SF/fantasy books that turned into series, and shouldn't have

[DMcCunney]

This got touched off by Dr. Drib's threads in this area on Sf and Fantasy authors you should and shouldn't read.

One bit of discussion involved series, and got me to wondering: what series have you read that really never should have been turned into a series, and would have been far better as a stand alone novel?
______
Dennis

[GJN]

Dune...Dune...Dune...Dune...Dune...Dune...Dune...

Great book poorly served by each successive sequel/prequel/whateverquel

[DMcCunney]

Originally Posted by GJN

Dune...Dune...Dune...Dune...Dune...Dune...Dune...

Great book poorly served by each successive sequel/prequel/whateverquel

I'll concur, but have a question: would you consider Dune Messiah and Children of Dune part of Dune, and stop after those? Or would you have just stopped after the original Dune?

(Herbert wrote the first three as one long book, split in three for publications, which is why I ask.)
______
Dennis

[GJN]

Originally Posted by DMcCunney

I'll concur, but have a question: would you consider Dune Messiah and Children of Dune part of Dune, and stop after those? Or would you have just stopped after the original Dune?

(Herbert wrote the first three as one long book, split in three for publications, which is why I ask.)
______
Dennis

I didn't realize they were written as one book, but my opinion still stands. Dune was great, Dune Messiah not in the same class, Children of Dune better than Messiah but still not comparable to the original in my opinion. Everything afterwards shouldn't have been written.

The original Dune was great in large part because of Herbert's detailed world-building and the complexity of the associated societies. Once this was done in the first book, there was little left for the rest except for their respective plots and further character development; these were OK but unexceptional.

[DMcCunney]

Originally Posted by GJN

I didn't realize they were written as one book, but my opinion still stands. Dune was great, Dune Messiah not in the same class, Children of Dune better than Messiah but still not comparable to the original in my opinion. Everything afterwards shouldn't have been written.

That was about what I thought, and I mostly agree. Dune Messiah wasn't as well thought of when it was first released, either, but the weakness was generally ascribed to being the middle book in a trilogy. For structural reasons, those are almost always weaker than the other volumes.

The original Dune was great in large part because of Herbert's detailed world-building and the complexity of the associated societies. Once this was done in the first book, there was little left for the rest except for their respective plots and further character development; these were OK but unexceptional.

Agreed again, but I'm not sure how you get around it. If you have to substantially complete the world building on book one for the rest to make sense, what you describe is hard to avoid.
______
Dennis

[wayrad]

Originally Posted by DMcCunney

Agreed again, but I'm not sure how you get around it. If you have to substantially complete the world building on book one for the rest to make sense, what you describe is hard to avoid.

Steven Brust seems to be doing a nice job of continued world-building in the Vlad Taltos books. There are things in the early books that didn't make sense, but are now beginning to, and you get the feeling it was all planned instead of a quick fill-in job.

[PieOPah]

Originally Posted by DMcCunney

I'll concur, but have a question: would you consider Dune Messiah and Children of Dune part of Dune, and stop after those? Or would you have just stopped after the original Dune?

(Herbert wrote the first three as one long book, split in three for publications, which is why I ask.)
______
Dennis

I think I stopped reading after the fourth book (God Messiah Dune?). The one based thousands of years in the future and Paul's Son is mainly worm. I found the books so difficult to enjoy that I didn't bother with any more.

[JSWolf]

Diana Gabaldon's Outlander series should never have been published even starting with the first book.

[Ralph Sir Edward]

All the extra Asimov Foundation stores after the first 1940's trilogy...

[Darqref]

Originally Posted by Ralph Sir Edward

All the extra Asimov Foundation stores after the first 1940's trilogy...

Ya know, I remember reading some years ago that Isaac's publisher finally reached the point where they said "write another Foundation, or we're not going to publish anything else...." (because he had refused to write new ones...)

And Piers Anthony gets puns *sent to him by readers* to include in future Xanth stuff.

There really are authors who get told "we'll publish your other stuff as long as every other book is in the series."

[wayspooled]

Terry Goodkind's Sword of Truth after the first two. Third was okay but I thought it seriously went downhill after that. I thought the first book was pretty good and the second was just excellent.

[Margrete]

Originally Posted by wayspooled

Terry Goodkind's Sword of Truth after the first two. Third was okay but I thought it seriously went downhill after that. I thought the first book was pretty good and the second was just excellent.

agree, although I still ended up buying the hardback version of the last 5 books wanting to know what happened and hoping they'd be better.

Laurell K. Hamilton's Anita Blake books should have stopped somewhere around book 8. From that point on they have only gone more and more downhill

[Latinandgreek]

Originally Posted by wayspooled

Terry Goodkind's Sword of Truth after the first two. Third was okay but I thought it seriously went downhill after that. I thought the first book was pretty good and the second was just excellent.

I agree. I find myself forcing myself to read the rest of the series (I am on book 8) because I like the world that Terry Goodkind created, and a few of the books. I like the t.v. series as well, that is actually what got me reading the books; I can't seem to finish book 8, however, I am a quarter of the way through and NOTHING has happened. I wonder what happens with these writers when their books go downhill like that? Is it the pressure to make a series out of any good fantasy book, even though the good ideas aren't coming? I actually respect George R.R. Martin for taking his time with Song of Ice and Fire's fifth book (even though many of his fans are angry about the looooonnng wait between books), because it means that he wants to take his time to write a good book, as opposed to churning out moneymakers (I hope).

[Ralph Sir Edward]

Originally Posted by Darqref

Ya know, I remember reading some years ago that Isaac's publisher finally reached the point where they said "write another Foundation, or we're not going to publish anything else...." (because he had refused to write new ones...)

And Piers Anthony gets puns *sent to him by readers* to include in future Xanth stuff.

There really are authors who get told "we'll publish your other stuff as long as every other book is in the series."

That's the time to find another publisher....

[DMcCunney]

Originally Posted by Darqref

Ya know, I remember reading some years ago that Isaac's publisher finally reached the point where they said "write another Foundation, or we're not going to publish anything else...." (because he had refused to write new ones...)

And Piers Anthony gets puns *sent to him by readers* to include in future Xanth stuff.

There really are authors who get told "we'll publish your other stuff as long as every other book is in the series."

Not really, though publishers may suggest it. In the case of Anthony, for example. the stand alone novels do about half the sales volume of the series books.

Publishers like established series because the books sell.

I have a friend in Britain who was dropped by one of her US publishers. The problem was, she didn't write series. Each book was stand-alone, and quite different from the predecessor, so she didn't build the kind of identity with an audience the publisher liked. Her editor was deeply unhappy about it, but it wasn't the editor's decision. Determinations of who isn't selling enough and should be dropped from contract take place higher up. And the publisher in question was a big one who requires big sales. She's currently doing a lovely series for a much smaller publisher who seems happy with her sales.
______
Dennis