Liaden fans, help me out

[artifact]

I don't see an official list including the short stories but since I just did a mega re-read here is an off the top of the head reading order. (Italics are the Constellation 3 stories.) Not listed are...

Code of Honor (Splinter Universe, 2014)
Eleutherious (Baen.com, 2013)
King of the Cats (SRM Publisher, Ltd., 2002 in The Cat's Job)
Roving Gambler (Splinter Universe, 2014)

Internal Chronology:

Crystal Soldier, Crystal Dragon, Moon's Honor, Space at Tinsori Light, Balance of Trade, Out of True, Trade Secret, Local Custom, Kin Ties, Scout’s Progress, Guaranteed Delivery, Mouse and Dragon, Intelligent Design, Conflict of Honors, Agent of Change, Carpe Diem, Plan B, Fledgling, I Dare, Saltation, Ghost Ship, Rifle's First Wife, Necessity’s Child*, Landed Alien, Dragon Ship*, Dragon in Exile*, Alliance of Equals*

*Portions of these novels occur simultaneously.

[bfisher]

Thanks for the chronology

[CRussel]

Just to be clear, most would suggest that chronological order is not necessarily the best way to read the Liaden Universe

[Xanthe]

I'm currently reading Constellation 3, after doing a re-read of the Theo cycle, the Jethri cycle, Necessity's Child, Conflict of Honors, Constellations 1 & 2, and Dragon In Exile. I'll probably re-read the rest as the summer progresses.

I really enjoyed Dragon in Exile. Didn't you all draw a breath of horror when that tourist said what he/she did to the Tree's branch? I know I did. Shows how invested I have become in that "vegetable" - lol. I also can't wait to see its "reaction" when Theo retuns home with the item from Cantra's ship.

It's going to be interesting to see what the dynamics are going to be with Daav and Kamele (who I've gained a lot of respect for as that story arc has progressed).

I'm glad they figured out an occupation for Kareen and are developing her character a bit more, rather than merely bringing her on as the disapproving elder. I think a short story is going to be needed regarding how Liaden society is functiong now that Kareen's encyclopedic knowledge and her reference library are gone from Liad.

Re the Delm "seeing" Theo. I thought that they had decided not to immediately do it, to keep her under the DOI radar while she carried out her Laughing Cat contract for Shan. Now that her relationship is known, though, they may "see” her when she returns. That's probably how she'll get out of trouble for not immediately responding to Val Con's summons home, I think.

[jgaiser]

Originally Posted by CRussel

Just to be clear, most would suggest that chronological order is not necessarily the best way to read the Liaden Universe

Yeah... I started with published order (Agent of Change, Conflict of Honors, Carpe Diem, Plan B, I Dare), then the two Crystal Books (which had a lot of AHA moments) and a few short stories. Worked just fine.

I've shied away from Local Custom and Scout's Progress because I perceived them to be more romance novels. But recently I decided on doing a more chronological reread and pick up some of the later novels I've missed and started and finished Local Custom this week. While it's definitely more romancey than later novels, I ended up really enjoying it. Scout's Progress is on my ereader and I'll try it next.

TL;DR. It's completely acceptable to read them out of chronological order

[Xanthe]

Local Custom was the first one I read, IIRC, simply because I'd seen a mention that the authors were fans of Georgette Heyer, whose books I love. I can definitely see her influence in the way Liaden society and manners are structured.

I think that Local Custom is a good intro to the series because it gives a nice sense of Liaden cultural attitudes, which makes the behaviors much more explicable in context. I think you get a better appreciation for its nuances, so that in later books when someone tries to play melan'ti tricks with Korval you can understand how egregious the behavior is.

[bfisher]

Yes, that was also my experience. For some reason, I read Local Custom and Scout's Progress first, which hooked me on the Liaden Universe. Then I read Crystal Soldier and Crystal Dragon, and then went to the mainline Agent of Change, etc.

[CRussel]

I'm currently doing a complete re-read (prompted by some of the stories in Constellation III), and I'm doing it in chronological order. But that is NOT how I would suggest a new reader come to the Liaden Universe. For one thing, some of the early references won't mean much and you'll lose the AHA moments that they give you when you read the Crystal books after having read some core books first.

jgaiser: I'm glad you're now reading Local Custom and Scout's Progress. They're excellent books, and set important timelines up. Plus, of course, Scout's Press is really an important pre-cursor book for Mouse and Dragon. Yes, they have some romance, but they're also just good Liaden books.

[artifact]

I can't find my local copies of Roving Gambler, and Code of Honor and I don't have the Cat's Job anthology. Could someone please give a blurb of what these were about?

