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Old 01-11-2010, 03:17 AM   #1
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Onyx Boox 60 Named Best eReader for Students!

Mostly all the eReader at CES 2010 were reviewed by HackCollege.com on the last day of CES. There were two reviewers, Kelly Sutton and Chris Lesinski. Out the the eReaders at CES, the Onyx Boox was chosen as one of two best ereaders for students. Criterias being practicality, price, etc.

The video will be on their website (www.hackcollege.com) hopefully in a few weeks when the editing is finished.

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Old 01-11-2010, 04:58 AM   #2
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Out the the eReaders at CES, the Onyx Boox was chosen as one of two best ereaders for students.
And which was the other one?
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Old 01-11-2010, 06:51 AM   #3
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And which was the other one?
The Spring Design Alex. It was chosen by Chris. He has never owned a eReader before while Kelly owned a Kindle. Kelly's choice was the Onyx Boox.
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Old 01-11-2010, 09:46 AM   #4
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Color me skeptical here. But a 6" reader would not be my choice for a student, Wacom or no. But at least the Boox 60 gets decent reviews. I wonder if Nate every got a working reader for his review here on MR?
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Old 01-11-2010, 02:24 PM   #5
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Color me skeptical here. But a 6" reader would not be my choice for a student, Wacom or no. But at least the Boox 60 gets decent reviews. I wonder if Nate every got a working reader for his review here on MR?
Remember, price was a big factor too. The Plastic Logic's Que was a serious consideration but the price tag was just too high. Normal version nearly $700 and the 3G is $800 retail.
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Old 01-11-2010, 02:54 PM   #6
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Remember, price was a big factor too. The Plastic Logic's Que was a serious consideration but the price tag was just too high. Normal version nearly $700 and the 3G is $800 retail.
Well, strictly the non-3G version's nearly $650 while the 3G version's nearly $800, but they're aimed at business users, not students. Oddly enough, I did a article on the QUE proReader earlier but while I suspect certain students would find it useful, I agree with the thinking that it'll be out of most of their price ranges.
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Old 01-11-2010, 03:45 PM   #7
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Color me skeptical here. But a 6" reader would not be my choice for a student, Wacom or no. But at least the Boox 60 gets decent reviews. I wonder if Nate every got a working reader for his review here on MR?
Nate did a review, although he insinuated he would update after he had more time with the device. It's here in N&C somewhere.

The Boox would be very handy for taking notes on PDFs students download from a professor's lecture slides posted online as PDFs. The user also has complete control over SD card filing, so organization of papers, books and notes would be very versatile.
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Old 01-11-2010, 04:07 PM   #8
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It'd be interesting to see just how students would use these things realistically. I would have killed for even the 7" first-gen eeePC netbook with crappy battery life when I was in university, but an ebook reader? Definitely not.

Perhaps the Boox is completely different, but every attempt I've seen or tried with stylus input with an ebook reader has been horribly slow and low-res, and the most complex "notes" have been vague circles and underlines, or the word "hello" in huge letters. That's such a joke for anything approaching academic needs.

Edit: Just watched some videos of the Boox with the stylus input. Nope, it's not completely different.

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Old 01-11-2010, 05:09 PM   #9
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Anything above $500 is a bit much for most students probably! After all these devices would be accessories for students, after their primary machine, probably a laptop. The Onyx Boox is a pretty great device imo.

Hackcollege looks like an interesting website too.
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Old 01-13-2010, 04:35 AM   #10
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It'd be interesting to see just how students would use these things realistically. I would have killed for even the 7" first-gen eeePC netbook with crappy battery life when I was in university, but an ebook reader? Definitely not.

Perhaps the Boox is completely different, but every attempt I've seen or tried with stylus input with an ebook reader has been horribly slow and low-res, and the most complex "notes" have been vague circles and underlines, or the word "hello" in huge letters. That's such a joke for anything approaching academic needs.

Edit: Just watched some videos of the Boox with the stylus input. Nope, it's not completely different.
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Anything above $500 is a bit much for most students probably! After all these devices would be accessories for students, after their primary machine, probably a laptop. The Onyx Boox is a pretty great device imo.

