Kindle Talk Forum

mdibella · 11-19-2007, 01:19 PM

Amazon has already put up a forum (kindletalk.com) and one of the headers is 'Kindle vs Other E-Book Readers'.

The first posted question here (posted by the administrator no less!) is 'Does anyone own a Sony', and asks 'Why do you think it (the Sony reader) is not successful?'

Isn't this a bit like asking a politician 'When did you stop beating your wife?' I thought the Sony reader was doing well. Has anyone seen any official Sony info that indicates they consider it to be unsuccessful?

NatCh · 11-19-2007, 01:32 PM

Nope, just CNET repeating the same (pre)conclusion.

NatCh · 11-19-2007, 01:34 PM

I love this:

Quote:

The Sony readers are everywhere but have not had much success.

Sounds like he's saying that the Sony Readers are unsuccessful in spite of what he terms as being "everywhere" -- so ... what does he consider "success" if it's not widespread adoption?

mdibella · 11-19-2007, 01:40 PM

I know, that was my own reaction. If I were a lawyer I'd say 'assumes facts not in evidence'. 8-)

Hey, the Kindle looks nice (though I think the Sony is better designed from an ergonomic perspective) and I will likely end up owning a Kindle even though I already have a Sony 505.

It's just a shame that Amazon has to start out playing games like this. If the Kindle is truly competetive, it should stand on its own without needing forum administrators to plant silly questions like this one.

delphidb96 · 11-19-2007, 01:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mdibella

Amazon has already put up a forum (kindletalk.com) and one of the headers is 'Kindle vs Other E-Book Readers'.

The first posted question here (posted by the administrator no less!) is 'Does anyone own a Sony', and asks 'Why do you think it (the Sony reader) is not successful?'

Isn't this a bit like asking a politician 'When did you stop beating your wife?' I thought the Sony reader was doing well. Has anyone seen any official Sony info that indicates they consider it to be unsuccessful?

WEEEEeeeeeellll... I *think* the PRS is *not* successful on Amazon *because* Amazon chose to stop effectively marketing it once they chose to build that disgusting piece of cr*p, the Kindle! Of course, this is just my humble opinion.

And has anyone noticed the .AZW format ebooks *must* be downloaded directly to the Kindle? If you don't *have* a Kindle, you can't *download* them! (Which means that - even at the inflated $9.99 price - no one can download them to a PC, rename the extension to .mobi and read them in Mobipocket. Waitaminit!?! Did I just let slip that .azw files are merely .mobi files with a different extension?!? OOPS!!!

) Sitting out here with an .azw file posted elsewhere but open on my Cybook Gen3, right now.

No wonder they only allow the .azw titles to be downloaded through Whispernet!

Derek

Alexander Turcic · 11-19-2007, 01:56 PM

I am surprised they would make such a statement. In fact, first I couldn't believe this was an officially sanctioned Amazon site; but a whois on the domain reveals it's indeed Amazon owned.

JSWolf · 11-19-2007, 01:57 PM

Won't matter that AZW format might be PRC with a new extension if you can't buy them other then owning a Kindle

NatCh · 11-19-2007, 02:13 PM

I'm still waiting for my registration e-mail to come through, just so I can ask him how he defines "successful."

DaleDe · 11-19-2007, 07:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JSWolf

Won't matter that AZW format might be PRC with a new extension if you can't buy them other then owning a Kindle

AZW has a different protection than Mobi so DRM books will not play from one to the other so only non-DRM can play that trick. Although it might well work for samples.

Dale

NatCh · 11-19-2007, 09:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaleDe

AZW has a different protection than Mobi

Where did you see that tidbit? I've missed it, but I've had to do a lot of skimming.

DaleDe · 11-19-2007, 09:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NatCh

Where did you see that tidbit? I've missed it, but I've had to do a lot of skimming.

They say in the manual. They say Mobi DRM will not work so it has to be different. If that is not enough someone in the Kindle forum has already purchased a Kindle book and tried to read it with the Windows MobiReader. It detected the book but would not pass the DRM.

Dale

wallcraft · 11-19-2007, 09:26 PM

Until someone gets a Kindle and some downloaded DRM-ridden .AZW files I don't think we can know for sure, but I assume .AZW is identical to .MOBI. However, MOBI DRM is PID-based and the PID is presumably not easily available on the Kindle (since the Amazon servers already have the PID). Without the PID it won't be possible to make secure MOBI files for the Kindle.

One thing to check will be bytes 61-68 of the file. If this is BOOKMOBI, then this is evidence (although not definitive) that the file is using the standard MobiPocket format.

Edit: The DRM-free KindleUsersGuide.azw is a BOOKMOBI file.

kovidgoyal · 11-19-2007, 11:46 PM

From this discussion I gather that the binary PRC format has not been reverse engineered?

