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Old 05-17-2010, 12:21 PM   #61
jimr
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I suspect your right Stinger. There are so many variables to consider. I also suspect their marketing people are sticking with what other ereader companies have already claimed..ie 2 weeks or 8000 page turns. Although saying something like 'will work for days and hundreds of page turns' would be a little more accurate.

Thanks for the analysis....makes a lot of sense.
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Old 05-17-2010, 01:59 PM   #62
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I also wonder if the "class" of material being read makes a difference (ie ePub format or Kobo format), and the font size?
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Old 05-17-2010, 02:26 PM   #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stinger View Post
...
Notice specifically what they say, note the 'or' & 'approximately':
"This charge will last approximately 8000 page turns or two weeks of average reading."

Marketing people get payed a lot of money to brain-f**k you, and they do it well. Sometimes they get sued for false advertising, sure, but I think Kobo is safe by their careful wording.
I for one would like to know what they consider 'average reading'. I also get the feeling that they are swamped with questions and have told there staff to give somewhat politically safe answers, which usually means vague and non-commital.

Last edited by Alexander Turcic; 11-19-2010 at 02:56 PM.
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Old 05-17-2010, 02:29 PM   #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stinger View Post
...it can last two weeks, sure, but it won't be anywhere near 8000 pages since you also have all the battery drains I mentioned coming into the equation.
I think you're right, Stinger, on all of this (including your somewhat unflattering comments about marketers!). Still, why couldn't they be at least a little more honest. Seems like the results people are getting, in terms of page-turns, is off by nearly an order of magnitude. I mean, if they had said "1000 page-turns or one week" I still would have bought the thing.

The other thing that is not good is the apparently erratic behaviour many of us seem to be getting from the charging process. This technology is well established, the Kobo hardware is (or should be) long out of beta, so what gives? I realize this might well be a firmware bug, but it still makes me wonder about the batteries themselves.
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Old 05-18-2010, 11:01 AM   #65
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I've been lurking in this forum for awhile (since I decided to get a Kobo) and I finally got a black one last week. Unfortunately, I've been having the same issues with the battery as so many others. Here's my convo with Kobo so far:

From me:
Quote:
I have owned a black Kobo for 6 days now and I've read 2.5 books and have had to recharge twice now (not including the initial charge out of the box). Is this normal? I am getting about 1500 page turns per charge, far less than advertised. Is this something that can be fixed with a software update, or does the unit have to be returned? While the unit was initially bought in store, I live in a rural area and would have to exchange it online (which is a bit of a pain, so I hope there is a solution without having to return it!) I was also wondering how to properly charge the battery. I have heard conflicting reports about when to charge it. Some say that letting it die completely before charging can damage the battery, while others say that you should only charge after it dies so that it calibrates properly. Which is it?
Their answer:
Quote:
Thank you for your interest in the Kobo eReader. You are correct, the Kobo eReader should hold a charge for much longer than you are experiencing. When you first received the eReader, did you let it charge for 3 -4 hours initially before you began using it? We suggest that you let it charge overnight to see if that resolves the issue. The battery in the Kobo eReader does not have a "memory" so it is not necessary to totally deplete the battery before recharging it.
I've written back, saying that I charge it overnight anyways, and I have since the beginning. And, that now the red light no longer comes on at all. I'll let you all know what they say. I'm really really hoping I don't have to return this thing...
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Old 05-18-2010, 09:56 PM   #66
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Again, as regards the red light, they told me to reset my Kobo and that did, indeed, rectify the problem of the red light not coming on when fully charged.
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Old 05-19-2010, 01:24 AM   #67
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Quote:
Thank you for your interest in the Kobo eReader. You are correct, the Kobo eReader should hold a charge for much longer than you are experiencing. When you first received the eReader, did you let it charge for 3 -4 hours initially before you began using it? We suggest that you let it charge overnight to see if that resolves the issue. The battery in the Kobo eReader does not have a "memory" so it is not necessary to totally deplete the battery before recharging it.
Doesn't that contradict what they've said to someone else? I'm sure I've read that Kobo has said before that we should completely deplete the battery before recharging.

