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Old 03-27-2014, 02:41 AM   #16
Gregg Bell
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Originally Posted by Hitch View Post
Ixnay on the soft-hypens-ay. BAD.

P.S., Gregg?

Well, it matters if you're tying to use a Tiff file, sure. Otherwise, stop thinking about the GUI, and think only about what's underneath: the HTML. What you are asking here is essentially: Does the color of the car affect the quality of the engine inside it?

And the answer is, no; the color of the car doesn't affect the quality of the engine inside it; in your particular case, the care you take in putting the engine in, in the FIRST place, affects the final quality of the engine when it's output from OO or LO or Word or Pages or Bob's Big-Boy Word Processor.

Right? Styles = CSS. CSS = "how stuff looks." Styles being mapped to ELEMENTS, like paragraphs versus headings versus blockquotes, will affect how the input works. Don't use paragraph styles, designed to "look big" as chapter heads; use HEADER styles. Don't use paragraph styles with double-indents as blockquotes; use blockquotes (if that's available as a style). Use LISTS, not typed stuff, for lists. Numero Uno Big Bookmaker Rule: first think about what it IS; then worry about what it looks like later. THAT, far more than OO versus LO versus Word, etc., will "matter" to Sigil.

IMHO.

Hitch
Hitch, Thanks. I do think in styles. It's just using LO one time I got all these span tags all over the place when I used italics. That didn't usually happen in LO, and it never happened in Word, so I freaked out a bit. (Is there a special way of dealing with italics in styles (in LO--I'm not using Word anymore--I could if I absolutely have to though)? I just do everything in the "Text Body" style, and when I have to use italics I just left click and drag over the word or phrase and click the Italics icon on the toolbar.)

And I hear what you're saying about the color of the car and the engine. That is my focus too. But, esp. switching over to Linux, that has seemed a little iffy too. My old process was Word-->html via "Web page filtered" (in Word)-->Sigil. It was flawless. I just had this MsOnormal stuff that was basically cleaned up with a single "replace all."

So my big question now is, How to get the best html from an .odt? Some say convert it right in LO. Others say skip the html and go straight to epub via the Writer2Epub converter in LO. Or convert the .odt in Calibre to an epub. Then there's the Calibre editor where you can enter an html. What do you think?

Last edited by Gregg Bell; 03-27-2014 at 03:20 AM. Reason: adding screenshot
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Old 03-28-2014, 06:04 AM   #17
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So Hitch, i suppose what you are saying is just WRITE in a strict NOTEPAD type program; NO markup on the text AT ALL, then, when the basic work IS finished, copy the text into the eBook editor of your choice, and do the markups, assigning of styles etc there?
No need to go quite that far! But, if writing in Word, learn your tools. If you're still at the stage where you can't quite understand why it's wrong to centre a heading by prefacing a string of spaces, your ebook conversion is going to have problems!
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Old 03-28-2014, 10:41 AM   #18
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Greg, what I do is run the doc file (created in Word or in Open Office Writer/LibreWriter) through word2cleanhtml.com online. In my experience, OO Writer produces slightly different results. For example, once I got <p=NORMAL> instead of simply <p> so I did a quick search & replace. (I could also have modified the style sheet to accommodate p.NORMAL.)

Assuming your intention is to publish the result through online retailers, note that Calibre-generated files are sometimes (often?) rejected by Kindle Direct Publishing.
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Old 03-28-2014, 02:15 PM   #19
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Hitch, Thanks. I do think in styles. <snip> My old process was Word-->html via "Web page filtered" (in Word)-->Sigil. It was flawless.
I don't mean to be dense, but since the "old" process was flawless, you're switching it ....why?

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Old 03-28-2014, 02:39 PM   #20
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I think because of the end of life for Windows/XP and Greg wanting to move to a supported environment....
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Old 03-28-2014, 02:43 PM   #21
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I think because of the end of life for Windows/XP and Greg wanting to move to a supported environment....
Um..can't he run a VM with XP in it, to keep the process? (If, for some reason, he can no longer run XP wherever he was?) Just because XP isn't being further supported doesn't mean it's going to explode in a ball of fiery death right this instant. And, equally dumb, why not just buy Win7? Instead of all the Linux pain and suffering? (For someone who isn't a Linux user by desire or nature, inherently, I mean. No Linux-bashing here. Just askin'.)

Hell, I have two XP boxes here that are still functioning; one has older, never-updated software on it that we still use. I haven't marked out their tombstones yet.

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Old 03-28-2014, 03:30 PM   #22
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Hitch; I agree fully. No reason at all to stop using XP. Its like all the hype that ATM machines are often based on XP. Heck... they are on a controlled, NON public network with strict change management in place... How on EARTH are they going to be exploited!
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Old 03-28-2014, 03:48 PM   #23
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Had a friend call me the other other day in a full-on panic. He was convinced his XP machine was going to stop functioning on <whatever-date-Microsoft-indicated-support-was-stopping>.

I tried to convince him otherwise, but I'm not sure I succeeded. I think he was just humoring me, and still ordered a brand new PC as soon as he hung up with me.
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Old 03-28-2014, 03:59 PM   #24
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Well, if you are exposing your XP machine to the internet you will be at risk more of course. To be honest, the support length for XP has been more than generous for an operating system.
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Old 03-28-2014, 05:42 PM   #25
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Well, if you are exposing your XP machine to the internet you will be at risk more of course. To be honest, the support length for XP has been more than generous for an operating system.
Oh, yeah, totally! (the duration of the support). That's why I made the comment I did the other day, about the "everybody loves Apple, everybody hates Microsoft" conundrum, to my way of thinking. I'm sitting here with a first-gen iPad that's been effectively abandoned; half the apps I would use no longer run on it. Nor can they. Apple just chucked it over.