Hackcollege looks like an interesting website too.
Completely agree. I do not in anyway see these 6" device as of any use to other than lit or english majors. As I triple major in Pharmacy/Math & Computer Science, I can tell you a 6" device would have been totally useless compared to lugging around the needed texbooks for each course as needed. Now, take the feature set of a Boox 60 and put it in a 10" or even 11.5" form factor and we can talk... But there is zero chance these small devices can display content in a a way that makes following the material easy or in a way which promote learning. The content of the texts simply is too graphical in nature to the point where coercing the device to show the content, examples, along with the associated texts would make the device an impediment to learning. There is a reason textbooks are not printed in even something as small as a trade paperback edition, though there are some in math but even those leave a significant portion of the examples "as an exercise for the student"...

I mean try reading a o-chem, biochem, biophysical principles of drugs or even a basic calculus text on a 6" reader.... that is a FAIL in the making, for both the device and the student.

If Boox wants to make a note taking device...super, do THAT and add the ability to read some mmpb's as well, but even a prof's PDF content would be completely useless on such a small display.

If I am missing the point of the device for students, please let me know, because I do applaud your effort. I simply do not feel it fill the need. I will also add that a $500 device while expensive, would not be a huge outlay for a student. In fact schools could include a selection of devices as part of tuition and fees. But it danged well better be a device that works across all majors...

Last, I would have loved a reader like device to keep my chem lab journals as well as course notes and of course working through complex math proofs or other problems. I know even back then I would have paid $500 for a math specific device with MathCad or Mathematica embedded in the firmware.

The ONLY option I see for students which has any merit would be a slate PC with Wacom and a PixelQi panel along with the needed hardware to support the type of work science majors would need as well as art, lit and other majors...but being partial to hard science majors, I see them as those who would truly benefit from such a device as they are the onces with 100lbs of textbooks some semesters, think of it, a CRC right there in your slate device...wow!! Art History majors as well get astonishingly heave books, the rest, lucky if they have 30lbs of books to deal with each YEAR.

Another commonality for such majors is they MUST have color...greyscale is completely pointless. Even for taking notes in an advance math course where solving complex systems is greatly enhanced using a different color pencil to represent changes on each level while manipulating a single or system of equations. Can't be done with greyscale unless one rewrites the equation after each and every change...

A nice try from Boox, but were I a student, I would pass on the Boox 60 as vastly over rated. Just my opinion...hope I am wrong.
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Old 01-13-2010, 10:25 AM   #11
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brecklundin-

Would you take a look the available free calculus texts on the web and choosing a good example from your perspective? I'd like to load it up on the Boox and see how well it actually does. I have read and annotated various PDFs now included scientific papers but I'd like to see if it would be really as bad as you think.

Post a link here and ill grab the text later.

thanks,
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Old 01-13-2010, 05:35 PM   #12
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brecklundin-

Would you take a look the available free calculus texts on the web and choosing a good example from your perspective? I'd like to load it up on the Boox and see how well it actually does. I have read and annotated various PDFs now included scientific papers but I'd like to see if it would be really as bad as you think.

Post a link here and ill grab the text later.

thanks,
charlie
Don't understand why you can't find and example them yourself but here are a couple basic texts. I did not take time, I don't have, to see if they are useful but the first is a Calc I text and the second is Calc III which is typically an into to multivariable calculus so it will have plenty of color 3D graphics. And trust me in that the color matters.

Calc 1: http://tutorial.math.lamar.edu/pdf/C...I_Complete.pdf
Calc III: http://tutorial.math.lamar.edu/pdf/C...I_Complete.pdf

These books are both rather small in page count for a typical calc text but it seems they simply left out sections of sample problems and the answers in the back, so they should still be reasonable. My fast look is when examples cannot fit onto a single page in a size that does not add the distraction of flipping back and forth and/or not seeing the entire example broken into the author's intended components to show the concepts.

Remember these are simply intro courses into mathematics and not advanced texts, which ironically would likely lend themselves better to say an 8"-9" reader where a basic text is far less likely and that is due to upper division students usually not even needed a text because everything is in figuring out the proofs/solutions yourself, so the "exercise left to the student" is the norm not the exception...as we always said "...beware the skinny book..." because you knew they left out ALL the details...hehehe...and you know somewhere the author, if not turned to dust already, is laughing his/her happy arse off!! hehehehe....

