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Old 09-01-2010, 05:31 AM   #1
zeb
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PDF annotation on Kindle 3 question

Hi,

I have seen that finally it is possible to use annotations and highlights on PDFs on the new Kindle 3. I have a question about it:
  1. how are these annotations stored? Are they in a separate file?
  2. is it possible to download them? Do they keep the page number/note position?

Thanks!
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Old 09-02-2010, 05:15 PM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zeb View Post
Hi,

I have seen that finally it is possible to use annotations and highlights on PDFs on the new Kindle 3. I have a question about it:
  1. how are these annotations stored? Are they in a separate file?
  2. is it possible to download them? Do they keep the page number/note position?

Thanks!
I believe (I don't have my Kindle or its manual to confirm) that they are stored in a separate file that holds all your notes, clippings, etc. At least this is the case for PDF files (other Kindle specific files may store the annotations directly with the file).

It is possible however, to get that file as the user's manual even states how to get at it. In terms of PDF's, I'm not exactly sure how it works, but I would imagine that there is some type of location index. Others might know for sure. The K3 is my first e-reader, and I am hopeful to use it for PDF's with respect to my work and research. I just haven't had a chance to try it out.
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Old 09-03-2010, 05:42 PM   #3
Slingsby
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I've been annotating PDF files (from Google Books). All the notes go into a text file called "My Clippings." This displays all the notes, sorted by page number, in this format:

==========
[Name of PDF file] (Author's name, pulled from PDF metadata I guess])
- Note Page 20 | Added on Thursday, August 26, 2010, 10:39 PM

here is the text of my note
==========
next note in same title / page date // note format

It is easy to copy the notes to my computer when the Kindle is on the USB cable & mounted as a drive on my desktop.

Note the PDF note is keyed only to the page number -- the machine can't get the text from the PDF images. As I have become aware of this, I have been developing the habit of making the notes in complete sentences & with whatever information I would need to understand the note w/o being able to view the text that inspired it.

Also curious is all the notes are sorted by page number, regardless of work. I just brought over a week's worth of notes and it is amusing to see notes for various works all sorted together by page number (and not sorted by work, then page number). In other words, in the "My Clippings" file a note on Book A for page 85 and a note on Book for page 85 are in sequence, just before a note on A for page 86.

I am sure I could re-sort them by pasting the text file into Excel, if that is ever necessary.

Hope this answers your question.

Last edited by Slingsby; 09-03-2010 at 05:45 PM.
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Old 09-03-2010, 06:15 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Slingsby View Post
Also curious is all the notes are sorted by page number, regardless of work. I just brought over a week's worth of notes and it is amusing to see notes for various works all sorted together by page number (and not sorted by work, then page number). In other words, in the "My Clippings" file a note on Book A for page 85 and a note on Book for page 85 are in sequence, just before a note on A for page 86.
That's weird. My Clippings used to be just a flat .txt file, and a copy of all notes, bookmarks, etc. was added, as you made them. Which makes sense, since a .txt file is just a plain byte stream. The originals of notes, etc. was kept in the .mbp file for each book. The My Clippings copy was just an extra copy. Of course, I don't know where they would keep per-book stuff for pdf files. I have a K1, so no way to try it. I have no need of pdfs anyway.
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Old 09-03-2010, 06:48 PM   #5
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This actually was a huge issue for me which convinced me to get an Ipad.....But I still do have a kindle 3 coming so I hope Amazon continuously improves their software

Im sure a programmer could possibly create an app and somehow use that clippings.txt file to convert it to its associated pdf ? The biggest deal for me is when I take all those notes and bookmarks they are just inserted into that text file.....When I go to open the pdf in the computer or another device all my notes and bookmarks arent there......

Here is a link also that talks about it some more it is nearly a year old but the information is still relevant ..... ::

http://www.threadpartners.com/blog/?p=47

You would think they would have tried to improve on this by now
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Old 09-03-2010, 07:15 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zeb View Post
Hi,

I have seen that finally it is possible to use annotations and highlights on PDFs on the new Kindle 3. I have a question about it:
  1. how are these annotations stored? Are they in a separate file?
  2. is it possible to download them? Do they keep the page number/note position?

Thanks!
Yes, K3 has full annotation.
Yes, on the K2 there is a binary file with a ".pdr" extension. I would guess that the K3 uses the same format but stores annotation/highlights there. When I viewed the content of my files I could see the page numbers where I had my book marks.

Yes, just copy the pdr. However unlike the Mobi equivlemnt "mdp" I don't know of any software that allows you to view the pdr associated with a PDF, except for the Kindle. It would be nice if Amazon 4 PC updated or calibre (hint, hint)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Slingsby View Post
I've been annotating PDF files (from Google Books). All the notes go into a text file called "My Clippings."
Amazon just did this for convenience. It duplicates the highlights and bookmarks and places it in one text file. It was designed to allow people to get content off of the Kindle for reports, quotes, and such. The original date is stored in an MDP file. (If you manually edit the txt file you will see those annotations still exist in your book.)


Quote:
Originally Posted by djk80 View Post
This actually was a huge issue for me which convinced me to get an Ipad.....But I still do have a kindle 3 coming so I hope Amazon continuously improves their software
Does the iPad have a good PDF editing software? Can you modify an PDF in the iPad and view those changes in any PDF reader?

Quote:
Originally Posted by djk80 View Post
Im sure a programmer could possibly create an app and somehow use that clippings.txt file to convert it to its associated pdf ? The biggest deal for me is when I take all those notes and bookmarks they are just inserted into that text file.....When I go to open the pdf in the computer or another device all my notes and bookmarks arent there......
Yes there are a few macros that help one extract data from the clipping.txt file easily.

That is because the PDF is not modified, all annotations are it's inserted to another file.

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Old 09-03-2010, 07:37 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by =X= View Post
Amazon just did this for convenience. It duplicates the highlights and bookmarks and places it in one text file. It was designed to allow people to get content off of the Kindle for reports, quotes, and such. The original date is stored in an MDP file. (If you manually edit the txt file you will see those annotations still exist in your book.)
Thank you, X, for clarifying this. I saw the .mdp files but have not tried to open them on my Mac.

The User's Guide points to the "My Clippings" file as the place where we will find our notes if we want to export them to our computers.

The notes that I have made on the Google Books 1828 novel display as superscript numbers once I have made them. Clicking on the number pulls up the note I wrote, and then I can edit the note as well. There is a way to display all the notes I've made on the PDF at once, but this displays each note as attached to the first three lines of text in the Google cover page.

On the Kindle, from the menu inside the PDF, "View My Notes . . .", I then see

Showing all 184 Marks & Notes

Page 18

Thisisadigitalcopyofabookthatwaspreservedforgenera tion
tomaketheworld'sbooksdiscoverableonline. etc etc

with my note at the bottom in a bubble.

One more detail about adding notes to this kind of PDF file -- when you move the insertion point on the page, the Kindle does not always recognize every white space between words as a possible insertion point. On same pages it does, but on others it will only allow me to insert a note in two or three random spaces on the half page I'm viewing.

All in all, I am pleased with the experience of reading the novel on the Kindle and like the note-making functions. Maybe I should have had higher expectations!

P.S. Experimenting further with the "My Clippings" file & annotations from multiple books, I am not sure what is the way they are collated together. That stretch by page number may have been a coincidence. Most of the notes are in chronological order but not all. Either way, it is a raw lumping together.

Last edited by Slingsby; 09-03-2010 at 07:58 PM.
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