You Wouldn’t Think It, But Typeface Piracy Is a Big Problem

GERGE · 10-30-2015, 01:30 PM

http://www.wired.com/2015/10/you-wou...a-big-problem/

It can be argued that this is not directly related to e-readers, but subject matter is very close.

Many people I know are using pirated typefaces with their e-readers (we mostly have Pocketbook and Kobo here). While some argues that personal use of licensed typefaces are alright, I believe typeface piracy is as big a problem as the e-book piracy. You cannot really weight two against each other, both are important.

I am posting the article here and writing these words because I believe many here (not the regulars but those coming and going) are not aware of the problem, are not even aware that they are doing something wrong when they download that Storm Baskerville and use it.

I have attached some open source and free to edit typefaces I optimized for eInk below, enjoy them. You don't really need to pirate hundreds of dollars worth of font files to enjoy a nice garalde serif, there are many free alternatives, and while they might not be good enough for designing, they are all perfectly good for reading.

cromag · 10-30-2015, 04:02 PM

Also a significant issue for writers who need to put together "covers" for their ebooks.

dickloraine · 10-30-2015, 08:25 PM

I would think there is a difference between personal use and commercial use. People who download a font to use in an e-reader are not potential customers, if a font is priced for commercial use. If that personal use should become a market and such people customers, fonts can't be priced high. More like 1-5€. Then you could say, a pirate is a potential customer.

Pirating fonts for non personal use or even for non commercial but public use is of course an entirely different thing. But the best way to fight that would be creating a market that is accessible.

Doonge · 10-30-2015, 09:04 PM

Thank you for your open source and free to edit fonts, but in the grand scheme of things, what's the difference if people use those versus pirated fonts?

And as dickloraine mentioned, companies do not seem to, at large, licence fonts to simple consumers.

taosaur · 11-01-2015, 12:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GERGE

I believe typeface piracy is as big a problem as the e-book piracy.

So, anywhere from insignificant to beneficial?

eschwartz · 11-01-2015, 12:51 AM

Commercial font piracy may be a problem. Sure, whatever.

...

Technically speaking, consumer font piracy might also be a problem. But when the fonts in question are not actually marketed or sold to consumers, it is evident that the creators don't care.

e.g. I highly doubt Amazon cares or is affected when Bookerly gets extracted from current Kindle firmware and sideloaded onto Kobos.
Sure, they will probably go through the DMCA motions if it is flaunted on download sites.
But it has no impact on them if someone does it themselves.

In fact, Amazon distributes the fonts in their freely-downloadable-and-openable firmware.

..

So if the fonts in question aren't being marketed, it's not that I don't agree it's piracy, but... why should anyone care? Unless someone is trying to use your servers or forums to wave red legal flags, that is.

Then again, I don't care much about fonts -- I'm happy if they let me see words on the screen.

Jessica Lares · 11-01-2015, 01:22 AM

I didn't like that article - In the beginning, it focuses on plagiarizing, and on the second half pirating, and they don't really go hand in hand.

And I really don't think font piracy is a problem. The bigger issue at large is that people think that they shouldn't have to invest any money into their work, or include licensing in a project's cost.

We, as readers/watchers/etc, have no idea whether or not a font was licensed correctly.

I'm not going to say that pirating fonts is OK, but you know, if a font happens to be on your computer, there's nothing stopping people from loading it on another device. Baskerville is a preinstalled font that comes in OS X for example. Garamond gets installed with other software too, including Microsoft Office and Adobe's suite.

Selling fonts is based on supply and demand. You can sell a kooky heading type for ~$20 on places like Creative Market, but especially when you have to put more work into it, and use higher end software to author them, it makes more sense to charge the $100+ for licenses.

HarryT · 11-01-2015, 04:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jessica Lares

I'm not going to say that pirating fonts is OK, but you know, if a font happens to be on your computer, there's nothing stopping people from loading it on another device.

The fact that there's nothing technically stopping you doesn't mean that it's legal to do so. If a font is licensed for use on your computer, you can't automatically assume that you have the legal right to install on any other device that you own.

