Why can't Kindle Dx Internatinal be sold from Europe?

Over · 01-08-2010, 02:29 AM

After reading on screen that import taxes are 116$, I wonder why, just like the books, Amazon can't sell the Kindle 2 and Dx from Amazon.co.uk or any other european area? It would avoid those import taxes for us, europeans!!

dafire · 01-08-2010, 03:58 AM

well .. while you have to pay the import taxes when you buy from us, you don't pay VAT. (Prices in US are always declared without VAT in stores)

So instead of import taxes you would pay vat and the price wouldn't change.

pdurrant · 01-08-2010, 04:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Over

After reading on screen that import taxes are 116$, I wonder why, just like the books, Amazon can't sell the Kindle 2 and Dx from Amazon.co.uk or any other european area? It would avoid those import taxes for us, europeans!!

It might have to do with needing regulatory approval in Europe.

I'm guessing that there's agreements in place for mobile phones sold in one country to be allowed in another, but to be sold in another country they might need approval. The Kindles are mobile phones in some ways.

And then there's the power supplies - they'd need UK/EU power supplies too.

That's not to say that Amazon shouldn't be doing this - but I suspect they're taking the easiest route for them to get the Kindles shipping quickly to early adopters.

I'm hoping that when they really get their act together and have Kindles selling in other countries, they'll also manage to negotiate deals with local telecomms companies, and the $2 data charge on each download will go away.

Of course, we would then also expect local Kindle stores with local prices - which might be even higher...

HarryT · 01-08-2010, 04:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dafire

well .. while you have to pay the import taxes when you buy from us, you don't pay VAT. (Prices in US are always declared without VAT in stores)

That's because the US doesn't have VAT. VAT and the US system of "sales tax" are entirely different things.

HarryT · 01-08-2010, 04:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pdurrant

I'm hoping that when they really get their act together and have Kindles selling in other countries, they'll also manage to negotiate deals with local telecomms companies, and the $2 data charge on each download will go away.

Of course, we would then also expect local Kindle stores with local prices - which might be even higher...

Amazon have already announced that they'll be opening a UK "Kindle Store" at some point.

Mike L · 01-08-2010, 07:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dafire

well .. while you have to pay the import taxes when you buy from us, you don't pay VAT.

That's not quite true. You still have to pay the VAT in Europe. But you pay it at the point of entry into the EU, not as part of the purchase price.

dafire · 01-08-2010, 08:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dafire

you have to pay the import taxes when you buy from us, you don't pay VAT

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike L

That's not quite true. You still have to pay the VAT in Europe. But you pay it at the point of entry into the EU, not as part of the purchase price.

But that's exactly what I said. You don't pay VAT but you have to pay import taxes which are the same amount as your local VAT.
If you would buy local you would not pay import taxes but VAT .. so it would be the same price. (except shipping costs maybe)
There are no customs duties or any other fees if you import a Kindle to uk or germany.

Mike L · 01-08-2010, 10:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dafire

But that's exactly what I said. You don't pay VAT but you have to pay import taxes which are the same amount as your local VAT.

I'm sorry, but that's not correct.

The money you pay to the delivery company when your purchase is delivered is either mainly or entirely VAT. It might also contain an element of import duty, but in the case of electronic products like the Kindle, that's either very small or zero. The amount of the import duty is definitely not the same as the amount of VAT.

I have in front of me my invoice from UPS for the import of my Kindle last April. It clearly shows GBP 32.03 for VAT, zero for import duty and "other government charges", and GBP 11.00 as a "brokerage fee" (the fee UPS charge for collecting the VAT on behalf of the government).

It could be that you are using the term "import tax" as a catch-all term for all charges that you pay on import, but there is a crucial difference between import duty and VAT. Import duty is a charge that everyone must pay, and is non-recoverable. VAT is a charge on consumption, and can be reclaimed by businesses on their inputs (which would certainly include devices like the Kindle).

The bottom line is this. Whether you buy a product from a US source and have them send it to you, or you buy it in Europe from a supplier who sourced it from the US, the element of the total cost of purchase that is directly attributable to taxes is going to be pretty much the same.

