MobileRead Forums - View Single Post - Buying a first 6" basic ereader my research and questions.

momentblur · 07-27-2010, 08:25 AM

First off hello,

I've been looking into getting an ereader for the last couple of weeks now and after the first couple of days when general reviews elsewhere were useful this quickly became almost the only place where I could could get useful up to date in depth info on most readers.

So Thankyou

So I'm new to this but have spent the last couple of weeks looking into it quite hard, and as always the more you know the more you know to question and I've got to the stage where I think I can ask partially informed questions and would really appreciate some feedback.

A few details:
I'm in the UK
I'm very limited in budget looking to spend £100 to £130 at most but completely happy to deal in the second hand market.
My main interest in a device will be simply to read fiction/non fiction. I have no ebooks at this minute and therefore am not as affected by format (not tied down by having 500 books already in one format say) Mainly this will be to read fiction although I would appreciate the ability to read some technical documents (more on this later)
I will be travelling for six months with this device it must have flash expansion.
I believe 6" is the screen size for me
Disregarding my wants or needs wifi devices are all outside my price range.
Due to my needs (travelling) Keyboards seem to add more weight and size than practical use (for me)
I have an ipod which I will carry any mp3 player is extraneous to needs (unfortunately also seems to come as standard :-( )
weight is a factor, although differences at this form factor are minimal
The only devices I've been able to see in person are a prs 600 and 300
I'm very happy to use calibre to convert files

A few prices for second hand market:
Sony prs 505: £110 to £130 - £150
Iriver Story: £100 upwards
Bebook one: £95 - 110
Cybook Gen3: £110
Cool-er £90 - 105

All delivered all that I have witnessed in the last week

What I (think I) Know/Where I stand

Sony prs 505

I saw a prs 600 next to a 300 and immediately understood how much sony shot themselves in the foot with this release. The main conversation here appears to be about the glare (which within a 5min viewing I did notice) but I was most struck by the complete difference in contrast between the models. I found the 600's quality of display utterly disappointing. Therefore I am uniterested in this model or any other reader with touch screen tech implemented on top of the eink screen (this does not include any wacom screens or stylus screens)
I did however like the build quality and appearance of both the 300 and 600 and therefore I looked into them on the net and discovered the 505.
It seems strange to me that what appears to be one of the most universally praised and well reviewed devices is so outdated. I almost feel an instinctive dislike to the idea of buying one simply because of it's age, also personally I believe their price is inflated out of proportion to other devices available.
I am extremely drawn by the huge loyal user community this device has, the custom firmware and the fact that although no longer officially supported you feel almost all kinks will already have been ironed out by users and if not there is 3rd party development continuing. from what I saw of the other two sony models I believe the appearance and build quality to be high. At one point I thought I would buy a 505 as soon as I saw one go cheeply but a I have held off due to a couple of worries.

The page turn speed.
The hardware setup is outdated (as far as I know) and from most reviews and videos I've seen newer devices with processors in the 400 mhz region do manage faster page turns, would you agree?
has the custom firmware or updates improved page turn speed at all?
video comparisons do make the menu and page navigation look sluggish next to newer devices ( I understand that I would probably get used to the longer blackout but if I do not need to as there are other products on the market which offer better why should I? ) As the page turn is probably going to be the point of interaction that you encounter most in using an ereader this seems important to me.

The balance of build quality against weight.
The sony weighs around 250g next to lighter ereaders at 180, partially for carrying (backpacking) but mainly just for comfort when holding if reading for hours.
I see this as a balanced equation. I lean towards the lighter devices but understand they will be less hardy and less pleasing as a physical item.
Has anyone any feeling on whether you do ever notice any excess weight in the sony? (ie wrist discomfort etc when holding for ageeeeeeees)

The three levels of zoom.
Although I believe I could read happily at the two smaller levels of zoom neither seemed perfectly sized and mainly the limitation just seems annoying against the 5,6, or 7 levels offered on other devices. Has anyone managed to address this?

I understand that the menu system and file support originally were annoying but believe these factors to have been removed by prs+ or other custom firmware and the widespread use of calibre

Any other thoughts / things I've missed?

Bebook one

I had originally been drawn to the bebook by the claims of diverse file compatability, but since reading up on calibre now feel that anything that handles epub's pdf's and a couple of other main formats will easily handle my needs in partnership with a little time converting.
I was put off by the spec (here I refer to the original spec at usb1.1, 4 shades of gray, and slower processor) and the impression I gained of it's general speed as a device.
I disregarded this device completely as it's price appeared completely comparable to better reviewed (prs 505) and spec'd devices (cool-er).

