Reading Annotations on a computer

[DarkTrick]

I'd like to replace paper books with e-books from now on. In order to do that I neeed a software- and hardware solution that satisfies the following points:

1. I'd like to make annotation (selections / notes) with an e-reader in PDF files and ebook files (azw3, if possible, mobi also ok; I'm happy to be surprised with a better format) .
2. I'd like to read the book and the annotations on a computer with an open source software.
   Presentation style like on the Kindle (selections inline, annotation opens on click) would be ok; Annotations inline (as in a real book) would also be ok.
3. (optional) Exporting all annotations with a little bit of surrounding text would be a very nice feature
4. (optional) If I could edit annotations on the computer and re-share with the eReader, awesome.

Is there any working solution that fulfills those points (hardware + software).


Currently...

I'm owning a owning Kindle Paperwhite 2013, so I tried the following with Callibre, but it didn't work out for me:
https://www.mobileread.com/forums/sh...ad.php?t=76069
Reason: There are no mpb or tan files on my Kindle
It also seems, that Calibre cannot handle PDF annotations + Annotation of e-book formats are apparently not viewable with the text.

*edit*:
Very nice would be, if annotations would be shown in Calibre the same way comments in Calibre are shown ( https://imgur.com/a/rxFp3Qm ).


Regards
DarkTrick

[Quoth]

I switched from Kindle to Kobo. The Kindle is too restrictive. I've saved over €600 in paper and toner doing proofing on an ereader:

1. Edit in odt 'cos it's LO Writer, used Word from 2000 till 2015. Before that a Wordstar Clone.
2. Extra Save As in docx
3. Convert to epub (no CSS or HTML edits) in Calibre
4. Proof read / annotate on Kobo
5. Copy back annotations + highlight per book using Kobo Utilities in Calibre.
6. Copy paste originally into Notepad++ and edit new version in LO Writer (Changed to KATE on Linux in 2017)
7. Repeat 1 to 5
8. Final version edit CSS of any images.
9. Make new LO copy with desired paper size, fonts etc in styles, headers, footers etc. with layout changed to two page (a 4K or 2K screen needed)
10. Export PDF for POD
11. check on screen or on Elipsa, maybe both. Only fix any format for paper errors, any other errors go to stage 6. Never edit content of odt for PDF. Can copy/paste changed bits from epub version to odt version of PDF.
12. Repeat 10 till 11 is OK
13. If any new styles used test on Kindles, Apps and Kobos. 4.3" to 10" screens.
14. Do ebook cover for separate upload and define all metadata, write blurbs etc
15. Upload epub to Amazon, Google and Smashwords. Upload dual mobi to Smashwords. Download and check before release date
16. Upload various PDFs to Amazon, Direct2Digital, Lulu, 24bookprint etc as desired.
17. Based on POD service acceptance of interior, do the wrap cover and upload.
18. Order proof print and check before release.

There is other stuff. But Kobo gives the best integration with Calibre. If a Kobo FW upgrade is annoying you can go back. You can't with Kindle.

Kindles are for casual reading and integration to Amazon.
Mobi is ancient and limited.
AZW3/KF8 is hardly more than a wrapper with Amazon DRM to epub. Amazon works best with epub for KDP (publishing) or "Send to Kindle"

You can buy Amazon ebooks and read them on the Kobo. Amazon collections can't be managed on Calibre. Amazon series is erratic. Amazon messes with covers. Calibre allows perfect control of Covers, metadata, blurb, Title, author, collection and series on a Kobo.
I still have 3 models of Kindle. I've tested 3 or 4 other Kindles. I only use the DXG, KK3 and PW3 now to test.

The GUI / finding books is superior on Kobo to Kindle according to wife and grandchildren.

PDFs may need a 10" or 12" tablet or a Kobo Elipsa (10.3"). The Libra2 is best for reading epub and long battery life. The Sage is larger and not so good battery, but OK. Both have page turn buttons.

[DarkTrick]

Thank you for the very exhaustive answer!!

I think we had a little misunderstanding.
I don't intend to publish documents. I'd like to read, make annotation as I would in a book and like to be able to review my annotation on the computer.

However, you still provided usable information!

1) Do you have a screenshot on how annotations made on a Kobo reader are presented in callibre?

2) Does Kobo use an open format for their comments?

3)
> PDFs may need a 10" or 12" tablet or a Kobo Elipsa (10.3")

Why is that?

Regards
DarkTrick

[DNSB]

Originally Posted by DarkTrick

3) PDFs may need a 10" or 12" tablet or a Kobo Elipsa (10.3")

Why is that?

PDF is a page replica display. Most PDF files are intended for a 8.5x11 or A4 page size. Unless you truly enjoy either panning to see the page or viewing the full page with a flyspeck 6 font size, the larger displays simply make it easier to see the full page with a readable font size. Some devices are capable of reflowing text based PDFs but that is almost useless with most documents where it totally destroys the formatting. Then you run into image based PDFs where the page being viewed is an image though quite a few of those will have a poorly OCRed text layer to allow searching.

[Quoth]

Originally Posted by DarkTrick

1) Do you have a screenshot on how annotations made on a Kobo reader are presented in callibre?

2) Does Kobo use an open format for their comments?

1) No need. It's either plain text with a button to copy to clipboard (Kobo Utilities), or plain text copied from Kobo if exported (see below, Calibre not needed) or HTML in a column row in the Calibre database (Annotations plugin).

2) The Database (unlike Kindle) is accessible. So various utilities and plugins can read it. Each item has highlighted text, place in ebook or chapter and the notes in plain text you added. ALSO there is a configuration option to add to the book context menu "Export Annotations" which creates a plain text file.