If I have time, just for fun I'll convert in Calibre to be read on my K1 as well.
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Old 01-13-2010, 06:23 PM   #13
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I went ahead and converted the PDF for Calc III into a mobi file to read in the Kindle...it's nothing short of awful. Part of that is the conversion process of course because on my laptop the file looks fine. But just the first page of content, pg. 3 of the actual meat of the book, is all screwed up. The very first graphic is moved ahead of the text, the page itself takes three screens on the Kindle, I see no reason it would be any different on any other 6" screen even if the formatting of the PDF is preserved because one would need to zoom the page down so far as to be all but unreadable. To me zooming around a page is not going to make digesting the subject any easier.

Most modern math texts are designed for a page with at least a 10" diagonal and some even larger...few will be in the 8"-9.7" format but those would not mean a lot of shrinkage and would likely be quite usable in their native PDF format. But a 6" device, not a chance.

If I had more time I would offer some screen captures but I am buried this week, including the trial for the DUI hint and run bastard who wrecked the front end of my vehicle while I dared have it in my driveway off the street then claimed he never even knew he hit it...three eye witnesses though so the DA is sending this POS to jail for criminal DUI Hit & Run. At least he had insurance...but that is going to take a fair amount of time beyond work as he is trying to get out of it...he blew 1.2 when the cops arrested him at his home the same night, about an 30-mins later.
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Old 01-13-2010, 08:49 PM   #14
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thanks for taking the time. I found about 7 examples rather quickly. but i have discovered in the past it is best to let other do the choosing. I would pick a document and then the other person would assume i had picked one that was easy for a reader to display. This way its clearer for everyone and I get to see what a person is having issues with.

Sorry to hear about the drunk, i know how that feels. about a 15 years ago I had a car totalled by a drunk who smashed it while it was parked in my spot at my apartment. he pushed it 8 ft into a tree. this guy tried to run too but he only got about a mile away when he car died.
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Old 01-13-2010, 09:59 PM   #15
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thanks for taking the time. I found about 7 examples rather quickly. but i have discovered in the past it is best to let other do the choosing. I would pick a document and then the other person would assume i had picked one that was easy for a reader to display. This way its clearer for everyone and I get to see what a person is having issues with.

Sorry to hear about the drunk, i know how that feels. about a 15 years ago I had a car totalled by a drunk who smashed it while it was parked in my spot at my apartment. he pushed it 8 ft into a tree. this guy tried to run too but he only got about a mile away when he car died.
It finally dawned on my why ya asked for an example or two...d'oh!! hehehehe...but yeah, it's a formatting thing, especially important in areas of study like math, chemistry even biology and business. Anywhere that the pages are setup to enhance understanding. When those pages get broken apart a new hurdle is in place for students, even those who take to the subject like a duck to water can loose the concept since the focus is on the device not the learning. That's why I say a 9.7" is probably the minimum panel size for all but the most advance courses where there is often more text than equations. hehehehe....they show the original equations then a bit of a description, magic happens, then they show the result of the magic...it's up to the student to figure out the magic...one of my Abstract Algebra undergrad courses used a text also used later for a gad course and good gawds...it took a week to work through some of the magic parts!! hehehehe...so ereaders of any size probably would OK for those "thin books" where everything is left out and there is a twisted mathematician laughing his/her happy arse off somewhere.

And the issue with zooming is the same, the student simply can't see the whole explanation at the same time. slightly scaled down is OK but having to slide the page around the screen just adds too much confusion to the issue. And this is what my first thoughts were when I read the title for this thread I thought, "...a 6" device, they are kidding right? ..."

Thanks for your anecdote about your experience with a drunk behind the wheel. makes me I feel like I got off easy. Only thing with this guy was it came only a few weeks after losing my Mom and, well, I was still dealing with all the frustrations and such, so now, I am just pure angry because the guy has four previous DUI violations...so I am asking they go for Max. Pound him in the, well you know, Man Prison...I'm usually not that guy, but enough is enough. He has got nothing to cover compensation beyond damage to my vehicle so I am just lucky the guy had insurance.

Weird enough, the same night there was another guy who whacked eight parked cars on the street, not sure they caught him though...I am in a small town where it was always safe, but only moved back about 15yrs ago now to care for my Mom and I am appalled what this place has turned into...soon as I unload my inventory I am out of California for good and I was born & raised here but it's a cesspool anymore.
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