now in the thick of it and loving it So, let's hear from you guys!

05-03-2011, 04:38 PM	#5
TGS Country Member Posts: 9,058 Karma: 7676767 Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Denmark Device: Liseuse: Irex DR800. PRS 505 in the house, and the missus has an iPad.	Well, for those who might like to know more about Blood Meridian - and it is not an easy novel to summarise other than to say it's set in the middle of the nineteenth century in the American west - a quite enlightening review and discussion can be found here. Last edited by TGS; 05-03-2011 at 04:41 PM.

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05-03-2011, 04:18 PM	#2
TGS Country Member Posts: 9,058 Karma: 7676767 Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Denmark Device: Liseuse: Irex DR800. PRS 505 in the house, and the missus has an iPad.	Would like to add my support - though cannot promise to always read the chosen book, (I say this having tried The Savage Detectives last year and it being one of the few books I have abandoned!) Not quite as literary but I'm reading Blood Meridian by Cormac McCarthy at the moment.

05-03-2011, 04:28 PM	#3
FlorenceArt High Priestess Posts: 5,761 Karma: 5042529 Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Montreuil sous bois, France Device: iPad Pro 9.7, iPhone 6 Plus	Welcome to the MRLS, TGS! I certainly wouldn't presume on choosing books for anyone! And I think Blood Meridian is quite as literary. And it happens that I read it just before The Savage Detective. I loved it, though I preferred the more sober style of The Road, which I read a few months before.

05-03-2011, 04:37 PM	#4
covingtoncat73 Wizard Posts: 2,745 Karma: 83407757 Join Date: Mar 2011 Device: Kindle Paperwhite, Lenovo Duet Chromebook, Moto e	Well, a literary fiction I read recently was The Thousand Autumns of Jacob de Zoet. It was amazing. It is about a Dutch clerk with the East India company in 1799 Japan (when the story opens). He meets a Japanese midwife with a scarred face. It isn't a romance in the genre sense at all, though. It is one of the best things I have read in recent years

05-03-2011, 04:42 PM	#7
FlorenceArt High Priestess Posts: 5,761 Karma: 5042529 Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Montreuil sous bois, France Device: iPad Pro 9.7, iPhone 6 Plus	I have nothing against love stories, in fact I will happily read trashy love stories, but if they are well written it's even better!! I've read about this Jacob de Zoet book before, I'll check it out.

05-03-2011, 05:51 PM	#8
issybird o saeclum infacetum Posts: 21,118 Karma: 234185759 Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: New England Device: Mini, Glo HD, H2O, Aura One, PW4, PW5	Chiming in with my support. I think MR is a fantastic community, but the books overall seem to tend toward fantasy/sf, which was never my cuppa. On the recommendation of a friend, I've recently started reading fantasy literature and while it keeps me turning the pages, it doesn't nourish my soul--not presuming to speak for anyone else's soul. I'll add that I'm currently in the middle of Jacob de Zoet. We may need a thread for that. Two logistical questions: does non-fiction qualify? I'm assuming yes. More of my recent great reads have been in that category. A tougher one: what about DTBs? Too many books fall into that chasm between current lit and public domain.

05-03-2011, 06:06 PM	#9
covingtoncat73 Wizard Posts: 2,745 Karma: 83407757 Join Date: Mar 2011 Device: Kindle Paperwhite, Lenovo Duet Chromebook, Moto e	Oh, and if any of you like Jacob de Zoet, I can also reccomend The Coffee Trader by David Liss. I am not too much on Sci-Fi but I love dark fantasy/horror (Gaiman, King, and Joe Hill are pretty tops with me). But I do also love historically-set literary fiction.

05-03-2011, 06:10 PM	#10
Fbone Is that a sandwich? Posts: 8,281 Karma: 101696762 Join Date: Jun 2010 Device: Nook Glowlight Plus	Not quite sure if this is "quality." Last year I read Shadow of the Wind and thought the writing was wonderful. The story wasn't action-packed but the artistry was excellent even translated from Spanish. I understand the original Spanish edition is even better; poetic even.

05-03-2011, 07:41 PM	#11
jgaiser Omnivorous Posts: 3,283 Karma: 27978909 Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Rural NW Oregon Device: Kindle Voyage, Kindle Fire HD, Kindle 3, KPW1	Ok, as long as we don't have read Joyce.... (Someday I'm going to get through Ulysses). While a do read a lot of mindless fiction, I'm also interested in expanding my horizons. As with TGS, I might not read everything but I'm willing to give more literary fiction a chance.

05-03-2011, 08:10 PM	#12
poohbear_nc Bah! Humbug! Posts: 62,709 Karma: 135239851 Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Durham, NC Device: Every Kindle Ever Made & To Be Made!	Brilliant! I'll be joining in too! David Mitchell is one of my "must read" authors. I too enjoy both "serious" reads [currently on a read though of the entire Henry James canon] and "trashy" thrillers/dark fantasy, etc. My tastes are MOST eclectic!

05-03-2011, 08:17 PM	#13
straygator Connoisseur Posts: 88 Karma: 33904 Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: Cayman Islands Device: Kindle	Excellent thread. And thanks, all, for the heads-up on Jacob de Zoet and The Savage Detectives. I'm tracking those down asap. I tend to ignore a work's 'genre' and labeling and seek out fiction that goes beyond who did what to whom - that explores the 'whys,' and how those 'whys' relate to (and should be important to) the reader. Blood Meridian is excellent. As I posted on the literary fiction thread a few days ago, I just started Tea Obreht's The Tiger's Wife, and the writing is phenomenal. Also, a recent, quirky re-read that surprised me was Peter Matthiessen's Far Tortuga.

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05-03-2011, 09:32 PM	#14
jgaiser Omnivorous Posts: 3,283 Karma: 27978909 Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Rural NW Oregon Device: Kindle Voyage, Kindle Fire HD, Kindle 3, KPW1	In February SF Signal (a Speculative Fiction website) posted an article on 10 Literary Novels for Genre Readers. The list includes Vladimir Nabokov, Thomas Pynchon, Cormac McCarthy, and Margaret Atwood. Do any of these titles fit into anyones definition of literary fiction?