07-06-2008, 05:36 PM | #31 | |
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07-06-2008, 05:44 PM | #32 |
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Many societies consider first cousin and closer marriage to be incestuous. I have heard that the Israeli crèches that is is unusual for crèche brother & sister (though unrelated by blood) to marry. That may be due to the taboo influencing people or it may just be a product of "familiarity breeds contempt".
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07-06-2008, 05:48 PM | #33 | |
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But we wouldn't want to write "dreck" here on MR. |
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07-06-2008, 05:57 PM | #34 | |
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As for reasons other than recessives, the best one I know of is simple. In any society at any time, it was effectively impossible to be self-sufficient. In order to survive and prosper, you needed the assistance of others. What would motivate others to assist? One of the strongest motivations is blood kinship - they're your relatives. Consider the institution of arranged marriages still practiced in some cultures. They aren't love matches, they are political and economic alliances between families, arranged by the families for the benefit of the families. It's a perfect example of the above. "Keeping it in the family" reduces your available ties with others, and in the long term is anti-survival. Now, you can argue that the advanced technology available to Lazarus Long and company lessened the strength of that argument, too, but RAH doesn't seem to have ever considered it as a factor. ______ Dennis |
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07-06-2008, 06:14 PM | #35 | ||||
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07-06-2008, 06:23 PM | #36 | |
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Well sometimes it works out that the artist does what they want, and then finds a patron who is willing to fund what the artist wants to do. That was always my idea of what the patronage system should be. The artist should have a patron who shares their artistic viewpoint. In an ideal universe that is. |
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07-06-2008, 06:23 PM | #37 | |||
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And yes, I agree entirely about making you think in ways you aren't accustomed to. Quote:
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07-06-2008, 06:39 PM | #38 | |
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Granted that repeated first cousin unions over a number of generations can cause genetic abnormalities to become the norm, but to call every such union "incest" I think is taking the term too far. I would think it would be unusual for step-brothers and sisters to marry, along the same reasoning as you posed for the Israeli creche, but an unusual union is not necessarily an incestuous one. Society might have had a jaw dropping moment when Woody Allen married his current missus ... but the union was neither culturally or legally forbidden. I do agree with regard to the ancient Egyptians, to the extent that full or half siblings were expected to marry and produce offspring. That's not a great way to have a genetically healthy lineage. But then ... what are you supposed to do when your kings and queens are "gods" ... you can't just have them mating with other mortals .... That was one of those things that always amused me about the book of Genesis ... since there was only one instance of actual "creation" then where did all those other people come from ... if not for incest? |
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07-06-2008, 06:42 PM | #39 |
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There's nothin wrong with incest as long as you keep it in the family.
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07-06-2008, 06:46 PM | #40 |
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07-06-2008, 06:59 PM | #41 | |
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Also I would agree that it is anti-survival from a family sense but not necessarily from an individual sense. Yes I know that the family working together is stronger than the individual alone. But an individual who is accustomed to working alone is a stronger individual than one who has always been supported by the family. Perhaps I'm just atavistic in my outlook. |
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07-06-2008, 07:02 PM | #42 | ||
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07-06-2008, 10:16 PM | #43 |
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Heinlein may have been somewhat weak on plots in general, but Mistress, at least, had a very strong plot. I would say Have Spacesuit, Will Travel was another strongly plotted book. Perhaps I just held his other works to too high a standard. His own damn fault! Agreed that Citizen of the Galaxy is another of Heinlein's finest, and probably the most "mature" (whatever that's supposed to mean) of the "juveniles." Starman Jones is interesting partially because of the analog computers, I've always thought. (But then, I taught myself to use a slide rule based partially on Heinlein's descriptions of them.) And The Star Beast is such a funny and revealing look at politics and bureaucracy, I still refer back to it when I want to remind myself how things "really" work.
The least memorable of the YA books, to my mind, was Time for the Stars. Not that it was a bad book, just not one of the favorites I come back to over and over. Rocket Ship Galileo was another slightly wobbly one. Not bad, just not as good as Farmer in the Sky or The Rolling Stones (weak plotting in both of these, I think, but great characters). Dennis, your suspicions about Willis being a Martian nymph are confirmed in the uncut version of Red Planet, I think. (Though there was some very strong hinting even in the earlier release.) |
07-07-2008, 12:01 AM | #44 | ||||||
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I can't quote a citation to prove it, but I believe _Starship Troopers_ was originally intended to be one of the YA line, as well. Quote:
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______ Dennis |
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