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Old 02-18-2010, 08:31 PM   #31
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Windows XP is more stable on my Mac than on a Windows machine. I've never had programs freeze, or had the blue screen of death, or had to reboot.
Windows XP (and later) is very stable. You could only crash it with faulty drivers (like graphic cards). It's a rumor that Mac's are more stable than let's say Windows 7. I even had some bluescreens on a mac ...

The Mac mainboard is just an ultracheap Intel board, the horrible price is the Apple penalty tax. Usability has been very impressive in Windows 7 so that argument is totally bogus.

Macs are like a religion - it's not better but it feels that way for certain kind of people.
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Old 02-18-2010, 08:33 PM   #32
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@Mores: Are you being facetious? You have an iPhone so you should know how quickly Apple dropped the price on that device, much to the irritation of early adopters. From $599 for an 8gig model at the end of June 2007 to 1/3 less at the start of September to $99 for a 3g model in June 2009. There were many news stories about how early buyers reacted to that price drop. That may impact whether Apple does the same thing with the iPad but I hope they repeat since I plan to hold off at least until late summer.
That's the one exception though. Prices on the various iPod lines, their macbooks and desktops etc. have been pretty stable over the years.

And I'd expect the iPad to follow those devices price trends more so than the iPhone. They had more competition in smartphones with Blackberry etc. and needed to get prices down.

I doubt any tablets that come out to compete against it will be any cheaper--at least not any with anywhere near the same functionality.
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Old 02-18-2010, 09:54 PM   #33
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Windows XP (and later) is very stable. You could only crash it with faulty drivers (like graphic cards). It's a rumor that Mac's are more stable than let's say Windows 7. I even had some bluescreens on a mac ...

The Mac mainboard is just an ultracheap Intel board, the horrible price is the Apple penalty tax. Usability has been very impressive in Windows 7 so that argument is totally bogus.

Macs are like a religion - it's not better but it feels that way for certain kind of people.
I agree with you that Windows is very stable, no question about it. But I have to ask.... You say Macs are like a religion, it "feels that way for certain kind of people".... Scion is such a person so what kind of people is she?
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Old 02-18-2010, 10:07 PM   #34
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http://translate.google.com/translat...ml&sl=de&tl=en

... but they will sell it for over 500 USD. Who wants to finance Steve Jobs another liver?

Drug dealers doesn't necessarily have a bigger profit margin.
They have to pay R&D, headquarters, stores - rent, heat, etc. , employees, etcetera.

Or do you think this is all free?

If someone got you to wash windows - would you just charge them the cost of the squeegee, rag, bucket, and windex? Geez, have some common sense.
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Old 02-18-2010, 11:06 PM   #35
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Windows XP (and later) is very stable. You could only crash it with faulty drivers (like graphic cards). It's a rumor that Mac's are more stable than let's say Windows 7. I even had some bluescreens on a mac ...

The Mac mainboard is just an ultracheap Intel board, the horrible price is the Apple penalty tax. Usability has been very impressive in Windows 7 so that argument is totally bogus.

Macs are like a religion - it's not better but it feels that way for certain kind of people.
Where's all this hatred coming from!

There are 5 Windows XP machines in my house now and programs freeze, bluescreens occur, or stuff doesn't work all of a sudden and the computer needs to reboot. If XP was so great there wouldn't have been a bunch of hoopla about Vista when that came on the scene. Yes, it was a gigantic step up from Windows ME, but don't act like I'm just making stuff up just because (now) I own a Mac. I didn't convert until 2 years ago. Up until that time I was just like any other "PC" owner.

I never mentioned anything about Windows 7. I never said Macs are better. I do know that people buy Macs and replace OS X with Windows.
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Old 02-18-2010, 11:49 PM   #36
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The problem with PCs is the hardware isn't standard. Windows is being run on various hardware configurations by various manufacturers. So you get driver issues etc. My wireless kept dropping out/freezing on my work laptop until I found a new driver on the Lenovo website--otherwise it's been flawless and hasn't frozen/crashed otherwise in the 7 or so months I've been using it.

OSX is only being ran on machines made by Apple who made the OS. So you get pretty much no driver issues unless you add components yourself.

Overall, most of the machines I've had XP on pretty much never crash. But I've a few that had issues, granted a lot of it was trojans, virus and spyware which is more prevalent on windows since hackers focus on attacking that OS more.

I'm pretty happy with XP personally, haven't tried Windows 7 yet as I now only have work PCs and our IT department won't switch for a long time (universities are very slow to switch operating systems).

OSX is nice as well, but I tend to get frustrated using friends Macs as it's a learning curve--which is another reason I haven't made the switch. I'm working constantly and just don't have the time or patience for the learning curve. So if I switched it would have to be on a personal computer for non-work use--and again that gets nixed since they won't put out a $500-700 lower spec laptop that I'd buy for such purposes.

But in any case, all the loyalty and hostility always makes me chuckle. It's computer hardware and operating systems for godsake! Use what you like and don't worry about what other people use.

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Old 02-19-2010, 12:01 AM   #37
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...
But in any case, all the loyalty and hostility always makes me chuckle. It's computer hardware and operating systems for godsake! Use what you like and don't worry about what other people use.
Hear, hear!
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Old 02-19-2010, 04:52 AM   #38
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@Mores: Are you being facetious? You have an iPhone so you should know how quickly Apple dropped the price on that device... From $599 for an 8gig model at the end of June 2007 to 1/3 less at the start of September...
You seem to be conveniently forgetting the refund that Apple gave to early adopters - yep, sure it was a refund in the form of 'applebucks' but they didn't have to do anything... Other price drops (e.g. $99 for a 3g model two years later) were just regular inventory-clearing ready for the new model, which is pretty standard practice in business - especially if you're shifting the product in tens of millions.

