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Old 06-06-2010, 12:24 AM   #1
CoolDragon
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Thumbs down "page view continuous" mode disabled


I believe this deserves a new thread, although it has been mentioned in various threads.

If you have used DR800 to view a PDF file in landscape mode, you know what I am talking about. Astonishingly, DR1000 has a "page view continuous" mode which obviously is intentionally disabled on DR800.

Comparing the file system between dr1000 and dr800 (http://www.mobileread.com/forums/sho...8&postcount=50), you will realize that this is disabled during compilation. All the required things: icons, status bar, menu bar etc that relates to this "continuous" mode do not exist in dr800.

I cannot understand those marketing guys for the reason behind this. To justify the extra money of dr1000? To sell more dr1000? Whatever. Don't they understand this will make people (especially people reading technical PDFs) choose dr800 over other devices?
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Old 06-06-2010, 01:37 AM   #2
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can't believe.

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Old 06-06-2010, 01:46 AM   #3
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I am really really pissed off. Initially I thought they will eventually add these functions. From the truth revealed now, I think they don't want the DR800 a good product from the very beginning.

The developers in IREX look really idiotic. The bug with 15 pixels cut off at edge can even exist in a firmware release. They whole department responsible for this should be fired immediately.

With Sony greatly lower the price for their EINK devices, and IPAD gave a big hit, too, what is IREX thinking? If I have not bought a DR800SG already, I would not consider to buy one now. And I would not recommend anyone to buy one.
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Old 06-06-2010, 06:01 AM   #4
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Originally Posted by overdrunk View Post
I am really really pissed off. Initially I thought they will eventually add these functions. From the truth revealed now, I think they don't want the DR800 a good product from the very beginning.

The developers in IREX look really idiotic. The bug with 15 pixels cut off at edge can even exist in a firmware release. They whole department responsible for this should be fired immediately.

With Sony greatly lower the price for their EINK devices, and IPAD gave a big hit, too, what is IREX thinking? If I have not bought a DR800SG already, I would not consider to buy one now. And I would not recommend anyone to buy one.
I'm not going to comment the whole of your message, but I feel urged to add a simple musing to think: have you noted that this is not the final version, just a prerelease made available to general public in order to test for errors? If you don't stand surprises, please use only stable versions. If you want to contribute, test and be polite.
[and yes, the bottom lines bug is huge]
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Old 06-06-2010, 06:02 AM   #5
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While I too believe that continuous page view is necessary on the DR800 (and Gertjan has said that it will be available in a future release, just not 2.0) I believe that outrage needs to be held off for now.

As of yet there is no official response as to if continuous page view is disabled or not on the DR800. Even though there is possible evidence to support that I would suggest staying non-confrontational and simply asking the devs for a comment.

I sure know that I wouldn't want to respond to someone that I feel was attacking me for something that I am trying to help out on but that is not fully in my control to decide.

In the end, continuous zoom was never promised as a feature of the DR800. You bought it without that and were never promised it. You can't particularly be outraged about that.

Sorry about the rant I just notice a lot of people getting aggressive over bugs\features that are missing in experimental releases of software and it doesn't seem very constructive if we wish to maintain a dialog with the devs here.

PD: This isn't directed necessarily towards CoolDragon or anyone in particular so please don't take offense.
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Old 06-06-2010, 10:56 AM   #6
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That is true, there is no need to attack the IREX developers. It is so nice that IREX shows up here and listen to our needs and comments. On the other hand, it just gives an impression that IREX is rushing sotware releases with so many big bugs to meet some deadlines.

First, they released a firmware with no go to page option, no pdf zoom option and IREX asked us "so tell us what is missing"... And beta release with limited flip bar function. They again asked us to tell them what is missing. Now the third trial, and major bugs besides flip bar problem.

What I am trying to say is that, these are really obvious bugs and anybody who can spend 10 minutes with the device can find these major problems. They did not have to release beta versions to get the feedback about these major bugs.

That is true Sony, Kindle or others are not asking user's opinons to revise the firmware but they are also releasing less painfull more robust firmware versions.

Still, we love IREX DR800, and IREX developers should not be offended by the comments. We do comment on the device since we do care about the product.
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Old 06-06-2010, 12:06 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by akey View Post
While I too believe that continuous page view is necessary on the DR800 (and Gertjan has said that it will be available in a future release, just not 2.0) I believe that outrage needs to be held off for now.

