New version of DRM removal tools ("DeDRM")

[eschwartz]

Originally Posted by shalym

I just upgraded, and added a book that is listed as "enhanced" to my library in Kindle For PC. It downloaded as a regular .azw file.

Does anyone have an example of an actual book that downloaded to Kindle For PC in the .kfx format?

Shari

Originally Posted by jhowell

I have the latest Kindle for PC (1.12.2 40996) installed and have tested with three books, all of which are KFX on my PW2. They all were delivered in the older format, compatible with calibre and the "tools", using Kindle for PC.

I think that whoever stated that K4PC uses KFX was mistaken.

I am fairly positive that the only person who said K4PC delivers KFX was JSWolf -- he said so based on hearsay, after hearing someone say the update included Bookerly.
He has since retracted his assumption.


Is this going to become a fully qualified zombie meme???

[shalym]

Originally Posted by eschwartz

Is this going to become a fully qualified zombie meme???

I certainly hope not.

Shari

[darryl]

The situation at the moment seems to be that a book with the new typesetting available will:

1. If downloaded directly to an e-ink Kindle Paperwhite 2 or later will be kfx.
2. If downloaded directly to an e-ink Kindle Paperwhite 1 or older will be older formats.
3. If dowloaded for transfer via usb will be older formats.
4. If downloaded to Kindle for PC or Mac will be older formats. Have not tested Windows "app".
5. Not sure about current Android applications including the app on the Fire.

I also don't think there is any real danger of being unable to obtain older formats any time soon. KFX is not currently supported by many e-ink Kindles including the original Paperwhite, still widely used. It is not currently supported by Kindle for PC or Mac. Download via usb is still available for Kindle owners and does not support KFX.

On the other hand, the seeds of a DRM apocalypse are here. Amazon has for the moment the technology to achieve this. As does Adobe. But no longer can those of us using epub simply rush to Amazon with any confidence if and when Adobe's new DRM is activated. I would imagine Amazon has been doing its research on the likely effect of going exclusively kfx on sales of both Kindles and EBooks.

EDIT: Kindle Fire supports new typography. It now appears to belong in category 1 above. Downloading a book with new typography did not appear to place any file in the usual location. I did not actually see where the downloaded file was placed or verify that it was kfx. I did verify that the new typography works.

[cadele]

Originally Posted by darryl

The situation at the moment seems to be that a book with the new typesetting available will:

1. If downloaded directly to an e-ink Kindle Paperwhite 2 or later will be kfx.
2. If downloaded directly to an e-ink Kindle Paperwhite 1 or older will be older formats.
3. If dowloaded for transfer via usb will be older formats.
4. If downloaded to Kindle for PC or Mac will be older formats. Have not tested Windows "app".
5. Not sure about current Android applications including the app on the Fire.

I also don't think there is any real danger of being unable to obtain older formats any time soon. KFX is not currently supported by many e-ink Kindles including the original Paperwhite, still widely used. It is not currently supported by Kindle for PC or Mac. Download via usb is still available for Kindle owners and does not support KFX.

On the other hand, the seeds of a DRM apocalypse are here. Amazon has for the moment the technology to achieve this. As does Adobe. But no longer can those of us using epub simply rush to Amazon with any confidence if and when Adobe's new DRM is activated. I would imagine Amazon has been doing its research on the likely effect of going exclusively kf8 on sales of both Kindles and EBooks.

Thank you for your informative and non-judgemental post.

In a post-DRM-apocalyptic world I will just buy DRM-free ebooks from the publishers direct, not the stores supporting DRM.

Hopefully it won't come to that.

On the other hand, I feel far less guilty now looking at my TBR hoard (currently at Smaug level).

[eschwartz]

Originally Posted by darryl

The situation at the moment seems to be that a book with the new typesetting available will:

1. If downloaded directly to an e-ink Kindle Paperwhite 2 or later will be kfx.
2. If downloaded directly to an e-ink Kindle Paperwhite 1 or older will be older formats.
3. If dowloaded for transfer via usb will be older formats.
4. If downloaded to Kindle for PC or Mac will be older formats. Have not tested Windows "app".

Old news -- the Windows Metro app has never used the old OR new format. It uses a cache system full of meaningless file fragments IIRC.

You could never decrypt those with Alf. I don't think anyone ever bothered, as K4PC still works fine on the same PCs.

5. Not sure about current Android applications including the app on the Fire.

I also don't think there is any real danger of being unable to obtain older formats any time soon. KFX is not currently supported by many e-ink Kindles including the original Paperwhite, still widely used. It is not currently supported by Kindle for PC or Mac. Download via usb is still available for Kindle owners and does not support KFX.

On the other hand, the seeds of a DRM apocalypse are here. Amazon has for the moment the technology to achieve this. As does Adobe. But no longer can those of us using epub simply rush to Amazon with any confidence if and when Adobe's new DRM is activated. I would imagine Amazon has been doing its research on the likely effect of going exclusively kfx on sales of both Kindles and EBooks.

Can you make up your mind?

You don't believe there is a danger... because of all the old devices. Note: Amazon still supports the Original Mark I Kindle, in theory. I don't know if anyone knows someone who has one.
I know there are still people who use the K2.