GERGE · 11-01-2015, 05:08 AM

Noone will sue you for this, but it becomes a problem of ethics after you learn of it.

If you want to use Garamond, go for EB Garamond. If you want Baskerville, Libre Baskerville is great; there is TeX Gyre Pagella for Palatino and Courier Prime for Courier. If you want Times, you can use Liberation Serif.

You can find open-source or free alternatives for almost every popular typeface out there and there are PT Serif, Junicode, Vollkorn, Alegreya, Bitter and others as original designs. Junicode is especially awesome with its extensive glyph support. Alegraya's design is delightfully modern and beautiful.

You don't need to copy font files from your office suite or a warez site, there are good alternatives.

JSWolf · 11-01-2015, 05:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GERGE

If you want to use Garamond

No can do. EB Garamond has no italic and no bold italic versions. Because of this, EB Garamond is mostly useless.

GERGE · 11-01-2015, 05:42 AM

It has italics. There is no bold but many of my books doesn't even have any bold in them.

There is also Garamond No. 8 as a free version. From URW. Here: http://garamond.org/

JSWolf · 11-01-2015, 06:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GERGE

It has italics. There is no bold but many of my books doesn't even have any bold in them.

There is also Garamond No. 8 as a free version. From URW. Here: http://garamond.org/

My mistake. Yes, there is italic, but no bold. The bold is easy enough to create from the non-bold versions. Fontforge will create the bold variations no problem.

MikeB1972 · 11-02-2015, 05:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HarryT

The fact that there's nothing technically stopping you doesn't mean that it's legal to do so. If a font is licensed for use on your computer, you can't automatically assume that you have the legal right to install on any other device that you own.

Tricky one that though, even I have no idea which fonts on my computer are open source and which need a license.
Come to think of it I'm not even sure which law protects a font.

Been googling.
Looks like US has no protection for fonts so you would need to have a design patent.
The UK only covers it under copyright, but with a 25 year term from first use and doesn't cover usage by typographers.

Switzerland & Japan is a free for all where fonts are concerned.

So, looks like you are mainly down to contract law, which means the really small insignificant bits of the contract for most products, which means it may or may not be enforceable depending on where you are (Just read the Font bit of the Win 8 EULA and it only covers fonts in general without mentioning any by name).

HarryT · 11-02-2015, 05:10 AM

As long as you're only using it for personal use, I very much doubt that anyone would be bothered. The situation in which you really do need to take care is if you're embedding fonts in a book which you then upload for subsequent distribution. Even if the book is in the public domain, and you make it freely available, you do need to check that you have the right to redistribute any fonts that you embed in it.

WillAdams · 11-02-2015, 08:40 AM

Typeface piracy is why I haven't bothered to finish and release a typeface design I've been working on for decades now.

11-01-2015, 01:22 AM	#7
Jessica Lares Wizard Posts: 2,240 Karma: 5759170 Join Date: Jun 2011 Location: Near Dallas, Texas, USA Device: iPad Mini, iPod Touch (5th gen)	I didn't like that article - In the beginning, it focuses on plagiarizing, and on the second half pirating, and they don't really go hand in hand. And I really don't think font piracy is a problem. The bigger issue at large is that people think that they shouldn't have to invest any money into their work, or include licensing in a project's cost. We, as readers/watchers/etc, have no idea whether or not a font was licensed correctly. I'm not going to say that pirating fonts is OK, but you know, if a font happens to be on your computer, there's nothing stopping people from loading it on another device. Baskerville is a preinstalled font that comes in OS X for example. Garamond gets installed with other software too, including Microsoft Office and Adobe's suite. Selling fonts is based on supply and demand. You can sell a kooky heading type for ~$20 on places like Creative Market, but especially when you have to put more work into it, and use higher end software to author them, it makes more sense to charge the $100+ for licenses. Last edited by Jessica Lares; 11-01-2015 at 02:40 AM. Reason: I repeated myself, heh.

11-01-2015, 05:42 AM	#11
GERGE Guru Posts: 733 Karma: 5797160 Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Istanbul Device: Kobo Libra	It has italics. There is no bold but many of my books doesn't even have any bold in them. There is also Garamond No. 8 as a free version. From URW. Here: http://garamond.org/ Last edited by GERGE; 11-01-2015 at 05:47 AM.