In the end, continuous zoom was never promised as a feature of the DR800. You bought it without that and were never promised it. You can't particularly be outraged about that.
Considering that v2 carrot has been dangled for half a year now. I am counting from when it was promised, not from when it was promised to be available . Although availability is also slipping at an alarming rate - two month and it's still RC1. When do you think next future release will be available ? Christmas 2011?
And no the continuous zoom was not promised specifically (I personally just wait for B&N epub wireless delivery to be there), but better pdf reading with zoom was promised and just disabling some stuff (if it's true) doesn't really qualify as bettering pdf reading experience, now does it?
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Old 06-06-2010, 12:18 PM   #8
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Now I guess the Irex devs are under major pressure from management to get software, any software out to counter the bad pr over the initial release dates ( for the initial product release, firmware updates, etc ).
I assume that the Irex management are as brain dead as they are in most small software companies in that investing in time in setting up regression environment is an investment well spent. (My boss has blocked all attempts at doing a nightly build let alone regression testing, he sees it as a waste of time. But then the company just keeps churning customers, wonder why )

As for the continuous mode issue, I assume that this was in 1.7.1 so it had to be in the 1000 v2.0 release, and I assume that there is a good bit of maths involved relating to the screen postioning which was lifted from the 1.7.1 firmware, it had to be restricted to the 1000 firmware. Hence at some point, the Irex devs will have to write code that dynamically handles the different screen sizes. But this sort of stuff takes a long, long time to write and test.
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Old 06-06-2010, 04:09 PM   #9
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I don't want this thread to cause any attack on IREX developers. The biggest challenge for them is the converging from the original dr1000s code base and sharing the code base with dr800s. Given the time frame they have to deliver for both devices, I will say the developers have done a pretty good job. And don't forget how they are actively involved in the discussion on this forum.

Another point I would like to make is the difference between feature/unfeature and bugs. Features or no features are defined by marketing and management, bugs are caused by developers and testers. I completely understand the bugs in the firmware releases, especially these are not official releases. However, the "disabling of certain feature between similar products" is a common strategy from most companies to differentiate products, and it is a fine line to walk.

For this particular case, it is as simple as a manager/marketing decision, no developers should ever be involved. @Jumpn Jack Flash, this feature should not have any dependency on the screen size. If it does, then it is a super stupid software design. Does resizing the window size on any desktop PDF software affects the continuous mode?

Anyway, this is not as bad as cutting the pdf contents on the right and bottom, it just makes reading PDF files in landscape mode inconvenient. The most annoying thing is the marketing/management decision to disable this feature in dr800 to differentiate with dr1000.
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Old 06-07-2010, 04:58 AM   #10
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ok ok guys don't be angry .. I 'm starting another thread about it..

Last edited by repods; 06-07-2010 at 05:49 AM.
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Old 06-07-2010, 05:22 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CoolDragon View Post
I cannot understand those marketing guys for the reason behind this. To justify the extra money of dr1000? To sell more dr1000? Whatever. Don't they understand this will make people (especially people reading technical PDFs) choose dr800 over other devices?
You sure you're not just jumping to conclusions?

Ask the developers on here. They were pretty honest about the original zoom issue, I'm sure they'd answer this as well if it really is a business decision to limit the feature set of the DR800.

Let's find out what is really going on, before we make knee jerk reactions based on assumptions and guesses.
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Old 06-07-2010, 05:53 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by Shaggy View Post
You sure you're not just jumping to conclusions?

Ask the developers on here. They were pretty honest about the original zoom issue, I'm sure they'd answer this as well if it really is a business decision to limit the feature set of the DR800.

Let's find out what is really going on, before we make knee jerk reactions based on assumptions and guesses.
I am concluding anything, just speculating based on what I have seen. If the developers want to answer this question, they would have done so already. Remember, after all, they still work for IREX and got paid by IREX. Whatever they say here still has to obey their managers' confirm.
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Old 06-07-2010, 06:05 PM   #13
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This is what Matthijs said: (refer: [http://www.mobileread.com/forums/sho...35&postcount=7)

Quote:
We'll look at enabling Continuous Mode for the DR800 (ref. DR1000), that should indeed solve some issues people have with zooming, panning and page turning.

Last edited by CoolDragon; 06-07-2010 at 06:20 PM.
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Old 06-07-2010, 06:07 PM   #14
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Originally Posted by CoolDragon View Post
I am concluding anything, just speculating based on what I have seen. If the developers want to answer this question, they would have done so already.
Have you actually asked them?

Did you see the post from several days ago where they said that they have heard our requests and a better way of handling continuous/panning mode on the DR800 is already on their roadmap? That certainly doesn't sound like a deliberate marketing/management decision to limit the DR800 to me.

Quote:
Remember, after all, they still work for IREX and got paid by IREX. Whatever they say here still has to obey their managers' confirm.
They have answered similar questions in the past.
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Old 06-07-2010, 06:08 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CoolDragon View Post
This is what Matthijs said: (refer: [http://www.mobileread.com/forums/sho...35&postcount=7)
So what is your problem then?
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