View Single Post
Old 03-05-2025, 10:45 AM   #2563
Quoth
Still reading
Quoth ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Quoth ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Quoth ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Quoth ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Quoth ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Quoth ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Quoth ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Quoth ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Quoth ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Quoth ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Quoth ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Quoth's Avatar
 
Posts: 14,440
Karma: 107078855
Join Date: Jun 2017
Location: Ireland
Device: All 4 Kinds: epub eink, Kindle, android eink, NxtPaper
Quote:
Originally Posted by ratinox View Post
No, it doesn't necessarily make a "more realistic" moving image for some people such as myself. It sometimes triggers an uncanny valley response. It sometimes triggers simulator sickness.

While it might be more realistic FOR YOU, your preferences are not universal.
Digital and HD was a missed opportunity. About 11 fps to 18 fps is start of seeing motion rather than frames, unless you are a cavy. The 24 fps was a compromise and for a long time cinema has shown movies at 48 fps.

The 30 (USA) and 25 (Most of Europe) was chosen for three reasons:
1. Half the mains and interlace was used to reduce bandwidth by 1/2 so any detail more than two lines high is 60 Hz or 50 Hz. No flicker from studio lights.
2. The home TV power supply 1935 to early 1950s wasn't good so 30 or 25 locked to mains meant a hum bar was stationary, much less noticeable.
3. As close as possible to movie but also to limit transmission bandwidth. See also Interface.

Unfortunately the 30/60 scheme of North America is unsuited to 24 fps film. A 3:2 pull down scheme was adopted for telecine and later VHS. This means that because of interlace there are two film frames in the same interlaced video fram, so panning and horizontal movement creates a "comb" artefact. Later the 30 was changed to 29.97 for NTSC color. DVDs from movie film were stored at 24 fps 720 x 480 progressive and then player either did the 3:2 pull down for interlaced regular NTSC, or it was progressive at 60 fps via component connections.

The 50Hz regions played 24 fps Telecine and later VHS and DVD simply speeded up to 25/24ths. By the time of DVD the audio pitch was corrected by 25/24ths.

So while North American 60 fps progressive ditches the 3:2 artefact, it's still unnatural compared to 24, 48 or 50 fps playout when the source is a movie. Most 4K playback is 24 fps or 48 fps. HD from BD from Movie content varies with region, player and TV.


Progressive DVD players hardly sold at all in Europe / UK etc because there was no advantage for movies unlike NTSC (and the format is 720 x 576, so "PAL" region DVDs on "PAL" (or HDMI HD 50fps) screens are better than the "NTSC" regions (720 x 480 and progressive is a minimum!).

<rant>
We now have even more formats and frame rates for Digital than there was for NTSC / PAL / SECAM analogue era. Some are stupid.
HD should have been 2048 x 1152 @ 48 fps or @ 96 fps minimum for Widescreen 16:9 and 1536 x 1152 for 4:3 content.
But stupidly for 4K we have typically 24 fps. Really HD at 96 fps upscalled on the screen would look better.</rant>

Instead often screens are still sold so called "HD Ready" at 720 or 768 lines. HD transmitted often at 1440 x 1080 and interlaced, which makes upscalling hard. And 720p "HD" content an insult to former PAL region viewers who had 576i with no artefacts from DVD movies.

Last edited by Quoth; 03-05-2025 at 10:49 AM.
Quoth is offline   Reply With Quote