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Old 06-12-2011, 10:16 AM   #1
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Thoughts about tablets with pen input

Since I'm after a tablet with a stylus I've been looking around and so far there's not a lot out there.

I've looked at the HTC Flyer but that one is not capable enough for pen input.
I've also looked at the ASUS Eee Note EA-800 (reviews have been mixed) and the device never really took off.

After browsing around I got interested in the HP Slate 500 with Windows 7 but that was before I read this review:
http://www.robbushway.com/2011/05/09...te-your-money/

The things I found interesting about the device:

Getting a full fledged Firefox.
Getting PDF Annotator to work as it does on a regular PC.

The price is high, I do not consider $700-$800 dollars to be a competitive price but I'm guessing it's expected when the tablet is focused towards the business segment.

Here are some YouTube-videos covering the device:








Specifications: http://h10010.www1.hp.com/wwpc/us/en...=in_r602_slate

Now I'm turning my eyes to the Asus EP121: http://www.asus.com/Eee/Eee_Pad/Eee_Slate_EP121/
But at a price of $1.350 it's quite expensive but the screen looks awesome (12.1" LED backlight WXGA (1280x800) Screen Capacitive and Electromagnetic Panel with AFFS).


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Old 06-17-2011, 05:15 PM   #2
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Wow! The ASUS really jumped in price! It was expensive when I bought the EP121-1A005M model at $1099. The only difference (that's listed that I can see, anyway) is that the EP121-1A010M you linked to on Amazon uses 1333 MHz SDRAM while mine pokes along at 1066 MHz.

You might want to see this comparison of the Slate 500 and the EP121 on YouTube. As the man says, the ASUS is a big piece of tablet to haul around.

Also - and this applies to both - you have heard, haven't you, that Windows is about the least friendly OS for touch applications? Just so long as you're aware of that....

A couple of other possibilities. ASUS also makes the Eee Note EA800. They canceled international distribution (except for Italy, maybe) but you can get it from Taiwan through pchome or eBay.

Entourage made the Edge and Pocket Edge. They just went out of business, but devices are available on eBay, and there's a forum here supporting them. Two screens - one e-ink, the other LCD, and you can draw on both.

I suppose your choice might depend on what you want to do with the stylus, huh? I hope this helps a little.

-- Ed
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Old 06-18-2011, 04:16 AM   #3
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Also - and this applies to both - you have heard, haven't you, that Windows is about the least friendly OS for touch applications? Just so long as you're aware of that....
Yes, probably best to wait for the "proper" tablet-enabled Windows 8 if you want to run Windows on a tablet.
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Old 06-18-2011, 07:09 AM   #4
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If you have a pen like my tablet, then Windows 7 touch runs great. And you can do a lot more with it than with a phone OS tablet. But things to consider are weight and battery life. The Fujitsu Q550 may be a good choice for you.
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Old 06-18-2011, 03:31 PM   #5
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Coming back to read what others have added, I now see the MobileTechReview of the EP121 that I didn't notice before. It does a good job of pointing out the high points of the tablet.

She said that the USB slots are "fiddly" - they're a royal pain! And if you noticed, she had trouble getting the stylus back into its silo. These are minor details, but they're the kind that could just drive you crazy in a short while if you're the type that gets driven crazy by small details!

I do actually like the thing, but it's so expensive! But the specs are good, like a 12" laptop where someone forgot to attach the keyboard. I used it for a short time with that bluetooth keyboard and a mouse as my desktop computer, and that worked out well. It just seems that for that much money they should give you this year's Core i5 instead of last year's.

So I haven't done much with it as a touch tablet. I had some accuracy trouble when using my fingers. Maybe there's an adjustment for it. But no matter how hard I smashed down my finger onto the screen, the area selected (which shows up as a target) was tiny and usually just above or below the active spot of what I was trying to hit.

If that could be made larger (and it seems like it should be possible), then I'd say my touch experience with it was just fine. And as HansTWN said, the stylus certainly works in Win7.

I have a friend who's an amateur cartoonist and swears by her iPad. It's true that there aren't many options available to you, but there are a few ... enough so that your choice kind of depends on your "application," meaning both what software you want to run and what your intended purpose is.

-- Ed
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Old 06-20-2011, 04:41 PM   #6
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If you want to go a little cheaper, you might consider the ASUS T91MT or T101MT. They are two little EEE netbooks with a multitouch resistive touchscreens. As such, they are capable of using a normal stylus, unlike the capacitive ones with larger tips. They also come equipped with a keyboard and a trackpad. The downsides: the stylus comes without an active digitizer, which means the computer will respond when your palm touches the screen. As such, taking notes requires some practice, but most people report eventually being successful by placing their palm on the sides. Also, the processor is extremely slow, which means you will need to do some tweaking to get it to adequately run; however, once you get rid of all the ASUS bloatware, you'll find that it will run fast enough to handle most of your tasks.

