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Dulin's Books · 12-02-2009, 08:48 PM

97% of climate scientists don't agree- that is an oft misquoted number that is used to try to stifle dissenting opinions. More accurate would be that 90% of climate scientists who have done work attributable to previous work done by Jones and Mann and Hansen et al and the models they built believe in AGW. The models may very well be wrong and with the release of the information it looks even more like they had doubts themselves and worked to make their models match their conclusions instead of making the models
accurate.

-You are correct there is evidence of increases in atmospheric CO2. The science on whether temperature rise is a cause or an effect of the increase is not settled. Several recently done studies of the actual ocean and of the historic data show the increase in CO2 is caused by warming not the other way around

-True to a point , the root of the dissent is in how much effect it has etc and the physics of the assertions by the climate scientists have been calle din question
http://icecap.us/images/uploads/Fals...ion_of_CO2.pdf

- Seas raise atmospheric temps not the other way around,
Land temps show variations and for the last 10 years or so have shown a decline and the southern hemisphere temps have not shown a marked increase even when the NH was showing increase

Coral bleaching is a result of ocean warming and acidification. the acidification is a result of the release of CO2 from lower depths during the warming and from agricultural runoff. The Atmosphere doesnt warm oceans. it is the other way round. There is a very good recent paper that describes the ocean mixing much better than i can in this space. ill dig it out.

that glaciers are receding ( and not all are some are growing see http://moef.nic.in/downloads/public-...per%20_him.pdf) is quite expected at teh end of what is called the little Ice Age. Receding glaciers do indicate climate change- but not necessarily AGW.

Large chunks of Antartica- well this recent article suggests there has been no warming over antartica for 30 years and they have discover teh reason http://news.scotsman.com/world/Antar...ing.5871004.jp

so atmospheric warming didnt cause the chunk to fall in the ocean. In fact the scientists most familiar with it have said that global warming couldn't be determined as the cause and that many other factors including fissure placement and depth were more determining factors. Also that the ice had actually been unstable for decades so the "sudden" collapse want actually sudden.

more about natural disasters later dinner time.

12-02-2009, 08:48 PM	#213
Dulin's Books Wizard Posts: 2,806 Karma: 13500000 Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Portland, OR Device: Boox PB360 etc etc etc	97% of climate scientists don't agree- that is an oft misquoted number that is used to try to stifle dissenting opinions. More accurate would be that 90% of climate scientists who have done work attributable to previous work done by Jones and Mann and Hansen et al and the models they built believe in AGW. The models may very well be wrong and with the release of the information it looks even more like they had doubts themselves and worked to make their models match their conclusions instead of making the models accurate. -You are correct there is evidence of increases in atmospheric CO2. The science on whether temperature rise is a cause or an effect of the increase is not settled. Several recently done studies of the actual ocean and of the historic data show the increase in CO2 is caused by warming not the other way around -True to a point , the root of the dissent is in how much effect it has etc and the physics of the assertions by the climate scientists have been calle din question http://icecap.us/images/uploads/Fals...ion_of_CO2.pdf - Seas raise atmospheric temps not the other way around, Land temps show variations and for the last 10 years or so have shown a decline and the southern hemisphere temps have not shown a marked increase even when the NH was showing increase Coral bleaching is a result of ocean warming and acidification. the acidification is a result of the release of CO2 from lower depths during the warming and from agricultural runoff. The Atmosphere doesnt warm oceans. it is the other way round. There is a very good recent paper that describes the ocean mixing much better than i can in this space. ill dig it out. that glaciers are receding ( and not all are some are growing see http://moef.nic.in/downloads/public-...per%20_him.pdf) is quite expected at teh end of what is called the little Ice Age. Receding glaciers do indicate climate change- but not necessarily AGW. Large chunks of Antartica- well this recent article suggests there has been no warming over antartica for 30 years and they have discover teh reason http://news.scotsman.com/world/Antar...ing.5871004.jp so atmospheric warming didnt cause the chunk to fall in the ocean. In fact the scientists most familiar with it have said that global warming couldn't be determined as the cause and that many other factors including fissure placement and depth were more determining factors. Also that the ice had actually been unstable for decades so the "sudden" collapse want actually sudden. more about natural disasters later dinner time.