I then discovered the fact that Hanlin make the tech and other people rebrand and re sell these devices (if anyone could clarify exactly who sells Hanlins I would appreciate it)

Mainly that bebook replaced (with no fanfare) the bebook one with the bebook one 2010 edition which is in fact a Hanlin V3+ which means that it displays in 16 grays has the new higher standard 400 mhz processor
USB 2 rather than 1.1 and a couple of other differences

I Would therefore advise anyone in the UK buying a bebook to be very careful as resellers like Play.com and others all have the old spec of the device listed and may still be selling through old stock while bebook will be selling (in terms of hardware) a completely different device.

This makes buying in the second hand market extremely problematic and in reference to this I would highly appreciate it if anyone could let me know where exactly it says 2010 edition on the boxes of the new bebooks? is it a big splash across the front or in the small print?

I am highly tempted by the spec of the newer device but find it unlikely that I will be able to source one within my budget, although I believe the lack of knowledge on the difference in hardware may mean that the fleabay price for either model will be interchangeable.

Cool-er

I suppose an unfair intro to this section would be that my main question would be:

I know things aren't great but exactly how bad are they?

I am highly tempted by a cool-er disregarding the horrible slogan and branding from everything I've read the page turns are snappy as almost any out there and the minimal weight really appeals to me, admittedly the company has just gone bust and therefore long term support will be non existent.

I also believe these to be rebranded tech that is sold under multiple names, is this true? Which are the other brands?

Is there portable firmware from other manufacturers that is better than that provided by interead? or has any custom firmware been produced?

have their firmware updates removed any of the major niggles or made the menus more easily usable?

Iriver Story,

I believe this is probably a very well put together device but recently passed one up at around £100 delivered due to the fact that iriver appear to provide no support whatsoever outside of asia (minor annoyance) and mainly due to the fact that I don't see the need for a keyboard myself and therefore comes in at 284g while having a plastic (against sony's aluminium) body. Someone said that they thought the weight was the perfect balance between to light and solid, but I can only see it as a negative long term.
I also generally developed a feeling that although people were happy with the hardware noone had much faith in iriver or the provided firmware (re non-existent txt and doc support that it claims)
I'm still not sure if I shouldn't have bought it at the same time

Kindle

I was for some reason massively put off these devices early on partially due simply to amazon's approach to the market and their intense concentration (in terms of features) on the american market. But hey, what gives, their an american company...
Due to the fact that with calibre you can convert and side load almost anything on to a kindle (I belive?) I propably haven't done them justice in research.
But again, I am not interested in annotating currently, therefore any keyboard I carry is simply extra weight and size.

Cybook Gen 3

This is a device that I have only just started looking into recently and don't know that much about, any user knowledge on quality of firmware would be highly appreciated (mainly in terms of ease of use)

Mainly is there a multiple release history with this device? did it originally exist in the same way as the bebook with a different spec and an update has been released under the same name?

Gods I'm sick writing this and I applaud any that have got this far.

A couple of points on Calibre and PDF's

I have referenced a program called Calibre multiple times in this which is a file conversion (and editing?) program designed and maintained by Kovid Goyal.

I have to say I've never used this.
I apologise if anything I've said about it is wrong therefore.
Can you convert almost anything into almost snything succesfully with this? (if you get my meanig)
Also are PDF's convertible into Epub's and will they then be easier to read, in terms of layout and format on ereaders? (I apologise I get the feeling this question alone has a complex and subjective answer)

The whole issue with the readability of PDF's on different devices is one that confuses me quite highly as a newbie entering this medium/field..? Mainly I will want to read novels/bio/non fiction in a text only fashion meaning that I shouldn't run into PDF's much? (or is this untrue) but I would also appreciate the ability to read guides on adobe photoshop and lightroom as well as possibly guides on learning coding, either html or flash, Would all of these be PDF's or this is type of document also available as Epub's etc...
Also something like a lonely planet travel guide, do you expect to find anything that has a complex layout and possibly images included to only be available in PDF?

I feel like I've developed a general understanding of what it means if something reflows pdfs or not but if someone knows of a good defintion/explanation a link would be highly appreciated.

To anyone that's read all this thanks already for your time.
Any user feedback on any of these devices would be highly appreciated, if you think I've missed anything specific or just a general point that I may have overlooked...
I apologise if any of it is factually incorrect and any glaring errors I will correct in OP so that if anyone reads this hopefully they won't be getting misinformation.
I have gone into as much depth as I have in a single post in the hope all my research might help anyone else just starting to look off on the right foot.
I'm sure I've forgotten some stuff and will be back.

