Harry Potter and Christian Theme - SPOILERS

[EatingPie]

*** HERE BE SPOILERS!! ***

This post contains major spoilers for Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows, as well as other books in the series... This will wreck the movies too, if you haven't read the series are waiting on the conclusion films this November/June.

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For the past 10 years, the Harry Potter series has been vocally maligned by major Evangelical Christian figures, and many Churches (mine included) took up the "cause" against this series. I actually chose to read the series for this reason, wondering if there was really anything there. And there was something there all right: In The Deathly Hallows, Harry Potter became a Christ figure. And we finally learn that Christian imagery has been a part of the series from the very beginning.

A major theology of Christianity is that Christ made a loving, substitionary (he substituted himself for all humans) sacrifice that brings salvation to humanity, and his blood is one of the primary symbols of this salvation-bringing sacrifice. While we see a variety of these qualities throughout the centuries in historical heroic figures and mythology, it is the inclusion of all these aspects that is particularly Christian.

In The Deathly Hallows Harry's actions allude to these aspects of Christ.

- Harry makes a loving, substitutionary sacrifice.

In order to save the lives of those he loves, Harry chooses to die at Voldemort's hand.

- Harry experiences a pseudo-death/resurrection.

Voldemort kills Harry with the Aveda Kedavera curse. However, due to the complexities of the situation, we cannot positively determine if Harry really died, or if he just experienced a death-like state. That's why I refer to it as a "pseudo-death."

- Harry's sacrifice imbues protection upon those he loves.

After Harry returns to life, Voldemort loses the majority of his power over the people of Hogwarts. Voldemort, the most powerful wizard in history, carrying the most powerful wand in history, cannot cast a lasting spell on those at Hogwarts.

- The blood is the vehicle of this protection (implied, reference to Lily).

This is not directly stated, but implied by the association between the Lily and Harry. Harry has Lily's blood in him, and the first magical protection, one sourced purely love, is "carried" in the blood.

- Harry offers "salvation" to most evil personality in his history.

Harry attempts to show mercy to Voldemort three times, asking him to show "remorse" twice. This is equivalent to the Christian concept of repentance.

It's also not like we suddenly have this Christian thing dumped on us in the final chapters of a seven book series. The final moments of Lily Potter are revealed slowly and piecewise throughout the series. And Harry is his mother's son!

- Lily makes a loving, substitutionary sacrifice for Harry.
- Lily's loving sacrifice imbues protection upon Harry.
- The blood is the vehicle of this protection.

Please note that this is just an overview. I posted extensively in the "Christianity and Harry Potter" thread on The Leaky Cauldron web site, so I can flesh this out much more thoroughly, with textual citations, if need be.

-Pie

[wodin]

Both my wife and I having read the entire series avidly, and watched all the films produced so far multiple times, I have to say that I think your allegories are a bit of a stretch.

[nekokami]

I don't think the allegories are much of a stretch, but I don't think they are the only way the stories can be interpreted, either. Christian traditions are a basis for a lot of Western culture, which is where J.K. Rowling grew up, so it's not too surprising that there are elements like this in her stories -- or lots of other stories, for that matter.

A number of years ago I wrote an analysis of the Harry Potter books in terms of the Ten Commandments. Harry and friends come out pretty well in that light. I know there's a reflexive tendency to stigmatize the books because they are about "witches," but 1) there's some disagreement about the translation of the word in that commandment, as some sources claim it should be "poisoner," and 2) witches and wizards in Rowling's books are not involved with the supernatural-- magic in the Harry Potter universe doesn't involve calling upon demons or spirits. It is, rather, a fictional technology that requires skill and inborn talent to master. It would appear that some of the actions of "dark wizards" such as Voldemort are exceptions, but they are regarded as villains.

As a reminder, the only references to religion at all in the Harry Potter books are references to the characters celebrating the two most significant holidays in Christianity: Christmas and Easter.

[mrscoach]

You read the series because your church was critical of it. I started the series because of all the good things I heard about it in church. There was never an official stance, but in sitting around at fellowship meals I heard people discussing the series. One was a school teacher that taught the book in class.

There was never any "magic is evil" talk about the book. On the contrary, they discussed how it was a book of good vs evil, using mythology that a lot of children were already interested in. They even discussed how they thought it was silly how other churches condemned what they had obviously not read.

