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Old 12-09-2009, 12:52 PM   #16
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Well, I am currently reading Under the Dome digitally. I will recieve another copy on my kindle on December 24. I considered cancelling my order, but I didn't intend to steal the book. I just can't stand being manipulated in this manner.
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Old 12-09-2009, 12:52 PM   #17
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Really funny that with the massive changes in technology and the world economy that the publishing industry thinks that IT should remain exactly the same. If the major publishers of today don't "adjust" to the new realities they will go the way of the dodo bird... Just ask your local newspaper for some insight into how the world is changing...
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Old 12-09-2009, 12:54 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rcuadro View Post
I think it is all about control. They cannot control the used book market but then can control the release of the eBook to try and maximize the sales
they are goingto control their way right into financial trouble!

Quote:
Originally Posted by wallcraft View Post
The article does not say so explicitly, but these publishers seem to be assuming that they can release 4 months later at the same list price as the hardcover. They are relying on Amazon to continue to take a hit on these titles and offer them at $9.99.

If publishers want to experiment with 4 months later at a lower list price (i.e. less income for them and their authors per sale), this is an approach that has an outside chance of working. I think 4 months later and sky high list prices is very likely to fail.

Either way, the authors of these titles are going to loose money due to the publisher's games. I think this is where the "we need to do this now" comes from, publishers know this is going to loose money for these titles but if only 5-10% of early sales are from ebooks perhaps their authors won't scream too loudly about the money the publishers are taking out of their pockets. Publishers are not in the business of enriching authors, but if I was one of the authors they screwed in this way I would look for another publisher.
maybe in addition to emailing the publishers about this, the authors need to be notified as well. "whoops! there goes another one!"

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Originally Posted by Dulin's Books View Post
So waiting for a few months to buy the newest book is "forcing" someone to get a stolen version of the book? thats rather drastic. why not just shift your book buying schedule a few months so you are not "forced" to steal? grab a couple of free classics or even purchase something else you wanted to read while you wait a couple months?

They don't put out the paperback at the same time as the hardcover, does that "force" you to steal the hardcover?
it doesn't work that way. if you are in the middle of a series and know a book is out, why should you wait to get it? how is getting a book on darknet any different than getting a book at the used bookstore? I have a dandy one here in town and there are a lot of readers that apparently don't like to keep books. all of the Harry Potter books were there within 2 weeks, Under THe Dome has already been there, almost all of the best sellers hit those shelves. going to the DarkNet just makes my reading more comfortable. don't get me wrong! I would in half a hearbeat be legitimate and buy like I am supposed to if they were treating me like a legitimate reader. this is THEIR choice, not mine
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Old 12-09-2009, 12:57 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sydney's Mom View Post
Well, I am currently reading Under the Dome digitally. I will recieve another copy on my kindle on December 24. I considered cancelling my order, but I didn't intend to steal the book. I just can't stand being manipulated in this manner.
I've got the same gig going on myself. I don't like to "steal", but they need a wake up call
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Old 12-09-2009, 12:59 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dulin's Books View Post
So waiting for a few months to buy the newest book is "forcing" someone to get a stolen version of the book?
I agree, if maybe not quite so forcefully.

If there is no reason to think there's going to be an e-book version out at all, I see nothing wrong with buying a paper copy and then getting an e-copy from the darknet if you don't mind dealing with those sites. That's just format switching.

If the e-book version is coming out later, though, why not wait? We wait for the paperback version all the time. There's a risk to the publisher there, that by the time the later version comes out you won't want it anymore: they'll be sacrificing the "impulse buy" market. But hey, if that's what they want to do... (shrug)

Personally I wish I had the time and energy to switch a large portion of my paperbacks to e-book versions. But I don't really want to put in the time/money to get a scanner and learn how to work it, and then OCR and proof everything. I admire and appreciate the MobileRead folks who post out-of-copyright works--not least because I'm to lazy to emulate them :-)
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Old 12-09-2009, 01:00 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sydney's Mom View Post
Well, I am currently reading Under the Dome digitally. I will recieve another copy on my kindle on December 24. I considered cancelling my order, but I didn't intend to steal the book. I just can't stand being manipulated in this manner.
You're not stealing. Youv'e paid for the book, you're just reading it when it should have been available in the first place. I too read (most) of Under the Dome from a digital copy that wasn't offered by the traditional publishers. If anybody was stolen from, it was me, I paid £10 (half-price) for the hardback of the book and only 100 pages of it were worth a damn penny. It's the last money that parasitic industry gets from me.
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Old 12-09-2009, 01:03 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by =X= View Post
One word "Boycott". All publishers and authors who support this tactic.

=X=
I don't think it will be necessary. The people being hurt the most by their tactics are themselves and the authors they represent.
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Old 12-09-2009, 01:09 PM   #23
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Like a few others, I dont buy hard cover books, and I rarely get the paperbacks either unless it is something that I know I'll like and will read again. Most (60%) of my books come from the library, so waiting to read a title is not too unreasonable for me - 4 months though is a bit long.

I don't have an eReader yet (soon, very soon) but I can see my purchasing habits changing to doing more purchasing and less borrowing, if for no other reason than the convenience of being able to do it while sitting on my couch.

