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Old 06-22-2010, 08:16 AM   #1
Logseman
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Arizonan restrictive law backfires



Here we have a small comment on the effects of the Arizonan restrictions for illegal immigrants in relationship to work. I must say I'm quite surprised by the numbers stated in the news (11% of Arizonan workers were illegal immigrants before the bill).
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Old 06-22-2010, 09:42 AM   #2
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Can of worms just opened. I think I'll save my politicking for the real world on this one.

(For the record, I don't believe in borders or countries and nobody, in my eyes, can ever be illegal just by standing on one piece of ground or another.)
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Old 06-22-2010, 10:02 AM   #3
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How is it racist to want a legal process for immigration?
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Old 06-22-2010, 10:07 AM   #4
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How is it racist to want a legal process for immigration?
You might wanna ask xxmkerror on youtube, who uploaded the video and named it, that.
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Old 06-22-2010, 10:10 AM   #5
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How is it racist to want a legal process for immigration?
I give in...how is it?

Last edited by TGS; 06-22-2010 at 10:11 AM. Reason: Typo
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Old 06-22-2010, 10:11 AM   #6
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I might.

I'm not trying to start shit with people....by the way.

I just really want to know what is wrong with wanting a legal process for immigration.
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Old 06-22-2010, 10:24 AM   #7
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I just really want to know what is wrong with wanting a legal process for immigration.
There's nothing wrong with that. The problem is the immigration process has completely changed from the days of Ellis Island (and Angel Island). Back then, poor people who were constantly shat upon by Europe (and Asia), were allowed to come here legally in the hopes of a better future for them and their children.

However, we don't allow poor people in anymore. So if you live in a dirt farm in Guatemala, and wish you could learn to read and write and make a better life for you an yours... you're pretty much SOL.

"Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,
I lift my lamp beside the golden door!"

Last edited by clarknova; 06-22-2010 at 10:29 AM.
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Old 06-22-2010, 10:32 AM   #8
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We do need to fix immigration laws. I just dont think that a "free-for-all" no accountability approach is the correct way to go about it.

The rest of the world cannot expect the US to be the only country without boarders.
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Old 06-22-2010, 10:38 AM   #9
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We do need to fix immigration laws. I just dont think that a "free-for-all" no accountability approach is the correct way to go about it.

The rest of the world cannot expect the US to be the only country without boarders.
Does the rest of the world expect that?

You're fighting windmills.
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Old 06-22-2010, 12:40 PM   #10
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The rest of the world cannot expect the US to be the only country without boarders.
It has lots of boarders; that's the whole issue, isn't it?
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Old 06-22-2010, 12:50 PM   #11
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It has lots of boarders; that's the whole issue, isn't it?
yeah, too many boarders un-interested in the duties and responsibilities of citizenship.

when I lived in Germany there was a HUGE guest worker (gast arbiter) program. mostly people from Turkey, Greece, and a variety of African countries. worked pretty well for them. it would appear to take care of a lot of problems... documenting status, paying taxes, tracking of residence and so on
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Old 06-22-2010, 02:40 PM   #12
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Yep, amazing what happens when you don't try and impose restrictive limits on numbers.
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Old 06-22-2010, 04:35 PM   #13
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There's nothing wrong with that. The problem is the immigration process has completely changed from the days of Ellis Island (and Angel Island). Back then, poor people who were constantly shat upon by Europe (and Asia), were allowed to come here legally in the hopes of a better future for them and their children.

However, we don't allow poor people in anymore. So if you live in a dirt farm in Guatemala, and wish you could learn to read and write and make a better life for you an yours... you're pretty much SOL.
The borders haven't quite been as open and welcoming as you paint them:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History..._United_States

But that aside, just because something was done a certain way in the past is not an argument that it should always be done that way. The United States has over 300,000,000 people at this moment-- and if the borders were fully open, that number would explode even more-- and it wouldn't be lifting those people up, it would be dragging the rest of the country down, depressing wages and increasing welfare. The deep, deep trouble this country is in is NOT going to be helped by allowing in millions more poor, undereducated people. IMHO, there is no shame is saying "we're sorry conditions are bad in your country, but we're full now."

A man is standing in an elevator car with 30 people in it-- the floor is sagging, the cable is creeking, but 50 more people are trying to squeeze their way in the car. "Why not," he asks "we've always let people in before."
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Old 06-22-2010, 06:14 PM   #14
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[Censoring myself.]

Last edited by clarknova; 06-22-2010 at 10:00 PM. Reason: Arguing politics on the internet is like arguing politics IRL -- pointless and stupid.
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Old 06-22-2010, 06:35 PM   #15
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Okay here's what's racist about it:
A stop is made because a tail light is out. Because the driver has an accent, or is brown, or dresses differently then he is asked for a passport or other documentation in addition to the driver's license to demonstrate that he is here legally. If it isn't produced then he could be detained. This person could be a naturalized citizen but now has to carry identification that other Americans do not. Even Arnold Schwarzenegger said his accent would get him detained in Arizona.
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