07-27-2010, 08:25 AM	#1
momentblur Member Posts: 11 Karma: 10 Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: England Device: Kindle 3 3G	Buying a first 6" basic ereader my research and questions. First off hello, I've been looking into getting an ereader for the last couple of weeks now and after the first couple of days when general reviews elsewhere were useful this quickly became almost the only place where I could could get useful up to date in depth info on most readers. So Thankyou So I'm new to this but have spent the last couple of weeks looking into it quite hard, and as always the more you know the more you know to question and I've got to the stage where I think I can ask partially informed questions and would really appreciate some feedback. A few details: I'm in the UK I'm very limited in budget looking to spend £100 to £130 at most but completely happy to deal in the second hand market. My main interest in a device will be simply to read fiction/non fiction. I have no ebooks at this minute and therefore am not as affected by format (not tied down by having 500 books already in one format say) Mainly this will be to read fiction although I would appreciate the ability to read some technical documents (more on this later) I will be travelling for six months with this device it must have flash expansion. I believe 6" is the screen size for me Disregarding my wants or needs wifi devices are all outside my price range. Due to my needs (travelling) Keyboards seem to add more weight and size than practical use (for me) I have an ipod which I will carry any mp3 player is extraneous to needs (unfortunately also seems to come as standard :-( ) weight is a factor, although differences at this form factor are minimal The only devices I've been able to see in person are a prs 600 and 300 I'm very happy to use calibre to convert files A few prices for second hand market: Sony prs 505: £110 to £130 - £150 Iriver Story: £100 upwards Bebook one: £95 - 110 Cybook Gen3: £110 Cool-er £90 - 105 All delivered all that I have witnessed in the last week What I (think I) Know/Where I stand Sony prs 505 I saw a prs 600 next to a 300 and immediately understood how much sony shot themselves in the foot with this release. The main conversation here appears to be about the glare (which within a 5min viewing I did notice) but I was most struck by the complete difference in contrast between the models. I found the 600's quality of display utterly disappointing. Therefore I am uniterested in this model or any other reader with touch screen tech implemented on top of the eink screen (this does not include any wacom screens or stylus screens) I did however like the build quality and appearance of both the 300 and 600 and therefore I looked into them on the net and discovered the 505. It seems strange to me that what appears to be one of the most universally praised and well reviewed devices is so outdated. I almost feel an instinctive dislike to the idea of buying one simply because of it's age, also personally I believe their price is inflated out of proportion to other devices available. I am extremely drawn by the huge loyal user community this device has, the custom firmware and the fact that although no longer officially supported you feel almost all kinks will already have been ironed out by users and if not there is 3rd party development continuing. from what I saw of the other two sony models I believe the appearance and build quality to be high. At one point I thought I would buy a 505 as soon as I saw one go cheeply but a I have held off due to a couple of worries. The page turn speed. The hardware setup is outdated (as far as I know) and from most reviews and videos I've seen newer devices with processors in the 400 mhz region do manage faster page turns, would you agree? has the custom firmware or updates improved page turn speed at all? video comparisons do make the menu and page navigation look sluggish next to newer devices ( I understand that I would probably get used to the longer blackout but if I do not need to as there are other products on the market which offer better why should I? ) As the page turn is probably going to be the point of interaction that you encounter most in using an ereader this seems important to me. The balance of build quality against weight. The sony weighs around 250g next to lighter ereaders at 180, partially for carrying (backpacking) but mainly just for comfort when holding if reading for hours. I see this as a balanced equation. I lean towards the lighter devices but understand they will be less hardy and less pleasing as a physical item. Has anyone any feeling on whether you do ever notice any excess weight in the sony? (ie wrist discomfort etc when holding for ageeeeeeees) The three levels of zoom. Although I believe I could read happily at the two smaller levels of zoom neither seemed perfectly sized and mainly the limitation just seems annoying against the 5,6, or 7 levels offered on other devices. Has anyone managed to address this? I understand that the menu system and file support originally were annoying but believe these factors to have been removed by prs+ or other custom firmware and the widespread use of calibre Any other thoughts / things I've missed? Bebook one I had originally been drawn to the bebook by the claims of diverse file compatability, but since reading up on calibre now feel that anything that handles epub's pdf's and a couple of other main formats will easily handle my needs in partnership with a little time converting. I was put off by the spec (here I refer to the original spec at usb1.1, 4 shades of gray, and slower processor) and the impression I gained of it's general speed as a device. I disregarded this device completely as it's price appeared completely comparable to better reviewed (prs 505) and spec'd devices (cool-er). I then discovered the fact that