Do you get used to the slow page turns of E-Ink?

palex481 · 05-08-2008, 08:01 PM

OK, so I spent about 20 minutes today playing around with a Sony PRS-505 in Borders today. My first impression when I saw it, was that it was just a fake demo unit. I forgot E-ink doesn't emit light. Very cool. Love the crispness of the display, even the sample pictures looked good.

But the refresh rate, which I know is not horribly slow is still light years below the iphone and pdas I've owned. I know they are two completely different technologies, but as much as a pain it is to convert and split books into chapters for my iphone, I've gotten used to the fact that I can tap the screen and the page flips instantaneously or I can flick my finger and scroll down the page. I love that part of the experience of reading on the iphone, but the screen is just too small and battery life sucks.

So maybe I'm spoiled, as I've been reading ebooks for years on PDAs, but the thing is I don't know if I can get past this point.

Like in some books, there are passages that the author is just rambling and I like to skip through and flip past the section, but there is no flipping on an e-ink device.

I definitely see the advantages of e-ink: Battery Life, Paper-like Quality, but I'm still not sold on it completely.

joblack · 05-08-2008, 08:43 PM

Just press the page button on the second last sentence of the page and you should be fine. With a paperback book you have to change the page as well. I doubt this goes faster than the eInk device

RWood · 05-08-2008, 09:47 PM

As joblack said, you adapt to the speed of e-ink. Depending on the size of the text and your reading speed you will find the best time to press the page advance button. I use the time of the page turn to look away from the screen so that my eyes can refocus on a distant object. For me that avoids eye strain. I do the same thing with a pbook.

Ervserver · 05-08-2008, 10:36 PM

I don't see it as slow at all, didn't even when I first read a book on it

JSWolf · 05-08-2008, 10:40 PM

I find the Vizplex screens to be good for page turning. It's no worse then being on the right side of a pBook and then having to turn the page and then reposition your eyes to the top left to continue reeding. You just get used to turning the page and it's not any slower then your pBook.

Kingston · 05-08-2008, 11:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by palex481

Like in some books, there are passages that the author is just rambling and I like to skip through and flip past the section, but there is no flipping on an e-ink device.

I definitely see the advantages of e-ink: Battery Life, Paper-like Quality, but I'm still not sold on it completely.

The Sony has a page advance feature where you can hold down the next page button and advance exactly 10 pages, but that is probably too much to qualify as 'flipping' through a section.

I just got a Jetbook reader to add to my menagerie of ebook readers. It is the only one I have that is LCD rather than eink. It took an hour or so for me to notice there was no flash when the page refreshed, I guess I was that used to the flash.

However, if you are the sort of person who notices the flash then it would be more of a hindrance for you. The 1150 is also LCD and (I guess) refreshes instantly, like a computer or like my Jetbook.

The tradeoff is diminished battery life for a LCD device. And the type on the Jetbook is noticeably pixellated if you look at it closely, when compared with the eink devices.

Indigo Ink · 05-09-2008, 12:08 AM

I have a frankline ebookman 901 (you get them very cheap off ebay these days), (I got it when it was slightly more expensive

). It has a 5 inch lcd screen so no flashes (though the bottom one inch is for navigation). It can read mobipocket, has a calender, address book, even an earphone outlet. So in short it is quite comparable to a pda. Now not all lcd’s are alike. This one has a black and white one. However, IMO, for reading ebooks, a black and white (grey) screen is much easier on eyes than a coloured one. So far so good - but what really puts me off is the battery life. Ebm uses 2 AAA batteries and they get consumed very fast. Also, a 4 inch (effective) screen means lot more page turns (even though turning pages is very easy. It has a touch screen and even a jog wheel) than an average p book. SO what I am looking for in my next reader is a bigger screen and a longer battery life. Of course, if the screen is non reflective, all the better (like I have "heard" eink is). Ebookman can get really annoying if you want to lie down and read as screen becomes unreadable. Now a six inch eink device, (though I have yet to see one in person), I feel, is not really likely to be a major improvement over a 5 inch one, so I want to wait for the 9.7 inch one. I guess, what I am trying to say is that page turn flashes would perhaps not be a big deal if one finds that there are other clear advantages (longer battery life, larger non reflective screen, in my case) in eink readers.

HarryT · 05-09-2008, 02:19 AM

After a few hours of using an eInk reader you no longer even notice the "flash" and page turn. The page turn speed on the modern VizPlex screens which the Sony, CyBook, and Kindle all use is about half a second - that's a lot faster than you can turn the page of a paper book.

It's not an issue.

NatCh · 05-09-2008, 11:15 AM

I stopped noticing it after a few minutes, myself. That was over 18 months ago, I don't even think about it anymore unless someone asks if you get used to it.

