Register Guidelines E-Books Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Go Back   MobileRead Forums > E-Book General > General Discussions

Notices

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 04-23-2010, 01:56 PM   #31
Jellby
frumious Bandersnatch
Jellby ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Jellby ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Jellby ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Jellby ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Jellby ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Jellby ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Jellby ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Jellby ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Jellby ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Jellby ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Jellby ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Jellby's Avatar
 
Posts: 6,259
Karma: 4801165
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Spaniard in Sweden
Device: Cybook Orizon, Kobo Aura
When I watch TV in the kitchen, everytime the washing-machine or the fridge engine starts, I see an interference in the TV. It's just a fraction of a second, but it's noticeable. Neither my washing-machine nor my fridge have wifi or 3g connection

I don't think it's too far-fetched assuming that every electronic device could cause some interference in a plane's instruments, and it's a risk not worth facing. Of course, an ebook reader (at least one without wireless connection) is probably one of the less "dangerous" devices, but when setting safety rules for arbitrary groups of people, it's often better to just set clear-cut strict rules and not deal with possible case-by-case exceptions, if everyone starts saying "but look, my device's user guide says..." it would be chaos.

On the other hand, I'm not sure there has been enough serious testing of what devices actually do or don't cause interferences with the plane's instruments, and these should be designed to work properly in an environment full of electronic devices (even if you ask all passengers to turn their phones off, I'm sure at least one phone in every flight remains turned on).
Jellby is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2010, 02:02 PM   #32
HarryT
eBook Enthusiast
HarryT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HarryT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HarryT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HarryT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HarryT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HarryT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HarryT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HarryT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HarryT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HarryT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HarryT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
HarryT's Avatar
 
Posts: 65,008
Karma: 43118253
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: UK
Device: Kindle Voyage, iPad Mini, iPhone 4, MS Surface Pro, N7
It's entirely irrelevant whether or not a particular device is safe. The fact is that the regulations require them to be switched off. If you choose to travel by air, those are the regulations you agree to abide by. If you don't like them, then don't fly!
HarryT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2010, 02:03 PM   #33
ChrisC333
Groupie
ChrisC333 knows what time it isChrisC333 knows what time it isChrisC333 knows what time it isChrisC333 knows what time it isChrisC333 knows what time it isChrisC333 knows what time it isChrisC333 knows what time it isChrisC333 knows what time it isChrisC333 knows what time it isChrisC333 knows what time it isChrisC333 knows what time it is
 
ChrisC333's Avatar
 
Posts: 194
Karma: 2031
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: West Australia
Device: Acer eM250 Netbook, iTouch, iRiver Story, HP TM2 Tablet
To sum it up so far:


a) There's a genuine chance that you - or somebody else with a similar attitude - may individually or cumulatively unwittingly contribute to a problem.

b) By ignoring the request, your example may also be encouraging others whose device(s) may have a much higher chance of causing trouble. If they do cause a crash they take you with them. It won't be much consolation to be still insisting it's not your fault as you go down.

c) Refusing to comply is likely to make you look like a jerk to other passengers and to the cabin staff. This may well bring down some kind of public hassle or argument on yourself. This is after all how this thread started. A fellow passenger got cheesed off with the OP.


Here's a link to an aviation blog with some examples that show why these rules are put in place.

Incident examples

As Harry says, if you fly then it's smart to abide by the rules, even if you honestly believe your device is totally harmless. If you get into an argument with the flight crew and piss them off enough you may find that they can apply a range of sanctions including declining to take you on the next leg of your journey and up to getting the cops to meet you on landing.

Does anybody really think a few minutes e-reading is worth that? Isn't it just more polite and reasonable (as many have said here) to just switch the darned thing off when they ask?

Last edited by ChrisC333; 04-23-2010 at 02:22 PM.
ChrisC333 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2010, 02:51 PM   #34
kindlekitten
Professional Adventuress
kindlekitten ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.kindlekitten ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.kindlekitten ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.kindlekitten ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.kindlekitten ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.kindlekitten ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.kindlekitten ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.kindlekitten ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.kindlekitten ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.kindlekitten ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.kindlekitten ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
kindlekitten's Avatar
 
Posts: 12,812
Karma: 47072178
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: The Olympic Peninsula on the OTHER Washington! (the big green clean one on the west coast!)
Device: Kindle, the original! Times Two! and gifting an International Kindle
I just close my e-reader cover and put in the pocket in front of me. these "turn off" regulations are left overs from when the technology was not completely understood. there is one airline, I can't remember which that has allowed cell phone usage for quite awhile and another one that is ramping up the ability to have in flight wi-fi. military flying on commercial birds for years have had all of their bells and whistles on and functioning
kindlekitten is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2010, 03:42 PM   #35
Hellmark
Wizard
Hellmark ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Hellmark ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Hellmark ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Hellmark ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Hellmark ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Hellmark ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Hellmark ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Hellmark ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Hellmark ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Hellmark ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Hellmark ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Hellmark's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,521
Karma: 3638167
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Maryland Heights, Missouri, USA
Device: Nokia N800, PRS-505, Nook STR Glowlight
The ones with wifi and cellphone usage shut them down during landings and take off.

