Overview of features supported by ebook readers?

what · 03-15-2021, 03:57 AM

Is there some overview like https://caniuse.com/ that shows which ebook reader supports which formats and features?

JSWolf · 03-15-2021, 08:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by what

Is there some overview like https://caniuse.com/ that shows which ebook reader supports which formats and features?

If such a list was made, it would need to be changed quite often as things change with new firmware updates. Plus, it's not an easy list to make as you would need to know of all the different Readers from all the different companies and all the features each device has with the latest firmware for that device. It's (IMHO) a huge task that I cannot see ever happening.

The best solution is to list what features you want/need and you can then get recommendations based on your list.

Quoth · 03-15-2021, 09:33 AM

Also don't try to be clever. Don't try to duplicate fancy paper editions.

Basically there are two groups of eink:
Old Mobi, like Kindle Keyboard 2, DX, DGX and earlier or a Kindle Keybord 3 that didn't get updated.
Kindles that work with KF8 / azw3 will mostly do the same as older epub2 ereaders or older Adobe Digital Editions. It's when you get fancy with images other than placed as a character, or SMALL CAPS or non-RomanLatin fonts (Scandinavian & other European accents and some modern Greek is OK but Cyrillic might not), or Right to Left etc, then you need to test targets. Tables are an issue partly due to width.

Embedding Fonts can help, but doesn't work for Old Mobi.

Avoid features that need KFX, kepub or epub3. The so called Advanced Typesetting of KFX and kepub is done automatically by Amazon and Kobo. An ordinary epub2 is uploaded.

Amazon can use epub2 to create all their formats, but old mobi only devices will get a reduced feature version. Amazon crafts their download according to the target eInk, Fire, App or program and OS.

If you can't do what you want with a basic reflowable epub2, that is OK on a 4" to 17" screen, then either make a PDF for 10" and larger tablets or an App for iOS and Android. The epub3 spec tries to do the features of multimedia, HTML5 and a PDF, but support is poor and only a subset on some epub based eink. If you need epub3, seriously look at PDF or an app.

KevinH · 03-15-2021, 01:24 PM

No, standard reflowable epub3 that is backwards compatible with guide/ncx will convert and work just fine even for older Kindles. The kindlepreviewer and kindlegen toolchain supports epub3 well and has for quite a while now.

Quoth · 03-16-2021, 09:33 AM

It's still pointless compared to epub2. If you REALLY need the features of epub3 then it WON'T fall back gracefully and it gives NOTHING extra on old Kindle and little to nothing extra on new eink Kindles.

Epub3 is a half baked idea for multimedia. The epub2 is for reading fiction books.

KevinH · 03-16-2021, 02:29 PM

You could not be more wrong. Epub3 even without javascript, without media overlays, without video and audio, still allows for improved semantic tagging and better Accessibility markup to help those visually impaired or needing screen readers, allows better international support for rtl and vertical languages. It simply makes for a much improved epub.

Given you can use an epub3 to source for kindlegen and have been able to for years, and given you can make simple fiction based epub3s that are backwards compatible for old epub2 only readers, why on earth would anyone want to create epub2s as source for anything anymore?

Your advice was simply outdated.

JSWolf · 03-16-2021, 06:46 PM

But the one problem though is you cannot use some features of ePub3 because they won't work in ePub 2.

KevinH · 03-17-2021, 11:06 AM

Yes, but it is a better source format for future-proofing and future conversion of your material than epub2 is.

Quote:

Originally Posted by JSWolf

But the one problem though is you cannot use some features of ePub3 because they won't work in ePub 2.

Quoth · 03-17-2021, 11:13 AM

The wordprocessor file is the source. The epub2, epub3, PDF etc are simply target distribution formats. Not source.

KevinH · 03-17-2021, 11:59 AM

KDP now recommends epub over mobi for submissions so it can easily be a source format, but as you said Word is probably best for the actual writing.

hobnail · 03-17-2021, 12:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KevinH

You could not be more wrong. Epub3 even without javascript, without media overlays, without video and audio, still allows for improved semantic tagging and better Accessibility markup to help those visually impaired or needing screen readers, allows better international support for rtl and vertical languages. It simply makes for a much improved epub.

I'm glad to hear someone say this; we keep hearing people say that epub3 "doesn't work" with the current ereaders. Whenever I redo a book from PG I always start with a blank epub3. The only epub3 stuff that I may use is some of the newer html tags but even that is minimal. So the html and css is mainly epub2 but the container is epub3. The metadata is epub3 probably; I'm using Sigil.

fbrzvnrnd · 03-17-2021, 03:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Quoth

The wordprocessor file is the source. The epub2, epub3, PDF etc are simply target distribution formats. Not source.

Wordprocessor? Ok boomer

JSWolf · 03-17-2021, 03:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Quoth

The wordprocessor file is the source. The epub2, epub3, PDF etc are simply target distribution formats. Not source.

But once the ePub eBook is created, it makes a much better source format then the word processing file.

JSWolf · 03-17-2021, 03:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hobnail

I'm glad to hear someone say this; we keep hearing people say that epub3 "doesn't work" with the current ereaders. Whenever I redo a book from PG I always start with a blank epub3. The only epub3 stuff that I may use is some of the newer html tags but even that is minimal. So the html and css is mainly epub2 but the container is epub3. The metadata is epub3 probably; I'm using Sigil.

It's not that ePub3 doesn't work with current Readers. It's that some features do not work in a lot of cases with older software, older Readers, a lot of Android reading software, etc. So you just have to be careful how you code the ePub3 and you have to know what your audience is. You can make a simple ePub3 with accessibility that will work in most cases.