I've had the ASUS T91MT for about two years. It is an excellent little computer, and you have numerous advantages over Android tablets; for example, you can install the full Office 2010 suite instead of relying on the crappy mobile versions (and, I will confess, Office already has an excellent set of inking features). Also, you can install the full version of Adobe Acrobat, which does an excellent job rendering *.pdf files. The main problem is that Windows 7 is just not designed for touchscreens. You won't be able to whip out your ASUS and quickly use it to check your calendar. You can't use it to quickly and easily take notes. In my opinion, you won't be able to completely replace a standard paper notepad with a Windows 7 device because of the OS limitations. For all those reasons, I've recently started using an Android device, although I must confess that I find it rather crappy for word processing.

One final thing: reading PDFs is vastly superior on an Android device. While I successfully read on the T91MT with Adobe Acrobat, I think the interface is better in programs like ezPDF Reader (which is hilarious given the enormous price difference in the software). Essentially, Android is ALL AROUND better for things that require touchscreen input. You might consider looking for an Android device with a resistive touchscreen (like the Entourage Edge) or waiting around until Viewsonic's Viewbook 730 launches.

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Old 06-24-2011, 07:01 PM   #7
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The main problem is that Windows 7 is just not designed for touchscreens. You won't be able to whip out your ASUS and quickly use it to check your calendar. You can't use it to quickly and easily take notes. In my opinion, you won't be able to completely replace a standard paper notepad with a Windows 7 device because of the OS limitations. For all those reasons, I've recently started using an Android device, although I must confess that I find it rather crappy for word processing.

One final thing: reading PDFs is vastly superior on an Android device. While I successfully read on the T91MT with Adobe Acrobat, I think the interface is better in programs like ezPDF Reader (which is hilarious given the enormous price difference in the software). Essentially, Android is ALL AROUND better for things that require touchscreen input. You might consider looking for an Android device with a resistive touchscreen (like the Entourage Edge) or waiting around until Viewsonic's Viewbook 730 launches.
Actually you can check into outlook on my tablet PC even without firing up windows. But startup on the EP121 is just 2 seconds from hibernation and on my HP about 5-10. So sure, you can quickly check you calendar. Just leave Outlook open before you hibernate.

The problem you are having are probably due to the fact that the models you mentioned are greatly underpowered. They are so slow, they are a pain to use. And the screens leave a lot to be desired, not because they are resistive, but because of colors, brightness, etc.

The new models, Fujitsu Q550 and the Asus EP121 are really the best possible no-compromise tablets. They would be even a lot better with Sandy Bridge processors. There is still so much you can't do in Android and iOS (real multitasking, Android has VPN problems, you need to spend money on so many apps to increase functionality).

I will be looking at Android or WebOS tablets again in a year or two, now they are still just toys.

As for PDF reading, the new Adobe Reader X seems vastly improved.
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Old 08-05-2011, 02:01 PM   #8
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Thanks for all the great information, reading this really brought me up-to-date. I am looking for an inking device to move away from the keyboard, and d basic text cutting and pasting between pdf and doc files, simple formatting.... but the backlit LCD panels on all these devices really hurt my eyes, I hope a non-backlit display device would be available on the market which can do these basic features.... from my understanding the notes taken on the ea-800 can't be converted to text, please correct me if I am wrong. If any of you would have suggestions how to have these functionalities but without working on lit-up displays please let me know! As a teacher the less time I can spend in front of them the better.... but at the same time I can't give hand-written notes and tests to my students these days...
Thanks again.
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Old 08-06-2011, 04:05 AM   #9
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Brihat, you should talk to Sarah. She has tried a lot of devices and especially the inking feature of different devices. See this thread: http://www.mobileread.com/forums/sho....php?p=1689755
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Old 08-06-2011, 12:37 PM   #10
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Thanks, just sent her an email.
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Old 08-06-2011, 02:03 PM   #11
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Although I have way too many devices to justify any more right now, I have Google alerts set for the Motion CL 500 and recently just deleted one for the Fujitsu Q550. If I were in the market for a full-fledged, tablet PC slate, those are what I'd be looking at.

So few of the "tablets" out there really make the cut for being a stylus-based tablet. I'm still amazed at all the posts suggesting iPads for note taking/pdf devices. Just because you *can* touch a pointy stick to it, does not make it a "tablet" in my book!