As far as the military goes, their equipment is designed under strict requirements as to not mess with the avionics. Your iPods and eBook readers are not.
Hellmark is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2010, 03:45 PM   #36
Sweetpea
Grand Sorcerer
Sweetpea ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Sweetpea ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Sweetpea ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Sweetpea ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Sweetpea ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Sweetpea ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Sweetpea ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Sweetpea ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Sweetpea ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Sweetpea ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Sweetpea ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Sweetpea's Avatar
 
Posts: 8,050
Karma: 22708134
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Krewerd
Device: AVTN8; BBMini; Onyx Boox T68; SGN8
I didn't "turn off" my Mini. I've never turned it off since I got it. Not that I took it out of my bag (I just love to look outside, even if it's very cloudy!)...
Sweetpea is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2010, 04:05 PM   #37
kindlekitten
Professional Adventuress
kindlekitten ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.kindlekitten ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.kindlekitten ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.kindlekitten ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.kindlekitten ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.kindlekitten ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.kindlekitten ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.kindlekitten ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.kindlekitten ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.kindlekitten ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.kindlekitten ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
kindlekitten's Avatar
 
Posts: 12,812
Karma: 47072178
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: The Olympic Peninsula on the OTHER Washington! (the big green clean one on the west coast!)
Device: Kindle, the original! Times Two! and gifting an International Kindle
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hellmark View Post
The ones with wifi and cellphone usage shut them down during landings and take off.

As far as the military goes, their equipment is designed under strict requirements as to not mess with the avionics. Your iPods and eBook readers are not.
I really love it when disinformation gets disbursed... the ban was a reslt of analog phones, now they are digital and no longer cause the interference. cell phones and ereaders for that matter are of such low power that they do NOT cause the interference. at this point it is mostly a matter of streamlining regulations
kindlekitten is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2010, 04:13 PM   #38
jbjb
Somewhat clueless
jbjb ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jbjb ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jbjb ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jbjb ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jbjb ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jbjb ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jbjb ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jbjb ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jbjb ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jbjb ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jbjb ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Posts: 493
Karma: 4485324
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: UK
Device: Kindle PW, iPad, iPhone
Quote:
Originally Posted by EowynCarter View Post
Do you ?
In what way is that relevant? My point is that most passengers don't, so the rules should be followed.

As it happens, I have a better understanding than most in this area, but I certainly wouldn't feel able to overrule the authorities. Do you?

/JB
jbjb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2010, 04:19 PM   #39
jbjb
Somewhat clueless
jbjb ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jbjb ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jbjb ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jbjb ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jbjb ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jbjb ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jbjb ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jbjb ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jbjb ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jbjb ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jbjb ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Posts: 493
Karma: 4485324
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: UK
Device: Kindle PW, iPad, iPhone
Quote:
Originally Posted by kindlekitten View Post
I really love it when disinformation gets disbursed... the ban was a reslt of analog phones, now they are digital and no longer cause the interference. cell phones and ereaders for that matter are of such low power that they do NOT cause the interference. at this point it is mostly a matter of streamlining regulations
That, I'm afraid, is simply wrong.

Digital cellphones most certainly cause interference. Anyone who has been near a speaker and heard the dit-dit-dit when they poll for the base station cannot doubt this.

/JB
jbjb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2010, 04:22 PM   #40
tompe
Grand Sorcerer
tompe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tompe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tompe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tompe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tompe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tompe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tompe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tompe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tompe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tompe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tompe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Posts: 7,129
Karma: 4315826
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Linköpng, Sweden
Device: Nexus 7, Nexus 5, iPad 2, Kindle PW
Quote:
Originally Posted by HarryT View Post
What do you do with electronic devices which cannot be turned off? Do you take the battery out of your digital watch?
The instruction is to turn off all devices with an off switch.
tompe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2010, 04:45 PM   #41
Hellmark
Wizard
Hellmark ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Hellmark ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Hellmark ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Hellmark ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Hellmark ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Hellmark ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Hellmark ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Hellmark ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Hellmark ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Hellmark ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Hellmark ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Hellmark's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,521
Karma: 3638167
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Maryland Heights, Missouri, USA
Device: Nokia N800, PRS-505, Nook STR Glowlight
Quote:
Originally Posted by kindlekitten View Post
I really love it when disinformation gets disbursed... the ban was a reslt of analog phones, now they are digital and no longer cause the interference. cell phones and ereaders for that matter are of such low power that they do NOT cause the interference. at this point it is mostly a matter of streamlining regulations
Yes, it was put into place when analog phones were widely used, however digital devices can still cause interference. I routinely have my completely digital cellphone messing up some of my other sensitive devices. I also have some of my other things causing issues that are lower power. Regardless of how the data is encoded, if it is going at a spectrum that the equipment is sensitive to, it'll have interference. The device cares not that it is digital or analog, since it isn't able to understand either. The real difference between the two? The switch to digital allowed things to get cheaper for the telecoms, since it requires less equipment to handle more calls. No need to convert it to a digital signal so the computer knows how to handle it, if it is already in a format it knows. Much of the hard work is already done. A digital trunk card looks barren compared to an analog one, not because of chips handling the work, but because it just has less work to do.