KevinH · 03-17-2021, 04:08 PM

Old readers will eventually die out, as my Sony e-reader can attest and my old Mobi reader. And bad/old app software can be replaced. There are numerous EPUB3 reading apps out there: Readium variants, Books, Kobo apps, Bluefire Reader, ADE, etc for ios, android, windows, mac, and linux (and not to mention calibre's nice new ereader).

Recommending EPUB2 over EPUB3 just to support old dedicated e-readers that are rapidly dying out is probably not a good choice when new devices and apps support both.

The days of no good free epub3 readers is long gone.

03-15-2021, 03:57 AM	#1
what Enthusiast Posts: 28 Karma: 10 Join Date: Mar 2021 Device: none	Overview of features supported by ebook readers? Is there some overview like https://caniuse.com/ that shows which ebook reader supports which formats and features?

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03-15-2021, 09:33 AM	#3
Quoth Still reading Posts: 13,968 Karma: 103895653 Join Date: Jun 2017 Location: Ireland Device: All 4 Kinds: epub eink, Kindle, android eink, NxtPaper	Also don't try to be clever. Don't try to duplicate fancy paper editions. Basically there are two groups of eink: Old Mobi, like Kindle Keyboard 2, DX, DGX and earlier or a Kindle Keybord 3 that didn't get updated. Kindles that work with KF8 / azw3 will mostly do the same as older epub2 ereaders or older Adobe Digital Editions. It's when you get fancy with images other than placed as a character, or SMALL CAPS or non-RomanLatin fonts (Scandinavian & other European accents and some modern Greek is OK but Cyrillic might not), or Right to Left etc, then you need to test targets. Tables are an issue partly due to width. Embedding Fonts can help, but doesn't work for Old Mobi. Avoid features that need KFX, kepub or epub3. The so called Advanced Typesetting of KFX and kepub is done automatically by Amazon and Kobo. An ordinary epub2 is uploaded. Amazon can use epub2 to create all their formats, but old mobi only devices will get a reduced feature version. Amazon crafts their download according to the target eInk, Fire, App or program and OS. If you can't do what you want with a basic reflowable epub2, that is OK on a 4" to 17" screen, then either make a PDF for 10" and larger tablets or an App for iOS and Android. The epub3 spec tries to do the features of multimedia, HTML5 and a PDF, but support is poor and only a subset on some epub based eink. If you need epub3, seriously look at PDF or an app.

03-15-2021, 01:24 PM	#4
KevinH Sigil Developer Posts: 8,748 Karma: 5706256 Join Date: Nov 2009 Device: many	No, standard reflowable epub3 that is backwards compatible with guide/ncx will convert and work just fine even for older Kindles. The kindlepreviewer and kindlegen toolchain supports epub3 well and has for quite a while now.

03-16-2021, 09:33 AM	#5
Quoth Still reading Posts: 13,968 Karma: 103895653 Join Date: Jun 2017 Location: Ireland Device: All 4 Kinds: epub eink, Kindle, android eink, NxtPaper	It's still pointless compared to epub2. If you REALLY need the features of epub3 then it WON'T fall back gracefully and it gives NOTHING extra on old Kindle and little to nothing extra on new eink Kindles. Epub3 is a half baked idea for multimedia. The epub2 is for reading fiction books.

03-16-2021, 02:29 PM	#6
KevinH Sigil Developer Posts: 8,748 Karma: 5706256 Join Date: Nov 2009 Device: many	You could not be more wrong. Epub3 even without javascript, without media overlays, without video and audio, still allows for improved semantic tagging and better Accessibility markup to help those visually impaired or needing screen readers, allows better international support for rtl and vertical languages. It simply makes for a much improved epub. Given you can use an epub3 to source for kindlegen and have been able to for years, and given you can make simple fiction based epub3s that are backwards compatible for old epub2 only readers, why on earth would anyone want to create epub2s as source for anything anymore? Your advice was simply outdated.

03-16-2021, 06:46 PM	#7
JSWolf Resident Curmudgeon Posts: 79,687 Karma: 145864619 Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Roslindale, Massachusetts Device: Kobo Libra 2, Kobo Aura H2O, PRS-650, PRS-T1, nook STR, PW3	But the one problem though is you cannot use some features of ePub3 because they won't work in ePub 2.

03-17-2021, 11:13 AM	#9
Quoth Still reading Posts: 13,968 Karma: 103895653 Join Date: Jun 2017 Location: Ireland Device: All 4 Kinds: epub eink, Kindle, android eink, NxtPaper	The wordprocessor file is the source. The epub2, epub3, PDF etc are simply target distribution formats. Not source.

03-17-2021, 11:59 AM	#10
KevinH Sigil Developer Posts: 8,748 Karma: 5706256 Join Date: Nov 2009 Device: many	KDP now recommends epub over mobi for submissions so it can easily be a source format, but as you said Word is probably best for the actual writing.

03-17-2021, 04:08 PM	#15
KevinH Sigil Developer Posts: 8,748 Karma: 5706256 Join Date: Nov 2009 Device: many	Old readers will eventually die out, as my Sony e-reader can attest and my old Mobi reader. And bad/old app software can be replaced. There are numerous EPUB3 reading apps out there: Readium variants, Books, Kobo apps, Bluefire Reader, ADE, etc for ios, android, windows, mac, and linux (and not to mention calibre's nice new ereader). Recommending EPUB2 over EPUB3 just to support old dedicated e-readers that are rapidly dying out is probably not a good choice when new devices and apps support both. The days of no good free epub3 readers is long gone.

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