I thought my battery life was going well for the first week. I got it last Monday and charged it for the first time on Saturday when the battery went down to one little tick left. I let it charge for 3 full hours and it was full until Monday morning when it was down to about 50%. Now I'm down to one little tick again, but I'm going to let it drain completely (like I thought we were supposed to do) until I charge it again.

Like many others, I'd like to know what they consider "regular use." I've read 2 books so far, I probably use it for a couple of hours every day but I'm sure I'm not getting even the 1000 page turns someone else was told they should expect.
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Old 05-19-2010, 01:50 AM   #68
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Doesn't that contradict what they've said to someone else? I'm sure I've read that Kobo has said before that we should completely deplete the battery before recharging.
You need to consider the context. In the previous post, they were talking about allowing the battery to discharge fully to calibrate the gauge meter (so it knows what exactly 100% charge is, and what depleted is, which varies between battery batches and such). In terms of memory effect that this post is talking about, they are correct.

So once you discharge nearly to empty a few times to calibrate, you don't need to do that again. Even if you never do, the gauge meter might not be pinpoint accurate, but your battery is still operating at optimal capacity.

Quote:
I'm not getting even the 1000 page turns someone else was told they should expect.
The Kobo was 'advertised' as 8000 pages per charge See my earlier post to my speculations regarding that.
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Old 05-20-2010, 12:40 AM   #69
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I am wondering has anyone gotten even close to the advertised 8000 page turns? My first charge lasted me only about 700 (let it die completely). Now I am about 300-400 page turns in and it says I have less then half a charge.

Has anyone who exchanged it found an increase in their battery life or is this just how the unit is? It would be quite disappointing if I could only expect less then 1000 turns.

Also if I wanted to return it would I have to do it within 30 days of purchasing or anything like that? I got it from the preorder so that time is coming up fast.

edit. I haven't even finished one book yet! I'm only on chapter 29 of 42 in "crime and Punishment". The first 20ish chapters i read on small font, the last ones since then on smallest. I may have to recharge twice just to read 1 book!

Last edited by BongoBong; 05-20-2010 at 12:52 AM.
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Old 05-20-2010, 01:27 AM   #70
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Almost all of the e-Book readers advertise the battery life in terms of page turns. I doubt if any really get all the pages they claim although some are better than others. The way the up to 8,000 pages is achieved is by setting there and pressing the button over and over again as fast as it will go on a page with only text and no formatting. In the real world things like book uploads, downloads, computer power consumed while you are looking at the page, the page formatting, drawing pictures, loading the book in the first place all takes computer power. Initially most people play with the unit when they first get it and that typically uses much more computer power.

A 1,000 seems low once you settle down to using it like it was designed but I doubt that Kobo ever actually measured it. Most probably they are quoting the Netronix value which was calculated in a lab some place using TXT format which the Kobo doesn't even support. ADE is a power hungry application and the database is power hungry as well I suspect.

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Old 05-20-2010, 09:51 AM   #71
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There are so many variables that can effect battery length. I think the real problem is the way in which battery length was presented.

Battery charge of up to 2 Weeks: Or 8000 page-turns in 'Book Years'

What the hell is that supposed to mean anyways!?

Most other electronic devices are stated in terms of "hours of use." Cell phones usually give battery length in terms of "standby time" and "talk time." MP3 Players/Ipods usually give battery length in terms of "music play back time" and "video play back time." I have even seen the Kindle state battery length in terms of "reading time."

While these terms can also be somewhat hazy, they do give the user, a better idea of what to expect from the device. While I am not dissapointed with the Kobo in terms of battery length, I would have liked to see it stated in "reading time," rather than page turns which really isn't that realistic when all other factors are considered.
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Old 05-20-2010, 01:38 PM   #72
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I was completely happy with the battery during the first week of use, but now I'm so fed up that I finally called them today.