Brooks · 11-20-2007, 01:13 AM

Just to clear things up...

Kindletalk.com is neither owned by nor affiliated with Amazon.com. We utilize Amazon’s EC2 service to host our forums, which may explain why some users thought we were connected in some way with Amazon.

Kindletalk.com exists simply as an unbiased online community for Kindle users.

Thanks

Alexander Turcic · 11-20-2007, 02:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brooks

Just to clear things up...

Kindletalk.com is neither owned by nor affiliated with Amazon.com. We utilize Amazon’s EC2 service to host our forums, which may explain why some users thought we were connected in some way with Amazon.

Kindletalk.com exists simply as an unbiased online community for Kindle users.

Thanks

Thanks for the clarification, Brooks. Best to you. --Alex

11-19-2007, 01:19 PM	#1
mdibella Groupie Posts: 193 Karma: 1107 Join Date: Oct 2007 Device: Infinite Kindles, Occasional Sony's	Kindle Talk Forum Amazon has already put up a forum (kindletalk.com) and one of the headers is 'Kindle vs Other E-Book Readers'. The first posted question here (posted by the administrator no less!) is 'Does anyone own a Sony', and asks 'Why do you think it (the Sony reader) is not successful?' Isn't this a bit like asking a politician 'When did you stop beating your wife?' I thought the Sony reader was doing well. Has anyone seen any official Sony info that indicates they consider it to be unsuccessful?

11-19-2007, 09:26 PM	#12
wallcraft reader Posts: 6,977 Karma: 5183568 Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Mississippi, USA Device: Kindle 3, Kobo Glo HD	Until someone gets a Kindle and some downloaded DRM-ridden .AZW files I don't think we can know for sure, but I assume .AZW is identical to .MOBI. However, MOBI DRM is PID-based and the PID is presumably not easily available on the Kindle (since the Amazon servers already have the PID). Without the PID it won't be possible to make secure MOBI files for the Kindle. One thing to check will be bytes 61-68 of the file. If this is BOOKMOBI, then this is evidence (although not definitive) that the file is using the standard MobiPocket format. Edit: The DRM-free KindleUsersGuide.azw is a BOOKMOBI file. Last edited by wallcraft; 11-19-2007 at 09:32 PM.

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11-19-2007, 01:32 PM	#2
NatCh Gizmologist Posts: 11,615 Karma: 929550 Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Republic of Texas Embassy at Jackson, TN Device: Pocketbook Touch HD3	Nope, just CNET repeating the same (pre)conclusion.

11-19-2007, 01:40 PM	#4
mdibella Groupie Posts: 193 Karma: 1107 Join Date: Oct 2007 Device: Infinite Kindles, Occasional Sony's	I know, that was my own reaction. If I were a lawyer I'd say 'assumes facts not in evidence'. 8-) Hey, the Kindle looks nice (though I think the Sony is better designed from an ergonomic perspective) and I will likely end up owning a Kindle even though I already have a Sony 505. It's just a shame that Amazon has to start out playing games like this. If the Kindle is truly competetive, it should stand on its own without needing forum administrators to plant silly questions like this one.

11-19-2007, 01:56 PM	#6
Alexander Turcic Fully Converged Posts: 18,171 Karma: 14021202 Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Switzerland Device: Too many to count here.	I am surprised they would make such a statement. In fact, first I couldn't believe this was an officially sanctioned Amazon site; but a whois on the domain reveals it's indeed Amazon owned.

11-19-2007, 01:57 PM	#7
JSWolf Resident Curmudgeon Posts: 78,930 Karma: 143098300 Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Roslindale, Massachusetts Device: Kobo Libra 2, Kobo Aura H2O, PRS-650, PRS-T1, nook STR, PW3	Won't matter that AZW format might be PRC with a new extension if you can't buy them other then owning a Kindle

11-19-2007, 02:13 PM	#8
NatCh Gizmologist Posts: 11,615 Karma: 929550 Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Republic of Texas Embassy at Jackson, TN Device: Pocketbook Touch HD3	I'm still waiting for my registration e-mail to come through, just so I can ask him how he defines "successful."

11-19-2007, 11:46 PM	#13
kovidgoyal creator of calibre Posts: 45,144 Karma: 27110894 Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Mumbai, India Device: Various	From this discussion I gather that the binary PRC format has not been reverse engineered?

11-20-2007, 01:13 AM	#14
Brooks Junior Member Posts: 1 Karma: 10 Join Date: Nov 2007 Device: None	Just to clear things up... Kindletalk.com is neither owned by nor affiliated with Amazon.com. We utilize Amazon’s EC2 service to host our forums, which may explain why some users thought we were connected in some way with Amazon. Kindletalk.com exists simply as an unbiased online community for Kindle users. Thanks

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