[Steven Lyle Jordan]

Originally Posted by Ralph Sir Edward

First, I argee with DM's response. He has it pegged.

Also agree. It was a good response. And so far as the response was also a reaction to the way I am perceived to be "telling" everyone what they ought to do, I understand the point.

Originally Posted by Ralph Sir Edward

How is it different from utterly refusing to change because somebody tells you to, and being the somebody demand another person do as they order? To me, they are just mirrors of each other.... And if they are mirrors, why is one acceptable to you, and not the other?

Let me mirror your original question back at you. Do you demand dominance for a reason, or just to enforce dominance?

I do not "demand dominance"... though if you insist on using such strong words, you could say I demand compliance... I would say I require compliance, but that's splitting hairs. Anyway, in the spirit of the question, if I did demand dominance (or require compliance), it would only be because I felt there was an overridingly good reason that it needed to be done, such as the preservation of life, or the upholding of a moral code.

I do happen to believe that the environment of this planet is in imminent peril of lasting damage that will be damaging to individual and overall all human life. I also believe that, because reversing these trends will be exceedingly difficult, becoming more difficult the longer we wait, that it is important that everyone do everything they can to start reversing these trends now... or else, we as a race have little chance. This, I'm sure, explains why I feel so strongly about trying to preserve the planet, and why I tend to speak of it in terms of necessity and compliance.

Unfortunately, I see this as a problem that has gone past the level of being solvable if "a few willing people" change, and the majority changes nothing. And any milder wording would only result in the minority acting, the majority doing nothing, and nothing being accomplished.

To tell you the truth: I know this is a fool's errand. The majority will refuse to change, either because they ignore the mild words, or rebel against the harsh words, making the efforts of the minority largely meaningless, until it is too late, and we have no choice. Our government needs to pour every dime they have into alternate energy research, and instead, they waste it guarding an oil-producing nation, while they insist on drilling more domestically. That strategy is going to sink us. But Americans will dutifully wait until their knees are wet before they'll change.

Well, I'm not waiting. I'm saying something now. If the harsh words tick off other people, that's just what will happen. Because I can't convince people to act by saying "pretty please."

To make my point, I provide logical reasoning, for example, my motorcycle story, or any other facts at my disposal... this I have done. I believe in my facts, and I defend them... until someone shows me where my facts are wrong, and I must accept new facts. I make my decisions based on these facts, as opposed to vague emotional positions, as often as possible.

In discussing the environment, I have offered facts, and I have refuted others' statements with more facts. I am willing to hear any facts that contradict mine, and force me to adapt to new facts.

Unfortunately, I can get frustrated in such discussions, because "I want to be left alone" and "you can't talk to me that way" aren't facts. A fact would be a statement like: "I have to idle my truck, because it is a 30 year old truck, and it often won't start, so I can't afford to shut it off, and I don't have the money to replace it."

That's a fact. Nothing I can say will change that fact. Idling discussion is over.

I may use harsh words, but they are not the only thing to my statements... they are only there to get people's attention, to get them to read the facts. And I state again, for the record, that if anyone has better facts, demonstrating why we should not take efforts to conserve, I want to hear them.

However, you don't need to say "I won't do it, because you didn't ask nice." That's a given. Asking nice is pointless. Acting is the only point.