(I don't have discretionary income right now, when I do I promise I'll buy Constellation 3 so Steve and Sharon get paid for their hard work.)

[CRussel]

Originally Posted by artifact

I can't find my local copies of Roving Gambler, and Code of Honor and I don't have the Cat's Job anthology. Could someone please give a blurb of what these were about?

(I don't have discretionary income right now, when I do I promise I'll buy Constellation 3 so Steve and Sharon get paid for their hard work.)

Code of Honor:

Spoiler:

This story exists because we were plotting a completely different story, and needed a character to . . . do something . . . for the main character. That secondary character came with an utterly fascinating back-story. So fascinating, in fact, that he got his own story, set in the aftermath of I Dare. And yes, we are still planning to write the story that spawned this one, so . . . watch the skies!

Roving Gambler

Spoiler:

At times we, as coauthors, talk about and know so much about what’s going on in the universe that we forget that we haven’t written it down. “Roving Gambler” came from that abundance of information—dealing with story stuff that we knew but hadn’t quite managed to get into a novel or another short story yet. We have a lot of characters, and they are all involved—even if we haven’t had time to write them in. So here’s a story featuring Quin—we knew that Quin was isolated, we knew that the arrival of Korval on Surebleak was not going to be easy on the clan and on Pat Rin. Something, of course, was going to have to happen. “Roving Gambler” helps get Quin happening.

And King of the Cats is an old, old one. Not really canon. But the blurb for it:

Spoiler:

In 1985, when this story was written, our joint writing career consisted of two published stories about Kinzel, an inept wizard who improbably held a Staff of True Power, and a science fiction novel entitled Agent of Change, which was making the rounds. At that time, Steve made part of our living by running weekend chess tournaments. So it was that Sharon was left alone one weekend, with only a typewriter and a ream of paper for company. The result of these circumstances was a non-canon story that mixed two universes with nothing in common, save a belief in Balance.

[Xanthe]

I enjoyed Constellation III; I re-read Constellation I & II before it. Every time I read those Moonhawk and Lute short stories, though, I get the urge to re-read the Crystal books just to try to figure out exactly the relationship between Moonhawk, Lute, Rool Tiazan & his Lady, Clan Erob, the red-headed gambler, Shan, the dramliz, the Crystalization, what the Uncle is trying to accomplish, etc.

-----

I have to say that I am fascinated to see what's going to happen with Daav and Aelliana (sp?) once they get back to Surebleak (assuming they do). Also, how will the Tree re-engineer Yulie Shaper?

Thinking about the former seedpod that Theo will be bringing back, what information will it have regarding what happened to the former universe, and can it transmit it?

[CRussel]

I re-read Constellation I & II after reading Constellation III. Enjoyed all three. But what I want to find out is what happens to Win Ton. (Though I do admit to a great deal of curiosity about Aelliana as well.)

[Xanthe]

I'm getting the feeling that the authors aren't as invested in Win Ton as they were when he first appeared in the series.

Spoiler:

Theo's girl friend seems to have become her girlfriend, and her attraction to Win Ton seems to have waned. He'll probably be palmed off to Surebleak, since it seems he physically can't do the Scout job at the present time.

Do we know if the guy who was the head of the Pilot's Guild on the Eyelot orbital is going to be the person assigned to head up Surebleak's chapter of the Pilot's Guild? Since he's at loose ends and they need someone.

I wonder why Shan is going to build the yos'Galan homestead on an island? After all, it's just the two of them, unless Priscilla gets pregnant. It wouldn't be convenient for either Nova or Anthora to be based out of there, it would seem.

[CRussel]

I'm not so sanguine about the "retirement" of Win Ton. I think this will yield itself to a more complete solution at some point in the process (perhaps a Clutch healing?)

Spoiler:

And while Tara is certainly Theo's current bed mate, there's never been any indication that she is other than ambidextrous. And both Kara and she have, ultimately, an obligation to their clan. No, I don't see Kara being a replacement to Win Ton - more on the order of a supplement.

On the SureBleak chapter of the Pilot's Guild? That's a reasonable guess. Not something I've thought about much, but definitely something that will need sorting.

On the new homestead? No idea why, except possibly defensibility? Or climate?

[pdurrant]

I put spoiler tags on Xanthe's post, because I thought it was probably an isolated incident. But now CRussel is also making spoiler-ish comments.

If people want to discuss current plot points in this thread, I'll just unsubscribe and not worry about it. Or do people think spoiler tags should be used here?