I think this is bad call on their part it might increase hardcover and paperback sales a small amount. At the same time it will almost certainly decrease the eBook sales.
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Old 12-09-2009, 01:15 PM   #24
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If I were advising the publishers I would recommend that they get in front of ebooks before they lose total control...as what happened in music. They should consider backing a single format that has DRM and releasing it at the same time as the hardcover. The reason is that if they allow the device makers to maintain their own formats....then the sony's and amazons will gain a disproportionate share of the value capture (profits) since it increases the device maker's and retailer's negotiating position.

They should release the ebook format right away because it reduces incentive to pirate, maximizes on marketing costs, and reduces the size of the secondary market.

In general, when a firm tries to increase value capture at the expense of value creation it wins in the short run but loses in the long run. This is a fairly consistent phenomenon in business.

On the pro side for not releasing the ebook format right away is that it does the job of "price discriminating"....people with a high value on the book purchases right away and pays high price. people with a lower value on the book pay a lower price by delaying purchase. So, this makes sense.....but I think the cons are stronger.

Last edited by markbot; 12-09-2009 at 01:19 PM.
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Old 12-09-2009, 01:18 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sydney's Mom View Post
Well, I am currently reading Under the Dome digitally. I will recieve another copy on my kindle on December 24.
The darknet is currently clearly illegal in the US, but see How Team Tenenbaum missed a chance to shape P2P fair use law:
Quote:
But what's striking about the judge's memo is her frank admission that she might have gone along with a more limited form of this defense.

"As it made clear previously, the Court was prepared to consider a more expansive fair use argument than other courts have credited—perhaps one supported by facts specific to this individual and this unique period of rapid technological change. For example, file sharing for the purposes of sampling music prior to purchase or space-shifting to store purchased music more efficiently might offer a compelling case for fair use. Likewise, a defendant who used the new file-sharing networks in the technological interregnum before digital media could be purchased legally, but who later shifted to paid outlets, might also be able to rely on the defense."
This is just one federal judge, but publishers need to be careful not to assume that the law will be on their side no matter what games they try to play.
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Old 12-09-2009, 01:19 PM   #26
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Rose Fox has a post on this subject at Publishers Weekly.
http://www.publishersweekly.com/blog...630051163.html

One of the really interesting points is:
Quote:
In other words, this move is really not about people who are already reading e-books; they'll be annoyed by it, but they don't take up enough market share to matter. Rather, this is about discouraging people who read paper books from switching to e-books.
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Old 12-09-2009, 01:37 PM   #27
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Are they trying to encourage piracy??? The new generation of internet users aren't exactly used to waiting...and the culture of "sharing" is rather strong. Why give the users an incentive to look elsewhere for an ebook? Really, based on how it went for the music industry they should know in tough economic times people cut discretionary spending first. When it comes to file sharing not everyone is morally strong enough to withstand temptation and wait 4 months.
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Old 12-09-2009, 01:42 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Amalthia View Post
Are they trying to encourage piracy??? The new generation of internet users aren't exactly used to waiting...and the culture of "sharing" is rather strong. Why give the users an incentive to look elsewhere for an ebook? Really, based on how it went for the music industry they should know in tough economic times people cut discretionary spending first. When it comes to file sharing not everyone is morally strong enough to withstand temptation and wait 4 months.
If it was a matter of moral strength, and knowing what we know about publishers and how they treat writers, none of us would buy a single product from them in the first place.

This is about convenience. They, the big companies, fed us on a diet of convenience and low-low prices for the last fifty years. They provided that fattening food of getting-it-quicker and getting-it-cheaper. But now the pirates are providing it quicker and cheaper than they ever could. It's not morals, it's ease-of-use. It's the microwave vs the oven. The bicycle versus the car. The airplane ride vs the rocket to the moon.

I wonder who will win
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Old 12-09-2009, 01:49 PM   #29
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The article does not say so explicitly, but these publishers seem to be assuming that they can release 4 months later at the same list price as the hardcover. ...
Enough time, for people to scan the hardcover and make it available on darknet, so that many who may have bought the ebook at $9, will already have a copy, by the time the "legit" e-file is released.

Smart people, those publishers.
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Old 12-09-2009, 02:23 PM   #30
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Mr. Garland suggested that just as consumers now pay 99 cents for a song they want instead of $15 for an album, they may come to feel the same way about $25 hardcover best sellers. Once they become accustomed to paying $9.99 for a book, they won't go back, he said.
That's a fascinating insight.

Yes, when customers get used to paying lower prices, they'll insist on them. Unfortunately for the publishers, they can't invent market rates; they can only influence them. If *all* publishers agreed to this, they might have a chance to keep their current pricing schedule. However, several other major publishers, and dozens (hundreds?) of small/independent publishers, and lots of individual authors, have decided that ebooks should be cheaper than hardcovers even when released at the same time.

Apparently, these publishers are oblivious to how many people *never* buy hardcovers, and are not switching from hardcover to ebook, but paperback to ebook. Insisting that their ebooks lag behind hardcover sales won't get them back the customers who buy from their competitors during the lag time, because when that 4 months is up, there's a new crop of bestsellers--and their competitors' titles are available as ebooks *now.*
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