But hey, what do I know, I only design electronics and work with commercial phone systems for a living.
Hellmark is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2010, 04:58 PM   #42
wodin
Illiterate
wodin ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.wodin ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.wodin ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.wodin ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.wodin ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.wodin ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.wodin ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.wodin ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.wodin ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.wodin ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.wodin ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
wodin's Avatar
 
Posts: 3,629
Karma: 15009596
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: The Sandwich Isles
Device: Samsung Galaxy Note, Nook HD+
In the US, the rule comes from the FAA, and it says all electronic devices during landing and takeoff while the plane is below 10,000 feet. And it predates cell phones, Bluetooth and WiFi.

In the olden days, before those things were invented, it was thought that a battery powered FM radio could emit radio waves that could interfere with the planes navigation and controls. And who knows what else might!

The rules have been updated somewhat due to pressure from business travelers who wanted to use their laptops to do useful work instead of just wasting all those hours sitting in an airplane, but the FAA being what they are were VERY conservative, and banned all electronics during takeoff and landing, and anything that has an active transmitter for the duration of the flight.

I think there are dispensations for medical equipment (heart pace makers and the like), but I’m not sure about watches, I think they just ignore those.

Perhaps PilotBob could enlighten us further.
wodin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2010, 05:21 PM   #43
EowynCarter
Wizard
EowynCarter ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.EowynCarter ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.EowynCarter ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.EowynCarter ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.EowynCarter ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.EowynCarter ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.EowynCarter ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.EowynCarter ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.EowynCarter ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.EowynCarter ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.EowynCarter ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Posts: 4,111
Karma: 1604192
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Paris
Device: Cybooks; Sony PRS-T1
Quote:
As it happens, I have a better understanding than most in this area, but I certainly wouldn't feel able to overrule the authorities.
Well, i'm all ears if you can explain.
EowynCarter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2010, 05:28 PM   #44
jbjb
Somewhat clueless
jbjb ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jbjb ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jbjb ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jbjb ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jbjb ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jbjb ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jbjb ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jbjb ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jbjb ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jbjb ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.jbjb ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Posts: 493
Karma: 4485324
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: UK
Device: Kindle PW, iPad, iPhone
Quote:
Originally Posted by EowynCarter View Post
Well, i'm all ears if you can explain.
I've been trying my best to explain - what bits have I missed out?

The rules are a sensible set of precautions, given how amazingly difficult it is to calculate the cumulative effect of many small sources of EM radiation on sensitive equipment. What more needs to be said?

/JB
jbjb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-23-2010, 05:36 PM   #45
Hamlet53
Noli Me Tangere
Hamlet53 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Hamlet53 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Hamlet53 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Hamlet53 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Hamlet53 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Hamlet53 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Hamlet53 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Hamlet53 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Hamlet53 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Hamlet53 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Hamlet53 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Hamlet53's Avatar
 
Posts: 3,821
Karma: 46082991
Join Date: Mar 2009
Device: Kindle PW, Kindle Fire HDX 8.9"
Getting herded around like cattle. Standing for an hour or more at a security check point with your shoes off because one idiot tried once to set of a “shoe bomb.” Maybe getting charged extra to go pee in flight? Seats jammed so close together that your knees are bruised by flight end. BYOL (bring your own lunch).

Having to turn of all electronic devices during takeoff and landing are the least of reasons to dread contemporary air travel.

http://blog.troubletown.com/2009_12_01_archive.html
Hamlet53 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
BBC News - "Traditional books 'may not survive electronic age'" seagull News 13 07-18-2010 06:12 PM
New "E-Book Devices" "Bookeen Opus" forum desired ericch Bookeen 3 08-06-2009 07:31 PM
Using Chrome and "Switch Editor Mode" button Wetdogeared Feedback 0 06-01-2009 02:05 PM
"Liquid" / "Fixed" - how to switch layouts Alexander Turcic Announcements 0 06-05-2007 10:29 AM
Sony Connect "Bait and Switch" Advertising? TheMooch Sony Reader 5 02-21-2007 02:43 AM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 08:42 PM.


MobileRead.com is a privately owned, operated and funded community.