I charged it for 3 hours last Monday (the 10th) when I first got it. The red light came on right away but I left it alone. That charge lasted until Saturday when it was down to one little tick so I decided to charge it again while it was syncing with the desktop app. Again, I left it for 3 hours and then powered it down overnight. When I turned it back on on Sunday the battery life was about 75%. Used it for a total of about 5 hours between Sunday and Wednesday, when it finally died on me last night. I left it charging overnight, but when I woke up this morning it wasn't on the "plugged in" screen it was on the "I'm reading" page, so I don't know what happened, yet my computer was still on and the device was still plugged in, so I'm not sure exactly how long it got to charge for. When I turned it on, the battery is only at 50%.

I got through to Kobo right away and the lady I spoke with said that something is definitely wrong and suggested that I try a USB wall charger. I don't have one but obviously need to go out and get one. She said that the USB wall charger might work better. If this is the case, then why doesn't the device come with one?? She said my only other option was returning the reader to them and they'd have a look at it and possibly send me another one. I don't like the idea of this option either because with my luck I'd get one that was covered in scratches or something like that.

She also said that we should be getting 8000 page turns from it, but couldn't tell me what they meant by "average use." She also confirmed that they're planning an upgrade through the desktop app this weekend.
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Old 05-20-2010, 01:57 PM   #73
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@StealthyScribe

Which USB port are you using? You have to know that USB ports ARE NOT all the same. Some of them does not bring enough power to recharge or even to make an external hard drive function. On some external HD, they supply dual head usb in order to plug it in two ports at the same time to make more power.
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Old 05-20-2010, 02:02 PM   #74
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StealthyScribe View Post

She also said that we should be getting 8000 page turns from it, but couldn't tell me what they meant by "average use." She also confirmed that they're planning an upgrade through the desktop app this weekend.
I wonder how they plan to upgrade the firmware for those of us who have a non-Intel Mac? A very important point they didn't mention when they said that it was Mac compatible. Maybe they'll do something using the blackberry bluetooth, oh wait I have one of the blackberries that the bluetooth doesn't work on. Thanks Kobo.
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Old 05-20-2010, 02:04 PM   #75
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Yeah, I'm definitely convinced that these level 1 tech support people just have no answers to give besides exchanging the unit. They have these "suggestions" they tell you try, so you get a nice 'placebo' effect of doing something...

The only way I see that a wall charger would help anything is if your USB port(s) were defective in some respect, and were not proving enough current. But you would, in all likelihood, be able to diagnose this pretty easily since most of us have a plethora of USB devices. This totally sounds like just bullshit they are told to say, just so they have something to say.

EDIT:
Quote:
Which USB port are you using? You have to know that USB ports ARE NOT all the same.
As far as charging goes, all USB ports are pretty much the same. As the standard has evolved, the maximum allowed current per port has increased, but electrically the new standards are backwards-compatible. In the end it's as simple as:
"The USB 1.x and 2.0 specifications provide a 5 V (5V±5%)supply on a single wire from which connected USB devices may draw power."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Universal_Serial_Bus#Power

Quote:
Some of them does not bring enough power to recharge or even to make an external hard drive function. On some external HD, they supply dual head usb in order to plug it in two ports at the same time to make more power.
This just comes off as misinformation to me. It's not like in some cases you only need 1 USB port when you have a "good" one, and in some cases need both because that particular single port is underpowered. The device itself needs more power than ANY single compliant USB port can provide, by design.
In essence, the exact opposite of what you say is true... these dual-head solutions are necessary because ALL USB PORT ARE CREATED EQUAL, so to speak.


The Kobo doesn't fall into this category, so all this is moot anyway.

Last edited by Stinger; 05-20-2010 at 02:39 PM.
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