The longer answer is that there are some, very few folks who just can't get used to it, it drives them completely nuts. If it wasn't really bugging you a lot in the store, you probably are not one of these unfortunate few.

JeffElkins · 05-09-2008, 12:03 PM

I have the same experience as most. After a few minutes reading, the flash was not even noticeable.

bwaldron · 05-09-2008, 02:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by palex481

So maybe I'm spoiled, as I've been reading ebooks for years on PDAs, but the thing is I don't know if I can get past this point.

I've also been reading books on PDAs for years, and was concerned about the screen refresh. I can honestly say that within a day I didn't even think about it anymore.

lmarie · 05-09-2008, 08:40 PM

Having upgraded to the newest firmware, I find the page turns to be even faster than before, so for me speed isn't an issue. That said, I do occasionally still find the flash bothersome. I must be more sensitive than some here -- usually when I get to that point I just put the device away. I've tried the nonflash mode, but then the ghosting bugs me.

mjh215 · 05-10-2008, 05:21 PM

I think the bulk of the major complaints involving the flashing were from internet fanboys that had never even picked an eInk device up. That also seemed to have started the whole no backlite deal as well. I'm used to identifying it so it didn't even phase my decision to buy one.

I find that in blinking and refocusing back to the start of the page I take as much time as it takes to flash over. And after a few minutes to get your timing right it becomes unnoticable.

-MJ

Ervserver · 05-10-2008, 11:31 PM

The page turns faster than I can get another Doritos out of the bag

Danny Fekete · 05-11-2008, 01:22 AM

I find, just as I subconsciously prepare to turn the page as I'm coming to the bottom of it in a paper book, I've started pressing the page-turn button on my Cybook as I'm reading the last line or two. And, in my experience (which seems not uncommon), my mind has adapted to flash of the screen exactly the same way as it has to the visual disruption of a physical leaf of paper moving across the reading surface of a book.

(That said, occasionally do I snap out of the experience and look for pixels, but generally the net result of the disruption is a positive, pleasing frisson at the reminder that I've got an omnibook full of magical changing paper in my hands.)

05-08-2008, 08:01 PM	#1
palex481 Connoisseur Posts: 93 Karma: 53 Join Date: May 2008 Device: Sony PRS-505	Do you get used to the slow page turns of E-Ink? OK, so I spent about 20 minutes today playing around with a Sony PRS-505 in Borders today. My first impression when I saw it, was that it was just a fake demo unit. I forgot E-ink doesn't emit light. Very cool. Love the crispness of the display, even the sample pictures looked good. But the refresh rate, which I know is not horribly slow is still light years below the iphone and pdas I've owned. I know they are two completely different technologies, but as much as a pain it is to convert and split books into chapters for my iphone, I've gotten used to the fact that I can tap the screen and the page flips instantaneously or I can flick my finger and scroll down the page. I love that part of the experience of reading on the iphone, but the screen is just too small and battery life sucks. So maybe I'm spoiled, as I've been reading ebooks for years on PDAs, but the thing is I don't know if I can get past this point. Like in some books, there are passages that the author is just rambling and I like to skip through and flip past the section, but there is no flipping on an e-ink device. I definitely see the advantages of e-ink: Battery Life, Paper-like Quality, but I'm still not sold on it completely.

05-09-2008, 12:08 AM	#7
Indigo Ink The curious one! Posts: 82 Karma: 10 Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: India Device: Kindle 3, Nook, Ebookman 901	I have a frankline ebookman 901 (you get them very cheap off ebay these days), (I got it when it was slightly more expensive ). It has a 5 inch lcd screen so no flashes (though the bottom one inch is for navigation). It can read mobipocket, has a calender, address book, even an earphone outlet. So in short it is quite comparable to a pda. Now not all lcd’s are alike. This one has a black and white one. However, IMO, for reading ebooks, a black and white (grey) screen is much easier on eyes than a coloured one. So far so good - but what really puts me off is the battery life. Ebm uses 2 AAA batteries and they get consumed very fast. Also, a 4 inch (effective) screen means lot more page turns (even though turning pages is very easy. It has a touch screen and even a jog wheel) than an average p book. SO what I am looking for in my next reader is a bigger screen and a longer battery life. Of course, if the screen is non reflective, all the better (like I have "heard" eink is). Ebookman can get really annoying if you want to lie down and read as screen becomes unreadable. Now a six inch eink device, (though I have yet to see one in person), I feel, is not really likely to be a major improvement over a 5 inch one, so I want to wait for the 9.7 inch one. I guess, what I am trying to say is that page turn flashes would perhaps not be a big deal if one finds that there are other clear advantages (longer battery life, larger non reflective screen, in my case) in eink readers. Last edited by Indigo Ink; 05-09-2008 at 12:28 AM.