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10-30-2015, 04:02 PM	#2
cromag Surfin the alpha waves ~~ Posts: 26,283 Karma: 459765791 Join Date: Dec 2010 Location: New Jersey Device: Jetbook Lite & Mini, Nook STR, Kobo, Hanvon N516, Kindle 2, Androids	Also a significant issue for writers who need to put together "covers" for their ebooks.

10-30-2015, 08:25 PM	#3
dickloraine Guru Posts: 631 Karma: 7544528 Join Date: Apr 2013 Location: Berlin Device: PRS 350, Kobo Aura	I would think there is a difference between personal use and commercial use. People who download a font to use in an e-reader are not potential customers, if a font is priced for commercial use. If that personal use should become a market and such people customers, fonts can't be priced high. More like 1-5€. Then you could say, a pirate is a potential customer. Pirating fonts for non personal use or even for non commercial but public use is of course an entirely different thing. But the best way to fight that would be creating a market that is accessible.

10-30-2015, 09:04 PM	#4
Doonge Connoisseur Posts: 80 Karma: 1184732 Join Date: Nov 2013 Device: Kobo Glo	Thank you for your open source and free to edit fonts, but in the grand scheme of things, what's the difference if people use those versus pirated fonts? And as dickloraine mentioned, companies do not seem to, at large, licence fonts to simple consumers.

11-01-2015, 12:51 AM	#6
eschwartz Ex-Helpdesk Junkie Posts: 19,421 Karma: 85400180 Join Date: Nov 2012 Location: The Beaten Path, USA, Roundworld, This Side of Infinity Device: Kindle Touch fw5.3.7 (Wifi only)	Commercial font piracy may be a problem. Sure, whatever. ... Technically speaking, consumer font piracy might also be a problem. But when the fonts in question are not actually marketed or sold to consumers, it is evident that the creators don't care. e.g. I highly doubt Amazon cares or is affected when Bookerly gets extracted from current Kindle firmware and sideloaded onto Kobos. Sure, they will probably go through the DMCA motions if it is flaunted on download sites. But it has no impact on them if someone does it themselves. In fact, Amazon distributes the fonts in their freely-downloadable-and-openable firmware. .. So if the fonts in question aren't being marketed, it's not that I don't agree it's piracy, but... why should anyone care? Unless someone is trying to use your servers or forums to wave red legal flags, that is. Then again, I don't care much about fonts -- I'm happy if they let me see words on the screen.

11-01-2015, 05:08 AM	#9
GERGE Guru Posts: 733 Karma: 5797160 Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Istanbul Device: Kobo Libra	Noone will sue you for this, but it becomes a problem of ethics after you learn of it. If you want to use Garamond, go for EB Garamond. If you want Baskerville, Libre Baskerville is great; there is TeX Gyre Pagella for Palatino and Courier Prime for Courier. If you want Times, you can use Liberation Serif. You can find open-source or free alternatives for almost every popular typeface out there and there are PT Serif, Junicode, Vollkorn, Alegreya, Bitter and others as original designs. Junicode is especially awesome with its extensive glyph support. Alegraya's design is delightfully modern and beautiful. You don't need to copy font files from your office suite or a warez site, there are good alternatives.

11-02-2015, 05:10 AM	#14
HarryT eBook Enthusiast Posts: 85,544 Karma: 93383099 Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: UK Device: Kindle Oasis 2, iPad Pro 10.5", iPhone 6	As long as you're only using it for personal use, I very much doubt that anyone would be bothered. The situation in which you really do need to take care is if you're embedding fonts in a book which you then upload for subsequent distribution. Even if the book is in the public domain, and you make it freely available, you do need to check that you have the right to redistribute any fonts that you embed in it.

11-02-2015, 08:40 AM	#15
WillAdams Wizard Posts: 1,258 Karma: 3439432 Join Date: Feb 2008 Device: Amazon Kindle Paperwhite (300ppi), Samsung Galaxy Book 12	Typeface piracy is why I haven't bothered to finish and release a typeface design I've been working on for decades now.

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