"Use saved conversion settings" -- why?

[Phssthpok]

I keep my books as EPUBs, but auto-convert them to AZW3 when I copy them to my Kindle, and then delete the AZW3s so that if I have to fix anything, I won't end up editing the EPUB and then accidentally uploading the old unchanged AZW3 to the Kindle.

I've recently had to change a few conversion settings, and each change has meant spending about three days reconverting all my books to make sure the new settings "take" -- because if not, and I edit an EPUB and then upload it to the Kindle, it uses the saved conversion settings by default.

When I convert multiple books manually, I can uncheck the "Use saved conversion settings". When I convert a single book, I don't have this option (why not?) -- I can go through all the settings and make sure they're correct before converting, but I find it easier to pick another book and convert the two together so I can uncheck "Use saved conversion settings".

However, for autoconverting (when auto-adding, or saving to a device) it will always use the saved conversion settings. Which is why, after changing a setting, I have to spend three days converting everything again -- otherwise I'll edit the EPUBs for the books I'm proofing on the Kindle, and when I upload them again they'll be converted using the old settings. (And it's easier for me than trawling around on the Kindle to find books I've started looking at and then put down because something else has come along, and converting just those books.)

I've never found a situation where, after changing some conversion setting, I want to ignore the changes I just made and use the old settings instead -- I always want the new settings (that's why I changed them!). And even if a specific book needs unusual settings, I would have thought that would be the exception rather than the rule, and a per-book preference would make more sense in such a case.

Wouldn't it make more sense for "Use saved conversion settings" to be unchecked by default? Or at least have a tweak where you can specify the default setting?

[theducks]

Yes you do, but the name changed and it became a button

Hint: Restore defaults

All these do is CAUSE calibre to use the DEFAULT conversion settings from Preferences.

A saved setting, is what was in effect at the time you did the FIRST conversion of that book That includes any 'adjustments' you make to conversion dialog when starting that book.

99.5% of the time, I just use the default (that has been refined over time).
The rest, I hand edit cause of the brain dead stuff publishers do.
Who Indents a Chapter title/number? It looks off (I sometimes do vary the margin for Right or Left justified, but never Indent centered)

[Phssthpok]

Originally Posted by theducks

Yes you do, but the name changed and it became a button

Hint: Restore defaults

All these do is CAUSE calibre to use the DEFAULT conversion settings from Preferences.

Ah, OK. I interpreted that to mean "go back to the original settings that Calibre was installed with before you started messing around with them". Like the similarly-named buttons on Windows that, if you press them, you find IE as your default browser (with Bing the default search engine), Windows Media Player the default for all movie and music formats, and Notepad the default text editor. (Shudder.)

99.5% of the time, I just use the default (that has been refined over time).
The rest, I hand edit cause of the brain dead stuff publishers do.
Who Indents a Chapter title/number? It looks off (I sometimes do vary the margin for Right or Left justified, but never Indent centered)

Agreed. I do the same. But my gripe is that, if the book has ever been converted in the past, and I fix stuff that annoys me, I have to be very, very careful not to use antique settings from back when I first installed Calibre.

I really don't understand why "don't use my current settings, use something I changed months or years ago" should be the default behaviour.

And, as I said, it isn't even something I can change if I'm auto-converting.

[theducks]

Originally Posted by Phssthpok

I really don't understand why "don't use my current settings, use something I changed months or years ago" should be the default behaviour.

And, as I said, it isn't even something I can change if I'm auto-converting.

Saved are on a PER BOOK basis

The saved settings ASSUME you have them corrected. So why would you NOT want to keep them?

[ilovejedd]

Originally Posted by theducks

Saved are on a PER BOOK basis

The saved settings ASSUME you have them corrected. So why would you NOT want to keep them?

I always do bulk conversions (sometimes, for the entire library when I want to standardize something). I don't tweak conversions on a per book basis. Calibre saves settings used for bulk conversions, too. Personally not a fan of that behavior.

It's a pretty minor nit. I just bulk edit metadata to delete saved conversion settings immediately after, then do a Check Library to compact the database. I have daily versioned backups with copies in the cloud set up so deleting conversion settings saves me quite a bit of space, too.

[Phssthpok]

Originally Posted by theducks

Saved are on a PER BOOK basis

The saved settings ASSUME you have them corrected. So why would you NOT want to keep them?

Yes, I know.

So if I change my global settings (e.g. to disable font scaling, once I realise that my fonts are being mangled and in some cases look annoyingly wrong), and then re-convert a book I converted earlier, the default is that it uses the same settings as the last time I converted that book. In other words, it uses the OLD global settings and scales the fonts again, not the NEW ones that I just changed to prevent font rescaling.

