What about Mein Kampf by Adolf Hitler? Or would it fit in more next year when we read history?

http://www.amazon.com/Mein-Kampf-Ado.../dp/817224164X
https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/54270.Mein_Kamp

No, never! I find that highly offensive. Please take back your nomination.

I disagree here. Discussing a YA book is not just about what it says to children. You can discuss a YA book on it's own merits.

I think its own merits are inextricably tied to its function as a children's book. I admit, however, YA is uninteresting to me as a topic of discussion unless I read it with a child of the appropriate age. I know that's very much a MMV situation.

I'll third Beloved.

You might consider listening to it then, as a refresher. The Audible version is quite well done. I'm pretty sure I have it in one of my accounts already, but I suspect I'll re-read it in eBook format.

On the debate over YA, I'm somewhere in the middle of what's been discussed here so far but seeing issybird disparage it I would like to stick up for it.

I really like YA. I don't read it all the time but when I get to it I enjoy it and have many YA books on my to-read list, as issybird probably knows, in addition to having nominated YA books for the club from time to time and nominating the category this year and the other. I think what it is that I like about them is that many feature main characters full of wonder at the world with the sense that anything can happen in their lives, usually because they are young with an entire unmapped life ahead. But even without that, there's almost always a sense of discovery in YA and sometimes a sense of adventure without necessarily dissolving into the "action" or even "thriller" genres. These things can happen in non-YA adult fiction as well, but it happens more consistently in YA.

I think anyone with a sense of the kid within us all can enjoy YA or even children's lit. Some people outgrow it, sure, and some people need the crutch of reading to or with a child to let themselves enjoy it but there are those of us who are adults yet still aren't embarrassed to acknowledge that we can read YA, by ourselves, with pleasure if it's a good book. I may be closer to a "young adult" than some others here (though, alas, my days of having "young" attached are probably well over) but I don't think it's really about age, it's more about having a curious and open mind just as interested in the exploration that young adult books often provide as in other book genres.

As to their discussability, I would partly agree with issybird that they generally offer somewhat less to discuss between adults, but I would never paint a broad stroke saying they all are, or even most. For instance, I think there could be a great adult discussion regarding the politics behind The Hunger Games (especially District 13 and the last book). I also think The Giver could've generated a wonderful adult discussion concerning many of its themes and its ending. The Chronicles of Narnia could generate a terrific discussion on the religious aspects of the book(s) and The Northern Lights also in the opposite direction. Then there's To Kill a Mockingbird which is basically YA, The Fault in Our Stars, The Catcher in the Rye, Lord of the Flies, the superb The Perks of Being a Wallflower, and I could go on and on. All could spur some really meaningful discussion within a group of adults.

On the other hand, many adults books don't generate much discussion here. What does it matter how good a book could be to discuss if we don't end up getting much discussion on it? From both clubs, these books all generated 10 or less replies in the discussion thread: The Count of Monte Cristo, American Gods, Ivanhoe, Peer Gynt and Turn, Magic Wheel. There are more but I focused on more substantial fare.

Taking all that into consideration, I really don't see a big to-do about a YA book winning here or there if that's what's voted in. Depending on the book it could possibly generate a better or even deeper discussion than some more adult and more serious books that have won. Certainly I wouldn't want to see YA winning all the time but we're not in danger of that; looking back since I've joined close to five years ago, we rarely have books that could be called anything near YA winning - The Princess Bride is all really, and it generated two and a half times more replies than the previously mentioned discussion threads.

All that said, I may not be voting for many YA books this month because I've read most of those nominated. I'm more hoping something I haven't read wins than worrying about YA or not. Also, I'd agree with issybird on Harry Potter - while it's a great book and while the later books in the series which are longer and more mature may have some meat to discuss, the first book is very basic and I don't see much discussion other than "I liked it" or "I'd be Gryffindor". Besides, hasn't like 99% of the world already read it? :p

P.S. - For what it's worth re Harry Potter,

For some of the less discussed books, length has been an issue. I personally try to nominate books that are <350 pages. Something that most people (even the non-bookworms or those that don't have hours to read every day) can read in a week or two without much problem.

For Harry Potter the number that have already read it is probably high. I don't really want to re-read it because I will be doing that when my son gets older.

I didn't.

What I did say, and you seem to agree at least in part, is that it doesn't offer that much for adults to discuss. Just for the record, not only did I acknowledge already having read three of the four YA books nominated (one great, one entertaining, and one absolutely dreadful), I'm also currently reading a YA book, Swallowdale by Arthur Ransome, the second of his wonderful Swallows and Amazons series, which book I unaccountably missed out when I read the rest as a kid, no doubt because my library didn't have it. But I don't think there's much to say about it; it's just a light summer read. I like kidlit, even picture books, but it needs a kid.

So, you're banning a book from the banned book category.

So that really made me laugh. :thumbsup::rofl:

I'm Jewish and I find that book highly offensive for a number of reasons. I would hope others would understand and nobody would second this one.

Regarding the idea of YA literature being a good category for group discussion . . . Sometime yes I would say and sometimes no. It really depends on the book. I've only read the first of the series of Harry Potter books (not seen any of the films), but to me based on just that it's a good entertaining book at the YA level and obviously was immensely popular, but as far as any discussion beyond the fan universe what would it consist of?

On the other hand I recall reading Laughing Boy when I was in the range of 11-13 years old (memory fades with age I only know where my family was living at the time I read it) and it is a book I feel even adults might enjoy reading. In any case there is plenty to discuss about it.





So which YA book was "absolutely dreadful?" I've only read the Harry Potter book out of the YA nominees so far.

I'm a human being and I find that book highly offensive. I even read it, a very long time ago, because I was curious. Just the same, it's a very slippery slope when you start saying something can't or shouldn't be read. Why? Because we're a bunch of incipient proto-Fascists who can't be counted on to resist the evil message? Look at what's happening at Duke right now as evidence of where this kind of reaction leads.

Just the same, I think it would be a terrible choice and should be opposed on that basis. Given that it is highly offensive, it would only be interesting to discuss it on its historical terms, in light of what it said to and about Germany in the run-up to the Nazi era, and we're hardly eqipped to do that here.

However, I can't imagine anyone would want it to be chosen, so I think the nomination is best left to seek oblivion on its own.

Since I think I've probably implied my reactions anyway:

Golden Compass - Very good, rather dark and probably could be discussed with interest.

Harry Potter - Light entertainment, no real substance

Perks of Being a Wallflower - Not good, written to be "relevant" and it sinks under the weight of all that relevance. I read it at the behest of my then 13-year old niece, who thought it was wonderful and I can see why a kid of that age would find a lot of depth in it.

I think you are correct here. I'll just ignore this one and let the nomination die on it's own. It was a poor choice in bad taste and I won't be saying any more about it unless someone else decides to second it.