I see your thoughts, but I don't see Harry set up as a christ figure. He didn't substitute himself for others, he just decided to take Moldyshorts out with him. By your reasoning, anyone who did a good deed at their own detriment would be a christ figure.

[ardeegee]

There are only so many types of stories (but people can't seem to agree on how many.) And only so many types of characters.

[kindlekitten]

I can't believe you started this thread and don't forsee a good future for it.

anyway, any one of your supposed christian themes you have espoused can be found in Zoroastrism, Greek, Roman, Celtic, Egyptian, even Hopi (as well as several other 1st Nations traditions). the over riding message I got from any of it was that LOVE was the most important part of magic. and that same LOVE can be shared by any of the traditions I just listed above.

after your last post about the Potter books being "christian" I went to the Rowling pages where, guess what???? she has absolutely ZIP as in ZERO as in NADA to say about christianity or how it has influenced her life.

please stop now before it gets ugly

[ardeegee]

Originally Posted by kindlekitten

after your last post about the Potter books being "christian" I went to the Rowling pages where, guess what???? she has absolutely ZIP as in ZERO as in NADA to say about christianity or how it has influenced her life.

But she did say that Dumbledore was gay. (Which inspired this Onion gem.)

[Elfwreck]

Originally Posted by EatingPie

In The Deathly Hallows, Harry Potter became a Christ figure.

No, he became a self-sacrificing hero. Christ is not the only one of those.

And we finally learn that Christian imagery has been a part of the series from the very beginning.

JKR grew up in a culture steeped in Christian imagery; it finds its way into pretty much everything that doesn't take specific efforts to avoid it.

A major theology of Christianity is that Christ made a loving, substitionary (he substituted himself for all humans) sacrifice that brings salvation to humanity, and his blood is one of the primary symbols of this salvation-bringing sacrifice.

Another major theology of Christianity is that the reason this was effective, and other people's willing self-sacrifice would not be, is that he was divine. Was Lily Potter actually impregnated by a deity, not James Potter?

- Harry makes a loving, substitutionary sacrifice.
In order to save the lives of those he loves, Harry chooses to die at Voldemort's hand.

Dumbledore chose to die at Snape's hand, for Voldemort's purposes. What makes his sacrifice less effective? Christ died at the hands of the Roman army, not any supernatural entity.

- Harry offers "salvation" to most evil personality in his history.
Harry attempts to show mercy to Voldemort three times, asking him to show "remorse" twice. This is equivalent to the Christian concept of repentance.

When did Christ offer the opportunity for repentance to his killers?

- Lily makes a loving, substitutionary sacrifice for Harry.
- Lily's loving sacrifice imbues protection upon Harry.
- The blood is the vehicle of this protection.

Lily, of course, is the first mother in the history of wizardkind to willingly die for her child. Riiiight.

There are some similarities. There are also plenty of differences, and similarities to other dying/reborn hero myths.

Anyway, if the Harry Potter books are actually Christian allegories, what does that mean? That they become acceptable for Christian children, and as a non-Christian parent, I should discourage my kids from reading them or seeing the movies?

[neilmarr]

What a fascinating post, Pie. I do not believe as you do (I am a devout infidel) but it's refreshing to read the point of view of people of faith as open-minded as you are. A little more understanding, a little more profound analysis of our reading and our neighbours can only do the world -- and those earth-bound fellow mortals who live on the planet -- good. Thanks. Neil

[happy_terd]

Why did Dumbledore have to die???

[ShortNCuddlyAm]

At least he didn't do a Gandalf and resurrect himself a bit later on...

(Now where did Tolkein get that idea(*), I wonder... )


(* Yes, I know there are plenty of options )

[EatingPie]

Originally Posted by mrscoach

I see your thoughts, but I don't see Harry set up as a christ figure. He didn't substitute himself for others, he just decided to take Moldyshorts out with him. By your reasoning, anyone who did a good deed at their own detriment would be a christ figure.

Indeed, I agree. Joseph Campbell examines this phenomenon in Hero with a Thousand Faces. However, the allusions between Harry Potter and Christ do not start and end with his sacrifice. If that was all there was to it, I wouldn't have started this discussion!

