Quote:
Originally Posted by sweevo
Anybody who can think rationally.
Deciding what is rational *should* be easy. Hint: beliefs without any evidence whatsoever to support them are not rational.
Would you call belief in elves rational?
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it is not my beliefs (or lack thereof) that are in question here. it is who gets to decide based on your statement. do you get to decide? for me? for astra? elfwreck, arrdeegee? what makes your beliefs (or lack thereof) completely right and anyone elses completely wrong?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Elfwreck
The problem isn't with the rationality, or lack thereof, of the beliefs. It's with the harmful actions taken because of the irrational beliefs. There's a limit to how much we allow a person's beliefs to excuse harmful behavior.
Force their kids to wear uncomfortable clothes? Okay. Scarves, turbans, plaid skirts in winter: all acceptable.
Force their kids to wear clothes that make their bodies unable to grow properly? Not okay. No foot binding, regardless of how important it is to your religion.
Force the neighbors to listen to annoying & disruptive chanting they don't want? Okay. For some levels of "annoying and disruptive."
Force the neighbors' garden to live without sunlight? Not okay; no building an 80' wall to the glory of your god.
Tell the person on the street that they're condemned to eternal punishment, hoping to shame and depress them into converting? Okay.
Start that punishment yourself, with fists? Not okay.
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yes, exactly. it is the
impact of beliefs on society and what harm they may cause.
if I believe the oak tree in my back yard is the home of a god and worship it, that doesn't cause any harm to anyone. on the other hand if I refuse to maintain that oaktree, claiming it may cause harm to the spirit in the tree and a branch falls off and kills someone, then my beliefs have a direct negative impact on society as a whole and need to be governed/cautioned.
Quote:
Originally Posted by tompe
And I decide for myself that irrational beliefs should be minimised because that reduces the harm of irrational beliefs. I even think it is easy to argue convincingly for that opinion.
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you can certainly decide for yourself what you believe to be rational or not, it is the action (or possibly inaction) that you take which are key and germane to the argument