The new Lenovo ThinkPad due out this month is intriguing, too, as it will run Android 3.1 not Windows. (I try not to be one of those Windows bashers, but I do get annoyed whenever I use the tablet PC that the OS "gets in my way" all the time.) And for those who don't mind Windows, there is the IdeaPad due out in the fall.

http://shop.lenovo.com/us/products/tablets/

But I still have yet to find something that would make me choose it over the Entourage Edge. Fortunately I should have a good couple of years at least left with that device. By then, maybe there will be some decent options.
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Old 08-06-2011, 02:17 PM   #12
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If handwriting recognition is essential to you, you might be stuck with an LCD screen. Even if you used an alternative device to create notes, you'd probably still have to import to a computer and convert the handwriting with something like One Note. Of course, that would probably also require some clean up and corrections, so how much time away from the screen you'd be saving is unknown.

You will have seen me say this a few times now, but I love my Entourage Edge for curriculum stuff. Except for the fact that I can only annotate whole pages set at 100% view level (unlike a tablet PC where you can zoom in, write, then zoom out again), the Edge is my choice for creating worksheets with handwritten components. I was without any computer for about 4 months last year, and the edge was the only machine I had. It was my only machine, and I could do just about everything on it between what the LCD tablet side offered and what the e-ink reader/journal/note taking side offered. I'm really disappointed it's now a discontinued machine as I think it's great for educators. I'm lucky I bought one when the company and device was full of hope and promise, because it's not as easy a decision to make when you know it's been end of life'd.

I somewhat hesitate to recommend the Asus Eee Note to someone complaining of eye strain, as I could see some people finding it difficult to read from. It's just not as sharp/high contrast as e-ink, and sometimes looks a little washed out to me if you're not in really good light. It's not so much strain from the LCD as it is strain from feeling like you don't have enough light. I'm not sure whether one is any better than the other.

I've always said I think the Eee Note is perfect if you just want it to hold all your notes/sketches/ideas and don't often have to (or don't mind the steps involved in) getting that info OUT of the device and integrated with other technology. So, if you used it to get all your thoughts out, scribble out the test questions, and then (just as if you had done so in a paper notebook), went to the computer just to type in and format into your word processor.

But honestly, I think some people would be better served simply by writing on paper and scanning it in to the computer, then using pdf software to make adjustments. Or, many would be well-served using one of those pens that captures information that can then be transcribed/edited. (I don't happen to be one of those people, as I'm not looking to just capture my words, but actually care about the visual appearance of my handwritten words.)

And, from one teacher to another, don't necessarily write off handwritten tests and assignments! I routinely gave handwritten pages, and my students said they liked it because it seemed "friendlier." If that's the case, you could totally scribble something up on the Eee Note, upload the note to Google Docs (then you don't get the background/grey border effect) which will be a .zip file that extracts as gifs, and just print those out as pdfs. Even then, you might be able to find an OCR software option to convert the text.

And, as has been mentioned in another thread, the Onyx Boox M90 and Pocketbook 902/903 are options to consider as well. I haven't had a chance to play with either of those, and I have found the Asus Eee Note to be a reasonable compromise for the much smaller price... and of course, I have an Entourage Edge so I pretty much already have the best machine out there right now.
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Old 08-06-2011, 03:10 PM   #13
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For what it's worth, someone has a handful of Entourage Edge's on eBay for $189 right now. That's the price I just paid for my (slightly used) Asus Eee Note: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...#ht_772wt_1248

Update: dropped to $169

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Old 08-06-2011, 10:50 PM   #14
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Wow! Lots of good information. It is all very helpful, Sarah. I just read this thread at the end of all other ones so will now do my homework!
Thanks again.

P.S. how are the features on the Nokia N810?
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Old 08-07-2011, 05:01 PM   #15
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P.S. how are the features on the Nokia N810?
It's surprisingly competent. It has the best journal/notes software of anything available (Xournal - pretty much identical to what Tablet PCs use). You can zoom in to annotate, then zoom out again, so you have a lot of control over marking up pdfs. It's actually an ultramobile PC, so it's really like a mini-computer.

Two big issues: 4 inch screen and resistive touch screen (not wacom). I'd rather have resistive than capacitive for a writing device (better stylus interaction), but it does mean that you can't touch the screen at all while you write.

But this device has handwriting recognition, just like a tablet PC, so that you can handwrite into a "notes" or word processing doc. Go figure, this little thing from years ago can do some of the things we're still waiting for our current gen devices to do!
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