I knew you were only interested in annotating your own reading, but if Kobo + Calibre supports PC workflow without paper for writing-proof-annotate-edit-publish it certainly does what you want.

It's rare that old scanned books, datasheets, old magazines and textbooks in PDF are any use on less than 10". Some small format pocket sized manuals in PDF will work on 7" or 8".

[DarkTrick]

Thank you for the answers!

So the PDF thing is not technical, but practical. I thought we're talking "too slow" or "not able to write notes" or something like that.

[DarkTrick]

From this other question of mine I figures, that Kobo annotations have to be in/exported and will not integrate into the calibre interface.

Is there any other reader, that produces notes in a format that calibre would show in this (link) style?

[DNSB]

Originally Posted by DarkTrick

From this other question of mine I figures, that Kobo annotations have to be in/exported and will not integrate into the calibre interface.

Is there any other reader, that produces notes in a format that calibre would show in this (link) style?

Not that I know of. There is no standard for annotations so basically everyone has done their own thing.

[Renate]

Wow, @Quoth , your 18 steps make me tired!
In steps 1-5 you are using unformatted text?

Do you use a stylus or a mouse for text selection?
I hate selecting text with my finger.

Fo my very minimal needs on my own reader software I just have a gesture to copy the complete text of the current screen to clipboard. I can paste it into a notepad and chop it down, annotate it.

[Quoth]

No. The first draft is properly styled. There might be plain text fragments before that at the start. The Body styling is automatic from template. Click on Chapter, Preamble Title, Preamble text, scene break, list, letter, caption etc. in the small list window of styles outside main WP window. Only menu and vertical scroll bar in the WP window. First Paragraph style is usually automatic and next paragraph usually automatic default body.

Hence no desire to edit css/html on the 8 to 40 revisions.

No stylus, that's rubbish for annotation (apart from only on Sage & Elipsa), I make font a bit bigger than many would use to read normally and good line spacing and thus highlight with finger is easy. I also have two and three letter codes to save typing on the touch keyboard:
Np : put a new paragraph here instead of just new sentence.
Jp : Join the paragraphs. Just new sentence
*** : insert scene break
Ch : insert new Chapter
Cut: Delete entire paragraph(s).
Del <some text> Delete only part of highlight

Always highlight at least a phrase as a couple of words might be in a Chapter a few times.

I press > arrow to cancel automatic first character is capitalised. It's not a phone! Why isn't there an option to kill auto caps?

On desktop I use a mix of keyboard & mouse, depending on what is happening. Touch or Stylus on a desktop/laptop is a disaster, except maybe for artistic sketching. I've had a Wacom tablet since maybe 1994. I gave away a Win Tablet as garbage compared to Netbook for content creation or Android for apps/browsing.

I do have a Lenovo X201 convertible semi-netboook-laptop which has touch and Wacom. It had win7 and now has Linux Mint 20.1, but I'd hardly use the touch or stylus.

The Stylus on the Sage Advanced notebook is great for notes at random times (esp at night) and reasonable for conversion to text or it would be useless later, poorer than paper notebook.
Don't use Stylus on Elipsa except for on page notes not exported on PDF manuals. Good for PDF now that there is PDF zoom lock. Sage is on older 4.32 because only one so far good for Advanced Notebooks.

I've worn out keyboards on laptops just from typing!

[Renate]

Originally Posted by Quoth

I've worn out keyboards on laptops just from typing!

Ha, ha. I'm glad that I'm a coder where 10 WPM is quite sufficient!
OTOH, there seem to be a bunch of keys on my keyboard that have the letters rubbed off...

You can't go directly form .odt to .epub?

I had a nice Wacom tablet that somebody threw in the garbage because the cord was getting wacky. I fixed that but never really utilized it. I gave it to a friend who probably uses it less than I would.

Yeah, my only use for annotation is errata on Gutenberg.

[Quoth]

Originally Posted by Renate

Ha, ha. I'm glad that I'm a coder where 10 WPM is quite sufficient!
OTOH, there seem to be a bunch of keys on my keyboard that have the letters rubbed off...

White correction pen or black marker works till either the hinge is worn out or cap worn through. I keep broken laptop keyboards for spare parts. One from someone else's same model had pristine caps and hinges because it was replaced due to a glass of sherry poured in. At least the MoBo was OK

I used to program. Proof read and edit a 120K novel is faster than most programming that has only 12 K words. Especially if you want a working program. I doubt I was anywhere near 10 wpm average in a day.

Originally Posted by Renate

You can't go directly form .odt to .epub?

There was/is a plugin for LO Writer and later versions have epub export built in. Calibre also can import odt. Sadly none of it very good. The LO Writer paragraph styles, heading levels, padding , margins, box, links etc all perfect conversion if you Save As docx and import Docx to Calibre. Only needs some tweaks on some images CSS on final version.

You can Open docx in Writer and Save As in docx, but those are conversions. Edit & master copy only in odt. I've proved it with docx plugin/upgrade on Word XP, Word 2003 and Word 2007. A Save As from Writer to docx is fine opened in Word or imported to Calibre, but if you open a doc or docx in LO Writer it may look OK, but it's a conversion. You get extra anonymous heading, paragraph and page styles and need to check every heading, anchor, link, and style.

So only edit in odt and do an EXTRA Save As in docx for Calibre. Anyone outside only gets PDF or epub except for Smashwords who get a Dual Mobi because they can't know what sort of Kindle their direct customers have. All the distribution by Smashwords is epub. Years ago I started loosing page break before chapters in Mobi downloaded from Amazon (I was uploading doc, then docx over the years) and they said to send them the same epub I send Smashwords and Google. Test purchases of mobi, azw3 and kfx have been perfect. No point in downloading Amazon preview when doing KDP as it's really just an epub! Unless you are uploading docx. But uploading epub works best.