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05-08-2008, 08:43 PM	#2
joblack Wizard Posts: 1,751 Karma: 4382688 Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Somewhere on earth Device: Onyx Boox Tab X C	Just press the page button on the second last sentence of the page and you should be fine. With a paperback book you have to change the page as well. I doubt this goes faster than the eInk device

05-08-2008, 09:47 PM	#3
RWood Technogeezer Posts: 7,233 Karma: 1601464 Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Virginia, USA Device: Sony PRS-500	As joblack said, you adapt to the speed of e-ink. Depending on the size of the text and your reading speed you will find the best time to press the page advance button. I use the time of the page turn to look away from the screen so that my eyes can refocus on a distant object. For me that avoids eye strain. I do the same thing with a pbook.

05-08-2008, 10:36 PM	#4
Ervserver Wizard Posts: 2,624 Karma: 1008294 Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Iowa, USA Device: Nook Simple Touch	I don't see it as slow at all, didn't even when I first read a book on it

05-08-2008, 10:40 PM	#5
JSWolf Resident Curmudgeon Posts: 79,692 Karma: 145864619 Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Roslindale, Massachusetts Device: Kobo Libra 2, Kobo Aura H2O, PRS-650, PRS-T1, nook STR, PW3	I find the Vizplex screens to be good for page turning. It's no worse then being on the right side of a pBook and then having to turn the page and then reposition your eyes to the top left to continue reeding. You just get used to turning the page and it's not any slower then your pBook.

05-09-2008, 02:19 AM	#8
HarryT eBook Enthusiast Posts: 85,544 Karma: 93383099 Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: UK Device: Kindle Oasis 2, iPad Pro 10.5", iPhone 6	After a few hours of using an eInk reader you no longer even notice the "flash" and page turn. The page turn speed on the modern VizPlex screens which the Sony, CyBook, and Kindle all use is about half a second - that's a lot faster than you can turn the page of a paper book. It's not an issue.

05-09-2008, 11:15 AM	#9
NatCh Gizmologist Posts: 11,615 Karma: 929550 Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Republic of Texas Embassy at Jackson, TN Device: Pocketbook Touch HD3	I stopped noticing it after a few minutes, myself. That was over 18 months ago, I don't even think about it anymore unless someone asks if you get used to it. The longer answer is that there are some, very few folks who just can't get used to it, it drives them completely nuts. If it wasn't really bugging you a lot in the store, you probably are not one of these unfortunate few.

05-09-2008, 12:03 PM	#10
JeffElkins Guru Posts: 780 Karma: 1416 Join Date: Jan 2008 Device: Kobo Clara 2E/HD, Kindle PW	I have the same experience as most. After a few minutes reading, the flash was not even noticeable.

05-09-2008, 08:40 PM	#12
lmarie Dilettante Posts: 153 Karma: 500 Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Philadelphia area Device: EB1150, Cybook Gen3, Kobo Touch, Kobo Glo, Kobo Clara BW	Having upgraded to the newest firmware, I find the page turns to be even faster than before, so for me speed isn't an issue. That said, I do occasionally still find the flash bothersome. I must be more sensitive than some here -- usually when I get to that point I just put the device away. I've tried the nonflash mode, but then the ghosting bugs me.

05-10-2008, 05:21 PM	#13
mjh215 Guru Posts: 988 Karma: 12653 Join Date: Apr 2008 Device: None of your business	I think the bulk of the major complaints involving the flashing were from internet fanboys that had never even picked an eInk device up. That also seemed to have started the whole no backlite deal as well. I'm used to identifying it so it didn't even phase my decision to buy one. I find that in blinking and refocusing back to the start of the page I take as much time as it takes to flash over. And after a few minutes to get your timing right it becomes unnoticable. -MJ

05-10-2008, 11:31 PM	#14
Ervserver Wizard Posts: 2,624 Karma: 1008294 Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Iowa, USA Device: Nook Simple Touch	The page turns faster than I can get another Doritos out of the bag

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05-11-2008, 01:22 AM	#15
Danny Fekete Electronic Education Buff Posts: 84 Karma: 31076 Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada Device: Bookeen Cybook Gen3, iRex DR1000s, Sony Reader PRS 650	I find, just as I subconsciously prepare to turn the page as I'm coming to the bottom of it in a paper book, I've started pressing the page-turn button on my Cybook as I'm reading the last line or two. And, in my experience (which seems not uncommon), my mind has adapted to flash of the screen exactly the same way as it has to the visual disruption of a physical leaf of paper moving across the reading surface of a book. (That said, occasionally do I snap out of the experience and look for pixels, but generally the net result of the disruption is a positive, pleasing frisson at the reminder that I've got an omnibook full of magical changing paper in my hands.)