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View Poll Results: ePub Creation
I currently produce ePub but not LRF 12 22.64%
I currently produce LRF but not ePub 20 37.74%
I currently produce ePub and LRF 9 16.98%
I currently produce neither ePub or LRF 2 3.77%
I will produce ePub when non-Sony devices support ePub 6 11.32%
I will produce ePub if Sony stops supporting LRF 3 5.66%
I do not plan on ever supporting ePub 4 7.55%
I need better tools to support ePub 15 28.30%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 53. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 12-29-2008, 05:38 AM   #16
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Originally Posted by llasram View Post
What sorts of tools do the people who say they want better tools want?
I could use a user-friendly (but not too "smart") .opf and .ncx editor. Having to manually add and name every file in the manifest, and make sure everything is in the spine can be a pain... the same with the "playOrder" in the .ncx.
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Old 12-29-2008, 03:49 PM   #17
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Originally Posted by llasram View Post
That's an AdobeDE limitation, not an EPUB limitation. Most other EPUB readers do full justification just fine.
Hmmm, so than is it my phsical reader hardware that is failing to display the epub in full justification? As a test, I downloaded "Animal Farm" in Epub format from our very own mobileread online library. I transferred it over to my PRS-505 and to my dismay there was no full justification.



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Also already a part of EPUB. In fact, it's the only format for which font embedding really works well -- if font embedding is important to you then EPUB is the format for you.
Unfortunately the tools that I've had exposure to have not presented to me the availability to embed fonts in epub. Perhaps they are commandline and I just need to research more on the topic. For the time being I've had fairly consistent results with embedding fonts in PDF, RTF, DOC, and LRF which are a necessity for me as a linguistic student. Any tips? I would love to make the switch to Epub knowing this will truly be the standard.
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Old 12-29-2008, 04:03 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by Abisha View Post
Hmmm, so than is it my phsical reader hardware that is failing to display the epub in full justification?
Its the software (Adobe Digital Editions) which fails to support full justification, even in its Desktop version which certainly isn't hardware limited.
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Old 12-29-2008, 06:49 PM   #19
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Hmmm, so than is it my phsical reader hardware that is failing to display the epub in full justification?
You may not have realized it, but the Reader's EPUB support is via a version of AdobeDE on the device. So like wallcraft said, same limitations.

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Originally Posted by Abisha View Post
Unfortunately the tools that I've had exposure to have not presented to me the availability to embed fonts in epub.
Calibre doesn't yet do direct font embedding (le sigh), but you can use some Reader-specific CSS tricks to get EPUB books you generate to use fonts you've copied onto the Reader.

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Originally Posted by Abisha View Post
Perhaps they are commandline and I just need to research more on the topic. For the time being I've had fairly consistent results with embedding fonts in PDF, RTF, DOC, and LRF which are a necessity for me as a linguistic student.
Oh, fair enough. I wasn't counting PDF as an e-book format, and didn't realize RTF had font embedding / supported it on the Reader. LRF definitely does it, but I was under the impression it could still be a bit chancy given our knowledge of the format, but I haven't looked at it in a while. By comparison EPUB font embedding is drop-dead simple -- include the font files in the ZIP archive and reference them via @font-face rules in the included CSS.
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Old 12-29-2008, 07:25 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by llasram View Post

Calibre doesn't yet do direct font embedding (le sigh), but you can use some Reader-specific CSS tricks to get EPUB books you generate to use fonts you've copied onto the Reader.
This isn't quite as simple to do as you might think at first glance. What about source documents that specify font families of their own or embed their own fonts?
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Old 12-29-2008, 08:16 PM   #21
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Old 12-30-2008, 01:29 AM   #22
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Originally Posted by kovidgoyal View Post
This isn't quite as simple to do as you might think at first glance. What about source documents that specify font families of their own or embed their own fonts?
Oh, I know -- that's part of why I haven't just jumped in and implemented it myself . I do think that supporting adding fonts and @font-face rules for 'serif', 'sans-serif', and 'monospace' would cover at least 80% of uses though.
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Old 12-30-2008, 01:44 AM   #23
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There's actually a reasonably powerful class in the matplotlib source code that takes a CSS font family name and maps it to the "closest" font on your system. That could be used to take care of documents that specify their own font families.
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Old 12-30-2008, 05:34 AM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Abisha View Post
Hmmm, so than is it my phsical reader hardware that is failing to display the epub in full justification? As a test, I downloaded "Animal Farm" in Epub format from our very own mobileread online library. I transferred it over to my PRS-505 and to my dismay there was no full justification.
The book does not specify any justification or text alignment, so the justification (or lack of it) you see is the reader's default. Whether this default can be changed or not is another thing.

If you use the provided index.zip (as explained in the post) to read the book in a web browser, you should see full justification. This is so because there is index.css on top of the book's css, and there you have "body { text-align: justify }". This "trick" is what I'd expect ePUB readers could use (i.e., have a user-configurable css), but apparently they don't (yet). Besides, it seems Adobe DE (and Sony) don't support full justification at all, even if it were called for by the book itself. But as others have said, this is not a problem of ePUB, but of the readers (well, ePUB's is to blame in that full justification is not a required feature, I think)
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Old 12-30-2008, 05:57 AM   #25
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But as others have said, this is not a problem of ePUB, but of the readers (well, ePUB's is to blame in that full justification is not a required feature, I think)
It strikes me as a quite astonishing omission.
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Old 12-30-2008, 06:37 AM   #26
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It strikes me as a quite astonishing omission.
Absolutely. But didn't we have THAT discussion before, Harry? Well, we were on the same side, but the techie boys (including Hadrien and Kovid) were on the other!
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Old 12-30-2008, 08:56 PM   #27
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Absolutely. But didn't we have THAT discussion before, Harry? Well, we were on the same side, but the techie boys (including Hadrien and Kovid) were on the other!
On which side ? I hate ragged right, I can only read fully justified text with good hyphenation. I can't understand at all why DE supports something as complicated as XSL-FO, yet doesn't allow the user to select this sort of things.
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Old 12-30-2008, 09:18 PM   #28
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On which side ? I hate ragged right, I can only read fully justified text with good hyphenation. I can't understand at all why DE supports something as complicated as XSL-FO, yet doesn't allow the user to select this sort of things.
Wasn't the question if it should be a required feature or not and to me it seems that requiring it will make it harder to implement viewers on some platforms.
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Old 12-30-2008, 10:09 PM   #29
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On which side ? I hate ragged right, I can only read fully justified text with good hyphenation. I can't understand at all why DE supports something as complicated as XSL-FO, yet doesn't allow the user to select this sort of things.
Oops, sorry Hadrien. Coffee's on me.
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Old 12-30-2008, 10:42 PM   #30
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Wasn't the question if it should be a required feature or not and to me it seems that requiring it will make it harder to implement viewers on some platforms.
Justification is a very simple thing to support. Sure it might not look very good on small screens but even in a low ressource environment it's pretty easy to support.
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