Hanlin make the tech and other people rebrand and re sell these devices (if anyone could clarify exactly who sells Hanlins I would appreciate it) Mainly that bebook replaced (with no fanfare) the bebook one with the bebook one 2010 edition which is in fact a Hanlin V3+ which means that it displays in 16 grays has the new higher standard 400 mhz processor USB 2 rather than 1.1 and a couple of other differences I Would therefore advise anyone in the UK buying a bebook to be very careful as resellers like Play.com and others all have the old spec of the device listed and may still be selling through old stock while bebook will be selling (in terms of hardware) a completely different device. This makes buying in the second hand market extremely problematic and in reference to this I would highly appreciate it if anyone could let me know where exactly it says 2010 edition on the boxes of the new bebooks? is it a big splash across the front or in the small print? I am highly tempted by the spec of the newer device but find it unlikely that I will be able to source one within my budget, although I believe the lack of knowledge on the difference in hardware may mean that the fleabay price for either model will be interchangeable. Cool-er I suppose an unfair intro to this section would be that my main question would be: I know things aren't great but exactly how bad are they? I am highly tempted by a cool-er disregarding the horrible slogan and branding from everything I've read the page turns are snappy as almost any out there and the minimal weight really appeals to me, admittedly the company has just gone bust and therefore long term support will be non existent. I also believe these to be rebranded tech that is sold under multiple names, is this true? Which are the other brands? Is there portable firmware from other manufacturers that is better than that provided by interead? or has any custom firmware been produced? have their firmware updates removed any of the major niggles or made the menus more easily usable? Iriver Story, I believe this is probably a very well put together device but recently passed one up at around £100 delivered due to the fact that iriver appear to provide no support whatsoever outside of asia (minor annoyance) and mainly due to the fact that I don't see the need for a keyboard myself and therefore comes in at 284g while having a plastic (against sony's aluminium) body. Someone said that they thought the weight was the perfect balance between to light and solid, but I can only see it as a negative long term. I also generally developed a feeling that although people were happy with the hardware noone had much faith in iriver or the provided firmware (re non-existent txt and doc support that it claims) I'm still not sure if I shouldn't have bought it at the same time Kindle I was for some reason massively put off these devices early on partially due simply to amazon's approach to the market and their intense concentration (in terms of features) on the american market. But hey, what gives, their an american company... Due to the fact that with calibre you can convert and side load almost anything on to a kindle (I belive?) I propably haven't done them justice in research. But again, I am not interested in annotating currently, therefore any keyboard I carry is simply extra weight and size. Cybook Gen 3 This is a device that I have only just started looking into recently and don't know that much about, any user knowledge on quality of firmware would be highly appreciated (mainly in terms of ease of use) Mainly is there a multiple release history with this device? did it originally exist in the same way as the bebook with a different spec and an update has been released under the same name? Gods I'm sick writing this and I applaud any that have got this far. A couple of points on Calibre and PDF's I have referenced a program called Calibre multiple times in this which is a file conversion (and editing?) program designed and maintained by Kovid Goyal. I have to say I've never used this. I apologise if anything I've said about it is wrong therefore. Can you convert almost anything into almost snything succesfully with this? (if you get my meanig) Also are PDF's convertible into Epub's and will they then be easier to read, in terms of layout and format on ereaders? (I apologise I get the feeling this question alone has a complex and subjective answer) The whole issue with the readability of PDF's on different devices is one that confuses me quite highly as a newbie entering this medium/field..? Mainly I will want to read novels/bio/non fiction in a text only fashion meaning that I shouldn't run into PDF's much? (or is this untrue) but I would also appreciate the ability to read guides on adobe photoshop and lightroom as well as possibly guides on learning coding, either html or flash, Would all of these be PDF's or this is type of document also available as Epub's etc... Also something like a lonely planet travel guide, do you expect to find anything that has a complex layout and possibly images included to only be available in PDF? I feel like I've developed a general understanding of what it means if something reflows pdfs or not but if someone knows of a good defintion/explanation a link would be highly appreciated. To anyone that's read all this thanks already for your time. Any user feedback on any of these devices would be highly appreciated, if you think I've missed anything specific or just a general point that I may have overlooked... I apologise if any of it is factually incorrect and any glaring errors I will correct in OP so that if anyone reads this hopefully they won't be getting misinformation. I have gone into as much depth as I have in a single post in the hope all my research might help anyone else just starting to look off on the right foot. I'm sure I've forgotten some stuff and will be back.