Samsung 'Papyrus' E Ink device announced

[wallcraft]

Originally Posted by dwhitta

I buy mostly from Fictionwise, but can only access .pdf or multiformat, which severely cuts down the choice. Most of the good books are only in the secure format, which is very frustrating.

If you have a Windows PC, then I agree with zelda_pinwheel that buying LIT is best, with the usual note that stripping DRM from ebooks is generally thought to be illegal in some countries (but it is hard to see who is hurt by doing this for personal use on ebooks you bought).

If you don't want to strip DRM, the other option is to buy from a store with a good selection of Secure Adobe ebooks. The two I recommend are Books on Board and WHSmiths.

[Sweetpea]

Originally Posted by wallcraft

If you have a Windows PC, then I agree with zelda_pinwheel that buying LIT is best, with the usual note that stripping DRM from ebooks is generally thought to be illegal in some countries (but it is hard to see who is hurt by doing this for personal use on ebooks you bought).

Is there actually a list of countries where this is legal (or illegal)? Or do I have to read all volumes of our law books to find out if it is legal or not?

[Xenophon]

Originally Posted by Sweetpea

Is there actually a list of countries where this is legal (or illegal)? Or do I have to read all volumes of our law books to find out if it is legal or not?

No list that I am aware of. I'll address the US situation below; YMMV in other countries.

Remember I am not a lawyer, nor do I play one on TV, so this is NOT legal advice! If you need real legal advice, pay a real lawyer. That said, I have taken a graduate seminar on digital IP issues and have heard eminent legal experts on speak on both sides of this question.

Here in the US, legal opinions differ as to the legality of stripping DRM. Eminent legal experts have lined up on both sides of that question*, but no court has yet ruled so nobody really knows. What is clear is that providing DRM-removal software to someone else is a federal felony, as is telling them where to get it or how to use it. Similarly, there's no question that removing DRM and then uploading the unprotected content to public websites (or otherwise sharing it) is a violation of both the DMCA and the copyright holder's rights. (Well, DUH!)

My take is that there should be no problem stripping DRM for personal use only. I even have formal advice of counsel to that effect -- which might protect me from punitive damages by showing a good-faith effort to remain legal, but is not worth any more than that for me (and is absolutely no legal use at all for anyone else).



Xenophon

* The difference arises because the DMCA both clearly states that removing DRM is illegal, and also that there are about a gazillion exceptions to that rule some of which (seem to) obviously cover personal fair use. Except that "obvious" to some legal experts is "dead wrong" to others. Which is why we wait for Congress or the courts to sort it all out.

[Sweetpea]

I think that's about the same for everybody. I think people who will remove DRM for personal use will never be sued, but don't you dare uploading it somewhere, or distribute it other ways...

While it might not be completely legal, nobody is hurt by it (as you already bought the book) so why make a fuss out of it? Once you distribute it, it can become hurtful, as the ones that will get the book the "cheap" way, won't be buying it, most likely. Though, they may still buy other books by the same author because they find out they like him/her.

[Andurian]

Ethically, I can't see anything wrong with stripping DRM on ebooks you own. Legally, it looks as though the books say you can't but there's good reason to think the courts will decide that fair use precedents nullify what's on the books. One of the problems with having the courts having the final say on legality is that sometimes you just can't know whether what you are doing is legal or not.

Legal and ethical issues aside, in a purely practical sense you're unlikely to get in trouble for stripping DRM off books, as there's no way for the authorities to know you do it. Even DLing books is relatively safe, as companies are really only concerned with uploaders and the cost/benefit isn't worth it to set up honeypots to catch DLers.

On the ethical side, if you *do* decide that DLing is ok if you own the paper copy, realize that bittorrent involves automatically uploading as you download. Which means that even if you think it isn't morally wrong to grab an electronic version of a book you own physically *but* think that its wrong to get books that you *don't* own, you probably should avoid bittorrent because you're likely to be helping others do something you consider wrong.

[ProDigit]

Here's my take on it:

Technically removing DRM could be as illegal as modifying copyrighted software, or using cracks on them.
Even if it is for personal use.
The awkward thing is, that one is not allowed to modify any copyrighted work of software one has purchased(unless noted in the software agreement, or agreed upon by the author), but one is able to for instance:
Buy a car, take it apart, or modify it.(build in a turbo, or spoilers,Pimp it!, etc...)

If you do it for personal purposes, no cop in the world will break into your house with and arrest you for it. I guess once they get nose of something like this via other people that gotten their books from someone, you could get into as much trouble as distributing illegal software (whether or you sell the de-DRM'ed ebooks or do it for free).

Like above,I'm no lawyer, but I think removing DRM in essence is illegal,as it can be seen as modifying copyrighted software. And an ebook is no software program, but it is software nonetheless.

In essence if you bought a DRM-ed mobi file, the file you bought is to be used only for those machines which read Mobi files (often limited to an amount of ebook readers per purchase). If you want an ebook to be displayed on a Sony reader, you'll need to buy an LRF formatted book.
reason,the hardware manufacturer pays money to these epub/mobi fileformats (unless they own the patent on them), as well as the publisher pays for the format he uses to convert books in.

This indeed brings up a lot of frustrations for users,and a 'one ebook version' would be greatly appreciated. But I don't see Sony putting their LRF file format in public domain or create an open version for it, for other manufacturers to use freely..
many manufacturers want a piece of the pie concerning their fileformat.

Perhaps the law is not yet defined as 'removing DRM is illegal or not', I don't know. But I think that it won't take very long before it gets there.

I think removing DRM could fall into the same "crime" category as 'downloading non-licenced movies', or 'jaywalking on an empty road'.

Not particular the ones the justice system will pursue.

[Sweetpea]

Originally Posted by ProDigit

I think removing DRM could fall into the same "crime" category as 'downloading non-licenced movies',

And there's the fun part... That is actually legal here...

[dwhitta]

Originally Posted by wallcraft

If you don't want to strip DRM, the other option is to buy from a store with a good selection of Secure Adobe ebooks. The two I recommend are Books on Board and WHSmiths.

The other problem is with Adobe - the formatting on the PRS-505 is less than desirable, albeit readable if you enjoy truncated words, sometimes one on a page.

[dwhitta]

Originally Posted by wallcraft

If you have a Windows PC, then I agree with zelda_pinwheel that buying LIT is best, with the usual note that stripping DRM from ebooks ....

Yes, I'd love to be able to do that - I have the software but I have no clue how to strip DRM with it (windows XP) - I am computer illiterate when it comes to writing code under the DOS prompt - tried it but can never make it work.

[astra]

Originally Posted by dwhitta

Yes, I'd love to be able to do that - I have the software but I have no clue how to strip DRM with it (windows XP) - I am computer illiterate when it comes to writing code under the DOS prompt - tried it but can never make it work.

Just have a close look around and you will find plenty of topics with, as close as it could get legally, step-by-step guides of how de-drm lit files.