Originally Posted by kindlekitten

I can't believe you started this thread and don't forsee a good future for it.

Well, you asked why I saw HP as a Christian-theme book.

And I'm certainly am not going to stifle my ideas just because of the potential for a heated debate. Besides, this is a totally relevant thread to mobileread.

anyway, any one of your supposed christian themes you have espoused can be found in Zoroastrism, Greek, Roman, Celtic, Egyptian, even Hopi (as well as several other 1st Nations traditions). the over riding message I got from any of it was that LOVE was the most important part of magic. and that same LOVE can be shared by any of the traditions I just listed above.

You are correct in that many of these can be seen in various mythologies or heroic epics. However, it's the number of them tied together that points toward Christ in particular.

after your last post about the Potter books being "christian" I went to the Rowling pages where, guess what???? she has absolutely ZIP as in ZERO as in NADA to say about christianity or how it has influenced her life.

To me, this matters very little, if at all. An atheist can write a story with a Christ figure. If you do further research, Rowling has made specific statements about her beliefs, even if it does not appear on her site directly.

But, generally, I prefer to discuss the work rather than the author, so I seldom reference the author's stated beliefs in a literary discussion.

please stop now before it gets ugly

Well, I have always gone out of my way to keep things from getting ugly on my end, and I certainly hope that won't happen here.

-Pie

[EatingPie]

A Christ figure is an allusion, not a 1-for-1 duplicate of Christ. A few of Elfwreck's points attempt to debunk the idea of a Christ figure because Harry does not do a certain thing that Christ did. There's no hard-and-fast rule for defining a Christ figure, but you don't need a 100% alignment. That's why it's called an "allusion" and not, say, an "allegory."

Dumbledore chose to die at Snape's hand, for Voldemort's purposes. What makes his sacrifice less effective? Christ died at the hands of the Roman army, not any supernatural entity.

What magical consequences were there from Dumbledore's sacrifice? Harry's sacrifice had a direct, magical consequence of protecting those he loved. Lily's was similar, and the "vehicle" of her magical protection was her blood.

When did Christ offer the opportunity for repentance to his killers?

Christ offers repentance to everyone. He did not make a vocal offer to those who killed him (beside "Father forgive them for they know not what they do"), at least not that's recorded in the Bible. However, his sacrifice covers even them. Harry specifically asks Voldemort to feel remorse, and in Christian theology, this is pretty much the first step to salvation.

Lily, of course, is the first mother in the history of wizardkind to willingly die for her child. Riiiight.

It seems that she was the first whose loving, substitionary (Lilly's last words are, "Not Harry, please no, take me, kill me instead---") sacrifice directly resulted in a magical protection for her child. As Dumbledore says:

"You would be protected by an ancient magic...I am speaking, of course, of the fact that your mother died to save you. She gave you a lingering protection...a protection that flows in your veins to this day."

And you can also the direct reference to blood here as well.

Anyway, if the Harry Potter books are actually Christian allegories, what does that mean? That they become acceptable for Christian children, and as a non-Christian parent, I should discourage my kids from reading them or seeing the movies?

Another important point. I have not, nor ever will, claim that Harry Potter is a Christian allegory. Harry Potter contains an allusion to Christ. He is a Christ Figure (to some extent, so is Lilly), but this does not mean it's a retelling of the story Christ in magical form.

Nor have I claimed -- or ever will -- that Harry Potter containing Christian imagery somehow legitimizes the work for Christians. Just as I would not claim that His Dark Materials is somehow illegitimate due to its themes. Books are books, ideas are ideas. We should not fear books or ideas, no matter where our particular ideology lies. We can discuss them and agree or disagree with them, certainly. But we shouldn't claim that only those ideas that align with our beliefs are "acceptable."

-Pie

[astra]

I am not even subscribing to this silly topic.

[ShortNCuddlyAm]

Originally Posted by nekokami

As a reminder, the only references to religion at all in the Harry Potter books are references to the characters celebrating the two most significant holidays in Christianity: Christmas and Easter.

Personally, I wouldn't give that any weight, as they are also when two of the three long breaks between terms in UK schools are (the other, and longest, being the summer break between years), and many people celebrate them even if they don't believe in Christianity.