Tolkien and the Battle of the Somme

[issybird]

It is the centenary of the first day of the Battle of the Somme, the deadliest day ever in British military history. An article in today's New York Times, How J.R.R. Tolkien Found Mordor on the Western Front describes howTolkien found inspiration in the carnage as he therapeutically began the writings, drawing on his surroundings and experience, that would result in his great work.

[Phogg]

Clive Staples Lewis was shaped by that war as well.

[issybird]

Originally Posted by Phogg

Clive Staples Lewis was shaped by that war as well.

All the writers of that generation who served were affected; I thought it interesting that the article specifically rooted elements of The Lord of the Rings in Tolkien's experiences at the Somme.

[pwalker8]

It's been several years since I read it, but I seem to recall that Tolkien himself said that Mordor was not based on his experience in WW I, but rather were more to do with the industrialization of England during his youth. What he wrote during WW I was the material that eventual became the Silmarillion, i.e. the backstory and mythology of Middle Earth. Many people have also tried to tie Modor to WW II since he wrote a lot of it during that time period.

[Phogg]

Originally Posted by issybird

All the writers of that generation who served were affected; I thought it interesting that the article specifically rooted elements of The Lord of the Rings in Tolkien's experiences at the Somme.

I have a book of Tolkein's letters. He wrote about the connection from time to time.

[MickiTee]

There is a biography of Tolkien about this period by John Garth called 'Tolkien and the Great War: The Threshold of Middle-earth'.

"To be caught in youth by 1914 was no less hideous an experience than in 1939 . . . by 1918 all but one of my close friends were dead."

So J.R.R. Tolkien responded to critics who saw The Lord of the Rings as a reaction to the Second World War. Tolkien and the Great War tells for the first time the full story of how he embarked on the creation of Middle-earth in his youth as the world around him was plunged into catastrophe. This biography reveals the horror and heroism that he experienced as a signals officer in the Battle of the Somme and introduces the circle of friends who spurred his mythology into life. It shows how, after two of these brilliant young men were killed, Tolkien pursued the dream they had all shared by launching his epic of good and evil.

This is the first substantially new biography of Tolkien since 1977, meticulously researched and distilled from his personal wartime papers and amultitude of other sources.John Garth argues that the foundation of tragic experience in the FirstWorld War is the key to Middle-earth's enduring power. Tolkien used his mythic imagination not to escape from reality but to reflect and trans form the cataclysm of his generation. While his contemporaries surrendered to disillusionment, he kept enchantment alive, reshaping an entire literary tradition into a form that resonates to this day.

Its available in both Epub and Kindle formats.

Its been on my TBR list for a while. Now might be an appropriate time to read it.

[Toxaris]

Originally Posted by pwalker8

It's been several years since I read it, but I seem to recall that Tolkien himself said that Mordor was not based on his experience in WW I, but rather were more to do with the industrialization of England during his youth. What he wrote during WW I was the material that eventual became the Silmarillion, i.e. the backstory and mythology of Middle Earth. Many people have also tried to tie Modor to WW II since he wrote a lot of it during that time period.

This concurs with my memory as well. In those days he wrote several parts of stories that later was bundled (or at least a version of those stories) in the Silmarillion.

[frahse]

The crucible of war weighs heavy.

[pwalker8]

There is a very famous story about Issac Asimov where Asimov attended a lecture on one of his stories. After listening to the professor for a while, he finally had enough, stood up and said "no that's not what I was trying to say". The professor replied "What do you know? You only wrote it."

The point being that many times, in search of new angles, analyst can see something that may not be there and ignore any words to the contrary. I'm sure that his experiences in WW I left a deep mark on Tolkien. I'm not so sure they inspired his vision of Mordor as said in the newspaper article. I'm pretty sure that he said otherwise.

[GrannyGrump]

I do remember reading somewhere a Tolkien quote that specifically the scene of the floating corpses in the Dead Marshes episode was inspired by the Battle of the Somme.

But also, yes, I have seen critiques and discussions stating that the books were an allegory of the industrialization of England.

[Toxaris]

Originally Posted by pwalker8

There is a very famous story about Issac Asimov where Asimov attended a lecture on one of his stories. After listening to the professor for a while, he finally had enough, stood up and said "no that's not what I was trying to say". The professor replied "What do you know? You only wrote it."

There is a similar story about a Dutch writer, Godfried Bomans. He commented on a educational print of one of his books (Erik en het Klein Insectenboek) where at the end of each chapter there were questions about the chapter. He was asked about the book and he said he thought it was great, because 'now I finally know what I meant with it'. Needless to say, most people missed the sarcasm.

[crich70]

I don't think anyone could go through any such traumatic experience without it having an effect on them even if they don't think that it has done. Often we are not the best judge of our own selves. We are too close to the subject to be without bias.

[pwalker8]

Originally Posted by crich70

I don't think anyone could go through any such traumatic experience without it having an effect on them even if they don't think that it has done. Often we are not the best judge of our own selves. We are too close to the subject to be without bias.

And yet, no one else is close enough to the subject to have an informed opinion.

[frahse]

Originally Posted by crich70

I don't think anyone could go through any such traumatic experience without it having an effect on them even if they don't think that it has done. Often we are not the best judge of our own selves. We are too close to the subject to be without bias.

I can realize now that I was only touched by war when I was young. In some ways I had it very good.

There were no troop ships crossing the seas essentially training the young soldiers on the way like WWI and WWII and where the soldiers stayed for the duration unless wounded or killed.

There were no multiple deployments like today. In Nam you had to volunteer for the second tour.

I was never in an extended battle zone for months. I only investigated, analyzed or critiqued..

Yet I was exposed to and embedded in the "machine." The great war machine which was like a living breathing chained monster with established killing zones, and recycled foolishness; where there were little demigods in uniform around each corner each demanding their full due and seemingly oblivious to the real "mission" though that word was constantly on their lips.

Milton and Churchill said that "he who stands and waits also serves." It is true. The pressure is always there. The realization of what your actions can mean even if you are not firing your weapon which can actually be kind of stress relieving.

I never saw dead bodies floating by, but I did know the numbers, and all those numbers had names, some of which I knew.