HarryT · 01-08-2010, 10:19 AM

Nicely summed up, Mike

.

Over · 01-08-2010, 10:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dafire

well .. while you have to pay the import taxes when you buy from us, you don't pay VAT. (Prices in US are always declared without VAT in stores)

So instead of import taxes you would pay vat and the price wouldn't change.

Bollocks! That explains it, although it didn't make me happier.

I just hope those import fees are the same as the customs fee. It would be really unpleasant to see the kindle confiscated and having to pay... I don't even want to know how much.

Mike L · 01-14-2010, 09:55 AM

Sorry to labour this point. Just ignore me if you're fed up with this topic, but I have just taken delivery of a second Kindle, and I have the paperwork in front of me.

The invoice is showing a "tax deposit" of $49, which is exactly 17½% of the purchase price, 17½% being the current UK VAT rate. There was no other payment due, either to Amazon or the delivery company.

So, although the tax isn't explicitly labelled as VAT, it's pretty clear that this is in fact the VAT charge, and that the import duty is zero.

Over · 01-15-2010, 02:27 PM

Thank you for he info. There's never too much, specially when I'm about to make a costly investion.

Lucky americans, who don't have VAT.

Mike L · 01-15-2010, 03:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Over

Lucky americans, who don't have VAT.

But don't they have a sales tax?

daffy4u · 01-15-2010, 05:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike L

But don't they have a sales tax?

Not on internet purchases where the retailer does not have a brick and mortar store. I did not pay sales tax on any of my Kindle purchases. If I were to buy a nook, I would pay a local sales tax because B&N has stores in my city.

Mike L · 01-16-2010, 03:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by daffy4u

Not on internet purchases where the retailer does not have a brick and mortar store. I did not pay sales tax on any of my Kindle purchases. If I were to buy a nook, I would pay a local sales tax because B&N has stores in my city.

I didn't know that. Thanks for the clarification, Daffy4U.

01-08-2010, 02:29 AM	#1
Over Wizard Posts: 1,462 Karma: 6061516 Join Date: May 2008 Location: Cascais, Portugal Device: Kindle PW, Samsung Galaxy Note Pro 12.2", OnePlus 6	Why can't Kindle Dx Internatinal be sold from Europe? After reading on screen that import taxes are 116$, I wonder why, just like the books, Amazon can't sell the Kindle 2 and Dx from Amazon.co.uk or any other european area? It would avoid those import taxes for us, europeans!!

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01-08-2010, 03:58 AM	#2
dafire Member Posts: 20 Karma: 500 Join Date: Mar 2008 Device: PRS505, Kindle DXi	well .. while you have to pay the import taxes when you buy from us, you don't pay VAT. (Prices in US are always declared without VAT in stores) So instead of import taxes you would pay vat and the price wouldn't change.

01-08-2010, 10:19 AM	#9
HarryT eBook Enthusiast Posts: 85,544 Karma: 93383043 Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: UK Device: Kindle Oasis 2, iPad Pro 10.5", iPhone 6	Nicely summed up, Mike .

01-14-2010, 09:55 AM	#11
Mike L Wizard Posts: 1,479 Karma: 3846231 Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Edinburgh, Scotland Device: Kindle 3, Samsung Galaxy	Sorry to labour this point. Just ignore me if you're fed up with this topic, but I have just taken delivery of a second Kindle, and I have the paperwork in front of me. The invoice is showing a "tax deposit" of $49, which is exactly 17½% of the purchase price, 17½% being the current UK VAT rate. There was no other payment due, either to Amazon or the delivery company. So, although the tax isn't explicitly labelled as VAT, it's pretty clear that this is in fact the VAT charge, and that the import duty is zero.

01-15-2010, 02:27 PM	#12
Over Wizard Posts: 1,462 Karma: 6061516 Join Date: May 2008 Location: Cascais, Portugal Device: Kindle PW, Samsung Galaxy Note Pro 12.2", OnePlus 6	Thank you for he info. There's never too much, specially when I'm about to make a costly investion. Lucky americans, who don't have VAT.

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