When discussing price at the keynote, I thought Jobs went to lengths to state they weren't starting with a high price and gradually reducing it over time - which doesn't mean that there won't be subsidised deals to be had, of course, when the 3G carriers are finalised.

Cheers, Pete
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Old 02-19-2010, 06:21 AM   #39
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@Mores: Are you being facetious? You have an iPhone so you should know how quickly Apple dropped the price on that device, much to the irritation of early adopters. From $599 for an 8gig model at the end of June 2007 to 1/3 less at the start of September to $99 for a 3g model in June 2009. There were many news stories about how early buyers reacted to that price drop. That may impact whether Apple does the same thing with the iPad but I hope they repeat since I plan to hold off at least until late summer.
There was such a huge outcry at the first price drop, they gave $100 or $200 store credit to each early adopter.

The $99 is a bad example because that's effectively an 1 yr old model when they announced that price -- 3gs had 2x memory and faster CPU -- and the 3gs still had better sales. Also ATT gives them a kickback for each phone...

Apple will want to avoid outcry of a big price drop and has no kickback. I could see a moderate one in the fall to spur Xmas sales.
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Old 02-19-2010, 06:32 AM   #40
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@dmaul1114 - Your point about Apple having no mid-tier computers is right on. I don't like Mac's personally, and that is one of the turn offs. For a desktop the leap from the Mac Mini (cute, but weak little bugger) to the Mac Pro is huge. I know the iMac is in there, but an all in one (and using laptop parts) is not a true desktop to me.... I have never understood why they could not make a simple mid-range tower in the $1k range....... Even if they did I still wouldn't buy one though.....
Because there is no real reason to. The market trend is toward notebooks. I buy them because electricity is getting expensive in my area. People like the portability. I don't know many people that buy a desktop anymore when they need a new computer.

There are 3 major reasons for a desktop -- as a small server, for an office worker, or graphics/games.

Apple doesn't rely much on corporate sales, server sales not strong, shrinking PC game market always belonged to PC (and now eaten up by consoles).

That leaves graphic designers and the like, and they'll shell out for the Mac Pro.
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Old 02-19-2010, 06:52 AM   #41
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@jibril .... Since 90% of home computers today are really used as internet appliances, I agree with you. But there is still a market for those who want more, but don't want to shell out $3000 to do so..... but, it matters not, there are hundreds of PC alternatives....

BTW, my opening statement above is why products like the iPad are the future. The dirty secret is that most people don't need or actually use a computer as a computer. They just get email, and putz around on the net. A simple, stable, portable and ascetically pleasing internet appliance is all most need.
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Old 02-19-2010, 08:35 AM   #42
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Where's all this hatred coming from!

There are 5 Windows XP machines in my house now and programs freeze, bluescreens occur, or stuff doesn't work all of a sudden and the computer needs to reboot. If XP was so great there wouldn't have been a bunch of hoopla about Vista when that came on the scene. Yes, it was a gigantic step up from Windows ME, but don't act like I'm just making stuff up just because (now) I own a Mac. I didn't convert until 2 years ago. Up until that time I was just like any other "PC" owner.

I never mentioned anything about Windows 7. I never said Macs are better. I do know that people buy Macs and replace OS X with Windows.
Program freezing is a problem of the program and not the operating system. If you get regular bluescreens either the hardware is defective or you have subprime driver installed. Both is a reason to get deeper into it. I'm not a fan of Windows Vista but it was made primarily because the Win XP 32 Bit didn't support RAM over 4 GByte (and for the 64 Bit version wasn't enough drivers around).

Anyway, I mostly use Linux now (but Windows 7 here and there) and if something isn't working I can fix it myself.

I have nothing against reasonable Mac users (everybody has the right to make mistakes in their life ;=) ) but the instability of Windows is a mythos which was true in Windows 9x times but now it's very stable.

I'm allergic to this superb religious attitude of some Mac users where Windows is still absolutely unstable and a Mac never crashes ...
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Old 02-19-2010, 08:42 AM   #43
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Program freezing is a problem of the program and not the operating system. If you get regular bluescreens either the hardware is defective or you have subprime driver installed. Both is a reason to get deeper into it. I'm not a fan of Windows Vista but it was made primarily because the Win XP 32 Bit didn't support RAM over 4 GByte (and for the 64 Bit version wasn't enough drivers around).

Anyway, I mostly use Linux now (but Windows 7 here and there) and if something isn't working I can fix it myself.

I have nothing against reasonable Mac users (everybody has the right to make mistakes in their life ;=) ) but the instability of Windows is a mythos which was true in Windows 9x times but now it's very stable.

I'm allergic to this superb religious attitude of some Mac users where Windows is still absolutely unstable and a Mac never crashes ...
I zctually also think a lot of the windows breaks mythology is due to the amt of them in workplaces! I could look around for 5 minutes now and find you easily 3 windows computers with blue screens!

However the majoriuty will be due to a hardware failure and tehre is the fact that there are a couple of hundred of them near me.

but the average user here will see windows machines with blue screens and may never see a mac with an issue. so that seems to keep the belief going.

However i personally believe but have no evidence apart from my own anecdotal that a PC will on average crash break more often than a mac.
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Old 02-19-2010, 08:44 AM   #44
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i hate pancreatic cancer .i lost mah frnd
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Old 02-19-2010, 09:41 AM   #45
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@loveangel.... Sorry for your loss, I would say all of us have been touched in some way by cancer. I have a brother-in-law that is fighting it right now......

best to you loveangel, it is never easy to loose a friend....
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