[PatNY]

Originally Posted by jbjb

They weren't false quotes - as I explained, I think it was clear from context that I was paraphrasing. If you believe otherwise, I'll be more explicit in future. If you really believe that there was any deliberate attempt to mislead by misquoting you, then I find that genuinely offensive.

You were attempting to describe my position and you used quotes for words/phrases I never used. In that context it could be extremely misleading. I found that highly offensive, regardless of any intent.

Again, you miss the point. It's not possible to know (without inside knowledge) which apps were or were not using S&S for iOS5 and earlier, so how can you expect me to name one - even if I did you wouldn't believe me.

I am not asking you to show which apps used S&S. I am asking you to prove that there were easy and practical methods to scale iOS apps before iOS6. It should be an easy thing to do -- if in fact that were the case.

My assertion isn't that any particular app you might recognise was using it - it's simply that it was useable, and was used.

My assertion is that if it was not an easy and practical method to scale apps, then it was essentially useless for that purpose. It appears that was the case as you can't even give one link that discusses viable scaling methods prior to iOS6.

Again, we are not talking esoteric private apps shared among a few people. We are talking about apps widely used by the general public.

As I've always said, however, many developers chose to exploit the limited range of screens and chose to design optimal UIs for each.

Apparently, that was their only practical option up to iOS6. There was no other practical alternative. Essentially, they had no choice.

I've had enough of this - your mind is clearly predetermined.

So it appears is yours.

My position is plain:[LIST][*]iOS currently supports interface scalability

Agreed.

[*]For iOS5 and earlier, it supported a more limited form of scalability that was useful in some instances, but less widely than the auto layout introduced in iOS6.

Irrelevant. If it wasn't practical for the general iOS developer -- then I (and others) are correct in saying Apple's limited or non-existent scalability prior to iOS6 was a hindrance to the introduction of more varied screen sizes and resolutions.

[*]The relatively restricted range of screen parameters available for iOS makes designing an optimal layout for each of these more feasible than it is for Android, and many developers chose to do so.

This was never disputed.

[*]Claims that iOS doesn't support interface scalability are bogus.

What is true is this: Before iOS6 was introduced, iOS did NOT support easy and practical scalability in its apps the way Android has done from its beginning. This hindered Apple in its introduction of new screen sizes and resolutions.

This is not too different from my original claim -- the only difference being the time frame in question.

Because you refuse to attempt to prove that scalability was a viable alternative for developers prior to iOS6, I did a little research on my own. Now I know why you hemmed and hawed, refusing to look for any links to support your view. Because they essentially don't exist. You can't find something which doesn't exist!

If anything, scalability prior to iOS6 was only the province of a few developers like yourself producing esoteric private apps. It was not applicable to the general iOS development community or to consumer app development. Your point about it is essentially moot within the context of the conversation which spawned the issue -- the reasons why Apple did or didn't introduce more varied screen sizes in the past. Just because a few developers may have found a way to scale within the parameters of early iOS versions did not mean anything to Apple's train of thought at the time.

I did read an interesting comment from a developer who apparently has experience producing both Android and iOS apps. It came as a reply to an article announcing the introduction of iOS6 and Auto-Layout. The bold emphasis is mine:

The claim that the first release of iOS then contained any support of not only multiple resolutions, but also adaptive layout, resize and reflow capabilities (that is prevalent in WPF) is also highly suspect; there was only 1 device with 1 resolution to actually code for.

Not only that, if iOS had built-in support for the above from the beginning, iPhone apps would not have had the weird "stretched" look when used on an iPad. The fact was that the different aspect ratios between the iPhone/iPod Touch and iPad did not translate well if you did not code two distinct versions; Apple's iOS graphics framework did not contain inherent resolution-adaptive support. Every project we did we had to provide separate assets and UI code for the early low-res iPhones, then the higher-res iPhone and later-gen iPod touches, and then again for the iPad. Apple is only releasing AutoLayouts now because people are realizing that iOS IS fragmented, and they need to start building proper support if they ever intend to introduce more devices with different resolutions and aspect ratios - likely in the upcoming iPhone 5 - or be prepared to lose cross-developers developers like us....


On the other hand, (although not as robust as in later versions with the availability of Fragment in API 11), Android already had built-in support for multiple resolutions within a year of its release - simply because it was required. You could include multiple layout variants from the get-go, programatically and dynamically size views (what they call their controls/UI components) according to current display resolution and density settings. Since there is multiple resolution and layout support by default, an app developer can choose to use a single set of assets just layout and sized differently for different device, or simply provide different sets of assets that and use scaled layouts the same way as iOS does. Fragment support made it easier for developers to release a single app that caters to multiple devices with different specs - but the existing framework was already well capable of doing that, it just takes more work.

The link to the article and comments is here.

He is essentially saying the same things I said. I will take his word over yours.

In every article I saw about iOS6 and the new Auto-Layout feature (including the one I gave a link to) it was hailed as a breakthrough for iOS. A game changer. If scalability had been a practical alternative in the past -- or used widely in the past -- that would not have been the case.

--Pat