I have to remember that I converted the book earlier (and that I did it BEFORE I updated my global settings), and I also have to deselect the option to use the OLD settings (which I have NEVER wanted to do).

Or else I have to do this with EVERY book I convert -- unless, of course, I upload a book to the Kindle without manually converting it first, in which case it gets auto-converted using who-knows-which settings from maybe three years ago. And there is no way to make Calibre remember my choice: that I want the new settings, not the old ones.

Or, whenever I change a global setting, I reconvert my entire library -- which takes about three days non-stop -- just to make sure that all books have the same saved settings.

I'm sorry, but this behaviour makes no sense to me at all.

[BetterRed]

Bulk metadata edit has a button labelled Remove stored conversion settings for the selected books

I don't know how to search for books that have stored conversion settings, nor can I spot a template function that does it.

The Quality Check plugin has tools to search for books that have/have not been converted. IIRC it does not differentiate books that have book specific conversion settings. Maybe that feature could be added

BR

[kovidgoyal]

When you change default settings, if you want them to apply to previosuly converted books, you need to tell calibre that. That behavior is perfectly sensible and natural. Otherwise you will eventually find that you make some global setting change and end up reconverting the collection and some previously converted book has its formatting destroyed by the change, and then you will be inhere telling us how not remembering previous conversion settings for converted books "makes absolutely no sense".

[Phssthpok]

Originally Posted by kovidgoyal

When you change default settings, if you want them to apply to previosuly converted books, you need to tell calibre that. That behavior is perfectly sensible and natural. Otherwise you will eventually find that you make some global setting change and end up reconverting the collection and some previously converted book has its formatting destroyed by the change, and then you will be inhere telling us how not remembering previous conversion settings for converted books "makes absolutely no sense".

If I reconvert, I want my new settings to be used 99.999% of the time. I find it very weird to change my settings, reconvert a book, and discover that it has absolutely no effect. It usually makes me think I've got it wrong, and I need to change some other settings to achieve the desired effect. For me at least, this is completely counter-intuitive.

The best solution would of course be to have a tweak so you can select which of the two behaviours you want...

[Phssthpok]

Originally Posted by BetterRed

Bulk metadata edit has a button labelled Remove stored conversion settings for the selected books

I don't know how to search for books that have stored conversion settings, nor can I spot a template function that does it.

The Quality Check plugin has tools to search for books that have/have not been converted. IIRC it does not differentiate books that have book specific conversion settings. Maybe that feature could be added

BR

Thanks. This at least means I can select all books and hit the button if/when I need to change my default settings again. Much easier than reconverting everything!

(I just tried it, and it took < 1 sec; reconverting takes about 3 days...)

[Phssthpok]

Originally Posted by kovidgoyal

When you change default settings, if you want them to apply to previosuly converted books, you need to tell calibre that. That behavior is perfectly sensible and natural. Otherwise you will eventually find that you make some global setting change and end up reconverting the collection and some previously converted book has its formatting destroyed by the change, and then you will be inhere telling us how not remembering previous conversion settings for converted books "makes absolutely no sense".

I've been thinking about this, and have a feature request to make:

1) add a preference setting which specifies the default value for the "used saved settings" checkbox, which would also be used when auto-converting.
2) add the checkbox to the dialog for converting single books (since at the moment you are forced to use the saved settings when converting an individual book).

The default would be to use saved settings, as at present, but awkward people like me could choose not to.

[kovidgoyal]

Awkward people like you can simply use one of the many ways to have their changes applied to previously converted books. Deleting the saved setting using the bulk metadata edit dialog, or doing a bulk convert and using the checkbox

[Phssthpok]

Originally Posted by kovidgoyal

Awkward people like you can simply use one of the many ways to have their changes applied to previously converted books. Deleting the saved setting using the bulk metadata edit dialog, or doing a bulk convert and using the checkbox

Can I ask why the checkbox is only available on the bulk convert dialog, and not when converting a single book?

[Phssthpok]

Originally Posted by BetterRed

Bulk metadata edit has a button labelled Remove stored conversion settings for the selected books

I don't know how to search for books that have stored conversion settings, nor can I spot a template function that does it.

The Quality Check plugin has tools to search for books that have/have not been converted. IIRC it does not differentiate books that have book specific conversion settings. Maybe that feature could be added

BR

BTW, many thanks for pointing this out -- I never thought of looking at the bulk metadata dialog for something that affects conversions -- it's a bit like forgetting where my car keys are and then finding them in the dishwasher...

[theducks]

Originally Posted by Phssthpok

Can I ask why the checkbox is only available on the bulk convert dialog, and not when converting a single book?

Because single convert has a button. A tick is needed so all converts use the temporary setting (I am also guessing a tick is more obvious and easier ti implement than a 'latched' button)