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Originally Posted by william z
You forgot grand opera, operettas, musical plays and Hollywood "musicals".
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I didn't forget them, well at least western opera and operetta, as they are more heavily based in musical traditions with the lyrics are generally written after and according to the music. That said, lyric poetry can and always has been later set to music as operatic librettos.
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Originally Posted by william z
Japanese Noh are plays combining dance, drama, music, and poetry and are only semi-popular in Japan and Chinese Opera is only popular in China. None of those things are poetry as such. People watch and listen to them, they do not read them. Songs are a combination of words (which may or may not be poetry) and music and are meant to be sung and listened to.
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Heh. "Only popular in China?" You are aware exactly how big that audience is? I guess it doesn't count, since it doesn't agree with you.
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Originally Posted by william z
Poetry is words meant to be read
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That is simply not true William. Five minutes on virtually any search engine would tell you that the definitions of the literary terms "Dramatic Poetry" and "Lyric Poetry" have always included either musical accompaniment or flat out singing.
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Originally Posted by william z
"... people like Dylan and Vreeswijk are a million miles away from the current top 10." And probably even further away than that to most readers of literature.
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I don't understand why it's so difficult to admit that there are other opinions on where the line is between lyrics and poetry, or that there even is a line. You seem to be conflating "American readers of literature (particularly those named William)" with "All readers of literature" when that's simply not the case. Which again, is my whole point. There are a lot of diverging opinions and some of the people who hold those differing opinions happen to be members of the Svenska Akadamien. And it's their decision, not yours, what is "Literature" according to the terms of Nobel's will.
But I'm done arguing, you've made your opinion quite clear.