On the other hand, Amazon is setting up for the apocalypse, therefore you cannot simply rush to Amazon, because they might go exclusively KFX?
And stop supporting all those old devices?


Other than that, decent summary.

[darryl]

@eschwartz. Thanks for the info about the metro app. I only use Windows when I can't avoid it, and am actually quite amused watching both MS and Apple attempting to move their PC OS's to an appstore type model.

I should have been clearer about the "DRM Apocalypse". I doubt there will be a problem in the shorter term. There may in fact never be a problem. But the seeds are there for one. If Amazon decides that its interests are best served by moving to kfx, this is the direction they will take. I do not expect them to cease supporting older devices completely. But if they were to move the PC Apps to kfx and remove the USB download option (or move it to kfx) it would become difficult to obtain kf8 and older formats without actually having an older device. As things stand, they remain the best option if Adobe's new DRM becomes widely adopted tomorrow. The fact that they might later go exclusively kfx is no more relevant to this decision than the fact that they may actually become a monopoly in the future. We could, however, be a little more confident in Amazon without the kf8 format in its current state.

[eschwartz]

Wait, hasn't OSX done that for a long time?
It is MS who is being all amusing and late to the game.
But what amuses me is they still haven't figured out how to do dependencies...


As for the DRM Apocalypse, I am sure by the time KF8 is no longer an option KFX will be understood. Or Adobe's latest DRM flavor will be broken. Probably both.

I remain confident that the DRM apocalypse will never happen.

[cybmole]

+1
worst case is we all head to ebay for ancient mobi-only kindle models to download onto

is there any techie discussion / analysis of KFX & its DRM going on elsewhere - where such things are allowed ?

[HarryT]

Best place to ask that would be Alf's blog.

[JSWolf]

Originally Posted by darryl

The situation at the moment seems to be that a book with the new typesetting available will:

1. If downloaded directly to an e-ink Kindle Paperwhite 2 or later will be kfx.
2. If downloaded directly to an e-ink Kindle Paperwhite 1 or older will be older formats.
3. If dowloaded for transfer via usb will be older formats.
4. If downloaded to Kindle for PC or Mac will be older formats. Have not tested Windows "app".
5. Not sure about current Android applications including the app on the Fire.

I also don't think there is any real danger of being unable to obtain older formats any time soon. KFX is not currently supported by many e-ink Kindles including the original Paperwhite, still widely used. It is not currently supported by Kindle for PC or Mac. Download via usb is still available for Kindle owners and does not support KFX.

On the other hand, the seeds of a DRM apocalypse are here. Amazon has for the moment the technology to achieve this. As does Adobe. But no longer can those of us using epub simply rush to Amazon with any confidence if and when Adobe's new DRM is activated. I would imagine Amazon has been doing its research on the likely effect of going exclusively kfx on sales of both Kindles and EBooks.

I'm not sure your list of what formats go to what devices/program is fully correct. There is also AZW3 with AZW6 inside for the graphics. I cannot say what situation those get delivered. But when you run them through the DRM removal plugin, you end up with a B&W cover and all the rest of the images are gone. So the best way to get Kindle eBooks (for now) is to use an older version K4PC (without the Bookerly font) or if you have a Kindle, download directly to the computer.

[darryl]

Originally Posted by JSWolf

So the best way to get Kindle eBooks (for now) is to use an older version K4PC (without the Bookerly font) or if you have a Kindle, download directly to the computer.

Thanks for pointing out this format (azw3 with azw6 graphics) which does indeed escape any mention in my list.

However, I have to disagree with your above quoted comment. Direct to Kindle will get you a kfx for ebooks supporting the new typesetting on PW2's and above. You may be correct in relation to K4PC, but why an older version and why no Bookerly font. These would not seem to be relevant. I would also suggest that these books with azw6 graphics are not so prevalent as to preclude downloading to computer for delivery via usb as a good option for most of us. If I wish to avoid a kfx download this is currently my favoured option.

[HarryT]

Originally Posted by darryl

However, I have to disagree with your above quoted comment. Direct to Kindle will get you a kfx for ebooks supporting the new typesetting on PW2's and above.

Jon was referring to the "Transfer via USB" facility, not to downloading directly to a Kindle. The latter will get you KFX (where available and supported), but the former will always get you Mobi/KF8.

[darryl]

Originally Posted by HarryT

Jon was referring to the "Transfer via USB" facility, not to downloading directly to a Kindle. The latter will get you KFX (where available and supported), but the former will always get you Mobi/KF8.

Thanks Harry. And sorry Jon. I misread this.

[cybmole]

i briefly had an azw6 library loan. it worked on both kindle voyage and kindle fire but refused to download to K for PC - format not supported error message.. that was before the most recent K for PC upgrade but I no longer have the loan to re-test with.

that was a for-kids Dr Seuss book - I think azw6 format is for comic/ fixed layout books only at present.

[darryl]

I have tested a direct download of a book with the new typography to a Kindle FIRE. The new typography is in fact displayed. Also, I could not find the actual ebook (usually a .prc) in the usual location. My presumption is that the download is a kfx though I am not sure where it is stored. Also, given the new typography is working on the Kindle Fire it can't be too far off on Kindle for Android, if it is not working already.