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Old 08-23-2011, 06:07 AM   #1
gsbe
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wrapped images in CS5.5

I'm having trouble with my wrapped images. I'm using the "anchored object" method of placing images combined with text wrap. I'd like to gain control over the margins displayed in iBooks.

The images are aligning correctly to the one side or the other with the auto-generated class by ID rightFloat or leftFloat. Here's an example of the image code that is generated and placed inside the paragraph where it is anchored:
Code:
<img class="rightFloat" width="26%" src="images/kick%20drum_fmt.jpeg" alt="kick%20drum.JPG"/>
I guess that it is making up that width percentage based on the size of the image on the page in ID. At any rate, that seems to be going ok.

The margins set in ID's text wrap box are not displaying in the final ePUB in iBooks. The only way I can figure out how to control these margins is by forcing these changes in the CSS post export.

Is this another one of those options in ID CS5.5 that doesn't export?
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Old 08-23-2011, 07:18 AM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gsbe View Post
The margins set in ID's text wrap box are not displaying in the final ePUB in iBooks. The only way I can figure out how to control these margins is by forcing these changes in the CSS post export.
Indesign is only a way to get files into the epub container. there are alot of things you need to post process. ID has alot of features which are never meant to be converted to ePub. The idea is to strip down the ID file to it minimilist form. No nested styles, etc...

Changing your minset to be keep it simple, and do the rest in the CSS, and you should be fine
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Old 08-24-2011, 01:00 AM   #3
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Arrow ID users are not all lazy...

I see this type of answer a lot to people's ID questions. Can't speak for all ID users but I'm trying to write a book and publish it in the shortest amount of time required.

I have decided to compose the book in ID for two reasons:
  1. ID looks a bit more inspiring to compose text in than a text editor
  2. ID is supposed to save me time tweaking the output for EPUB
I understand that the output isn't going to be perfect. BUT - I want it to be as perfect as ID is capable of before rolling up my sleeves.

I think this is pretty obvious but I see this response a lot...the knee-jerk response is "oh, ID user...must be a newbie that isn't ready for XHTML/CSS". That's not it, we just want to utilize what we got as well as we can first.

To respond to my OP, I don't think it is possible for ID CS5.5 to export the margin classes for wrapped images...at least I can't get it to do it automagically. Fix this in the generated CSS file, then save that CSS file somewhere else and use it as a CSS template for future EPUB exports.
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Old 08-24-2011, 01:21 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gsbe View Post
I see this type of answer a lot to people's ID questions. Can't speak for all ID users but I'm trying to write a book and publish it in the shortest amount of time required.
That's not what I was hinting at.
Alot of people who post here EXPECT just because ID can output to ePub, reads ID is a drive away no more pay epub creator...and get really upset when they find out they have to do additional work.

Quote:
Originally Posted by gsbe View Post
I have decided to compose the book in ID for two reasons:
  1. ID looks a bit more inspiring to compose text in than a text editor
  2. ID is supposed to save me time tweaking the output for EPUB
I understand that the output isn't going to be perfect. BUT - I want it to be as perfect as ID is capable of before rolling up my sleeves.
Yes it does all this to the best of it's ability. the ePub spec which is adheres to is a dumbed down version of an ID document. Featureless.

Quote:
Originally Posted by gsbe View Post
I think this is pretty obvious but I see this response a lot...the knee-jerk response is "oh, ID user...must be a newbie that isn't ready for XHTML/CSS". That's not it, we just want to utilize what we got as well as we can first.
It's wasn't knee-jerk at all I thought long and hard on how best to answer you. when in fact you answered your own question.

Quote:
Originally Posted by gsbe View Post
To respond to my OP, I don't think it is possible for ID CS5.5 to export the margin classes for wrapped images...at least I can't get it to do it automagically. Fix this in the generated CSS file, then save that CSS file somewhere else and use it as a CSS template for future EPUB exports.
List of things ID won't do on export to epub.
Textwrap
Nested styles
endnote hyperlinking
Floating boxes
Preserve local formatting (It does. But badly IMO)

Keeping in mind, what looks good on one reader may in tern look like a dog's breakfast on another

Last edited by Adjust; 08-24-2011 at 01:23 AM.
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Old 08-24-2011, 02:05 AM   #5
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Exclamation List of things ID won't do on export to epub

Awesome list, Adjust. Thank you. This is the goal of a sticky thread: concise and useful information in one place.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Adjust View Post
List of things ID won't do on export to epub.
Textwrap
Nested styles
endnote hyperlinking
Floating boxes
Preserve local formatting (It does. But badly IMO)
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Old 08-28-2011, 12:26 AM   #6
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Adjust, I'm guessing you're talking about an old version of InDesign? You didn't say which version you were referring to in your list.

The latest version, CS5.5 (released April 2011) does support nested styles (that is, it correctly applies character styles within them). It does a much better job of supporting floats/text wraps .. e.g. drop caps work now ... but I agree, still needs work.

CS5.5 makes it much easier than previous versions to control what content gets exported and in what order, if you use the new Articles panel. It has a fast and intuitive way to add custom alt tags to images. It lets you select any object or group and have it rasterize on export (per the custom settings you want) while still maintaining that completely editable in the ID file. You can insert page breaks before/after elements. You can map paragraph and character styles to CSS tags, which is a slick workflow if you have an external CSS that you link to ... great for when you're doing a series of similar books.

Yes there is room for improvement! Definitely. But I'd rather use the export to EPUB controls in ID CS5.5 than the ones in Acrobat or Word ... oh wait, they don't have an export to EPUB command.

Newbies to the field should realize that pros were creating EPUBs and MOBIs (Kindle ebooks) long before professional publishers (who use InDesign) got into it, so they have developed very good workflows that don't involve InDesign.

Ideally you format your book as a well-designed web site with formatting controlled by CSS, using the tags and markup allowed by the EPUB 2.x spec.

But if you're starting with an InDesign file, or a Word file and you're familiar w/ID and own it already, use that instead (pour the Word doc into ID). But you will very likely still need to crack open the EPUB and edit "the web site within" to some degree.

AM
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Old 08-28-2011, 03:00 AM   #7
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Originally Posted by amarie0 View Post
Ideally you format your book as a well-designed web site with formatting controlled by CSS, using the tags and markup allowed by the EPUB 2.x spec.
This is really the question. Is it faster to create a good looking website and figure out the file structure for ePub rather than bother with InDesign at all?

Clearly CS5.5 has made strides towards better ePub output but at the end of the day is Dreamweaver + an ePub structure reference and a text editor faster?

Depends, I guess, on how picky you are! And how quickly you pick up coding + file structuring. InDesign speeds up the overall packaging of an ePub but doesn't quite nail all the details of the presentation.

This whole ePub creation process is a mirror of early enhanced CDs, early website creation, etc. We all dreamed of a product to come along that would magically do all the dirty work for us but in the end it was always easier (if you planned on doing more than one) to learn the code and do it from scratch. Perhaps ePub development can learn from these bleeding edge moments in tech history. My first thought is how far open-source CMS and blog software have come towards the magical creation of highly functioning websites. What could be a parallel for etexts?

Last edited by gsbe; 08-28-2011 at 03:12 AM. Reason: brainstorming
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