XP, on the other hand (and Office 2003) have been supported for dog's years, nearly, what, 11-13 years, or something like that? That's un-freaking-believable.

I'm not nuking my XP laptop yet, not until I can snag the Surface Pro 2 that I've been waiting (and waiting and waiting) for. (The wait for which getteth on my nerveth).

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Old 03-28-2014, 08:17 PM   #26
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Greg, what I do is run the doc file (created in Word or in Open Office Writer/LibreWriter) through word2cleanhtml.com online. In my experience, OO Writer produces slightly different results. For example, once I got <p=NORMAL> instead of simply <p> so I did a quick search & replace. (I could also have modified the style sheet to accommodate p.NORMAL.)

Assuming your intention is to publish the result through online retailers, note that Calibre-generated files are sometimes (often?) rejected by Kindle Direct Publishing.
Thanks Notjohn. Tried word2cleanhtml.com and it didn't work too well for me. And yeah, I'm kind of leery of Calibre because of what you mentioned.


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Um..can't he run a VM with XP in it, to keep the process? (If, for some reason, he can no longer run XP wherever he was?) Just because XP isn't being further supported doesn't mean it's going to explode in a ball of fiery death right this instant. And, equally dumb, why not just buy Win7? Instead of all the Linux pain and suffering? (For someone who isn't a Linux user by desire or nature, inherently, I mean. No Linux-bashing here. Just askin'.)

Hitch
No, no, I hear ya. I've been on the verge of going Windows 7 a million times (all this su su sudio crap with Linux commands!), but Linux is growing on me. I'm getting kind of into it. And the sluggish XP Dells are now lightning fast and not overloaded and crashing like XP regularly was.

And XP is going to work come April 8th. Some of the browsers too. MSE is extended. But the OS is not supported. I can't see working long-term like that.

And I don't know enough about VM and running XP in it. If I do that, will I be vulnerable to a virus (post April 8th)? That might be a good solution for me.

I miss XP just because I was so used to it. Now it's like I'm re-inventing the wheel every single day. (Eg. Today I needed a .mobi and had no Kindle Previewer to convert my .epub. Which amounts to a time-wasting pain in the derriere.)

But there's got to be some kind of middle ground/hybrid that will work.

And, Hitch, you were like, '.doc, .odt, etc. doesn't matter,' but I'm finding that .odt and the styles in LO are not as dependable as the styles in Word and Office 2003.

So I don't know. I'm still on the fence.
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Old 03-28-2014, 08:57 PM   #27
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FWIW : I run an OS/2 Warp system to maintain process control software used at a couple of sugar mills. OS/2 Warp support officially came to an end 2006, practically it came to an end in 2001. I occasionally have it connected to the 'net.

MS is second to IBM in supporting its legacy. There's an IBM mainframe utility, IEBGENER (amongst many others), that was first released on OS/360 (1964), at that time Messrs Gates and Jobs were both 9 years of age. It is still there in today's z/OS - 50 years later. Its comforting to know that the JCL I wrote at ICI in the '60s could be working at AkzoNobel today :lol:

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Old 03-28-2014, 09:47 PM   #28
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Thanks Notjohn. Tried word2cleanhtml.com and it didn't work too well for me. And yeah, I'm kind of leery of Calibre because of what you mentioned.
Yeah, I know that nj likes it, but honestly, I get better cleaned stuff from Tox's ePUBTools, absolutely. I know some folks think that Calibre does a good job from .doc, but I can't speak to that, have not tried it.



Quote:
No, no, I hear ya. I've been on the verge of going Windows 7 a million times (all this su su sudio crap with Linux commands!), but Linux is growing on me. I'm getting kind of into it. And the sluggish XP Dells are now lightning fast and not overloaded and crashing like XP regularly was.
Well, I hear that. I have two old cheap refurbed Dells here that have Red Hat on 'em. Very fast with Red Hat.

Quote:
And XP is going to work come April 8th. Some of the browsers too. MSE is extended. But the OS is not supported. I can't see working long-term like that.

And I don't know enough about VM and running XP in it. If I do that, will I be vulnerable to a virus (post April 8th)? That might be a good solution for me.
Honestly, I don't think that's a good solution for you, but I'm not you. I don't live in your head. Only you can say.

Quote:
I miss XP just because I was so used to it. Now it's like I'm re-inventing the wheel every single day. (Eg. Today I needed a .mobi and had no Kindle Previewer to convert my .epub. Which amounts to a time-wasting pain in the derriere.)
I have to say, I was a hard-core XP'er, until my poor old laptop slowed down so much that it was like computing through molasses. Then I capitulated on 7, and man...I have NEVER looked back. 7 is soooooo great. Truly fabulous. I promise you wouldn't regret 7, that I know I can say.

Quote:
But there's got to be some kind of middle ground/hybrid that will work.

And, Hitch, you were like, '.doc, .odt, etc. doesn't matter,' but I'm finding that .odt and the styles in LO are not as dependable as the styles in Word and Office 2003.

So I don't know. I'm still on the fence.
Which is WHY I don't know why you don't just install 7 and Office 2010 (or, hell, keep 2003 if you wish; I have 2003 and 2010 on my system, "just in case") and stick with what you know, and what works for you. Why all the resistance?

As the Daleks say: Resistance is Futile, brother.

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Old 03-28-2014, 10:14 PM   #29
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As the Daleks say: Resistance is Futile, brother.

Hitch
What? Daleks were before the Borg?
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Old 03-29-2014, 01:46 AM   #30
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What? Daleks were before the Borg?
Yes, yes. They were lead by Hulk Hogan back then, brother.
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