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Old 12-23-2013, 07:12 AM   #61
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You don't have per se to look at crumbs. You could also just clean your display once in a while...

@Anak: I have problems with the notation system of Chip. How come the PRS-T3 gets a 100% in Ausstattung, but the Aura HD gets only 71 ? Seriously, without light, and with only epub and PDF, the PRS-T3 is still their benchmark ???? This makes no sense to me at all. I read the tests in detail (and without google translate, I speak German so there won't be anything lost in translation), and they are just crap. I have always had problem with Chip's Tests anyway, but here I must say they really don't know Jack.
I'm just the messenger here. I didn't test it. How Chip got to the "Ausstattung" results: I don't know but I'm sure that the calculation method that gave that result is the same for all tested devices. Maybe you or other readers should contact Chip about it?

To be clear: I just posted it here only for one reason: to provide a ereader test with some hard numbers in it so anyone who is interested in buying an ereader can make a personal comparison based on aspects they find most important for themselves.
There are so many ereaders on the market today (at least in Europe) and what it makes fairly complicated to choose a reader that suits your personal needs.
This test at least has some data on battery life and other aspects. Which could aid to steer away from the "I like", "I don't like", "It's fine" or "It's not fine" comments. But reading just this thread: it didn't work.

If you don't like or agree with the outcomes: don't blame me or blame Chip for testing a device using their own test benchmarks or methods. Then the best thing you could do is ignore the test results completely.

You could or even should wonder or question why Kobo build the Aura the way the build it. Why did they use a particular component (e.g a battery with a relatively short battery life) instead of a slightly more powerful one?
Don't get me wrong Kobo or any other manufacturer makes and has to make such decisions. That is fine. Just as choices also mean that trade offs have to be made. But choices also mean some common sense. If the average reader lasts for about 30,000 page turns now, should you release a devices that only lasts 14,000? All Kobo readers (and most of the other brands) do (see test results) except the Aura (about 14,000) and the Touch (23,000). But the Touch is an old ereader so it should be no surprise it falls behind. But the Aura is one of the newest readers available on the market today.
If Kobo simply compared the Auras battery life (14,000) with their other newer readers (about 30,000) and latest models of the competition (30,000 and up) the could figure out beforehand that 14,000 page turns is at the very low end of the spectrum. Kobo figured it was "enough". But what is "enough"? If you compare it to the competion it clearly isn't.

I was probably just as surprised as you when I learned that the Kobo Aura final rank was so low.

Maybe other readers can provide test reviews that also show similar hard data.
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Old 12-23-2013, 09:17 AM   #62
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To be honest I really don't get how they tested battery life.
If I have to compare my Aura and my father's Glo, those numbers make 0 sense. With both of us reading with wifi on, low light on, with me reading more than him (I'd say 1 and 1/2 hr/day on average for me, 1/2 hr/day on average for him), my Aura actually lasts more than his; so yeah, I know their test (whatever it has been done) says no light, no wifi, but assuming a similar battery usage for wifi and light, it's hard to believe that Aura has got 1/3 of Glo battery life when anything else is off.
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Old 12-23-2013, 11:04 AM   #63
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good grief, ok your just the messenger/poster we get it. I also get the underlying feeling you have a grudge against that particular kobo device for some odd reason? There is definitely an undercurrent to this thread..

I own one and the battery life is totally fine. I am always wary about posts like this and online reviews of anything these days tbh. Backhanders and sponsorship mean honest reviews are rarer than hens teeth. The only way to be sure if you like something is to test it yourself.
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Old 12-23-2013, 11:35 AM   #64
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Anak, you're missing the possibility that the Kobo Aura actually might have the same (or even more) battery capacity as other devices, but that one or more of the features it offers draws more power.

For instance, the Kobo Aura uses a completely different sort of page change -- it's not quite as rapid (although still very fast) as the page change on other devices, and it actually (as you'll see if you watch carefully) does a very fast dissolve between pages -- which has the positive effect of eliminating the normal E Ink screen refresh (which causes the screen to briefly bounce to inverse video) that so many people find annoying.

If this, or something else that the Kobo Aura offers that other devices don't (the capacitive touch screen, for instance), draws more power, then it's not, as you chose to paint it, that Kobo chose a smaller/less powerful battery. You simply don't know -- which is precisely why these sorts of supposedly hard-data test-score charts are at best highly misleading and at worse meaningless.
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Old 12-23-2013, 11:58 AM   #65
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I started this thread as I was genuinely asking for opinions as the which one people though was best, but since then I've been and played with one and I actualy do prefer the AURA not the AURA HD.
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Old 12-23-2013, 12:22 PM   #66
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sorry forgot to quote Anak. that post of mine was directed at him not you josieb1 sorry my fault.
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Old 12-23-2013, 05:03 PM   #67
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sorry forgot to quote Anak. that post of mine was directed at him not you josieb1 sorry my fault.
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That's okay Peter, I figured that anyway
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Old 12-23-2013, 05:04 PM   #68
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Test results

Quote:
Originally Posted by peterwardgd View Post
good grief, ok your just the messenger/poster we get it. I also get the underlying feeling you have a grudge against that particular kobo device for some odd reason? There is definitely an undercurrent to this thread
No, I do not hold any gudge against any Kobo Reader. I don't really like the header/footer size but there is a third party patch available which solves it.
The post (#41) that linked to the test of the Kobo Aura had no additional personal comments from me. Maybe I should have mentioned to take a look at the detailed test results. I also would have post it if the Aura ended on the number one spot.
I refered to the test result because:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anak View Post
I just posted it here only for one reason: to provide a ereader test with some hard numbers in it so anyone who is interested in buying an ereader can make a personal comparison based on aspects they find most important for themselves.
There are so many ereaders on the market today (at least in Europe) and what it makes fairly complicated to choose a reader that suits your personal needs.
This test at least has some data on battery life and other aspects. Which could aid to steer away from the "I like", "I don't like", "It's fine" or "It's not fine" comments.
For a more objective discussion. For the reasons you mentioned:
Quote:
Originally Posted by peterwardgd View Post
I am always wary about posts like this and online reviews of anything these days tbh. Backhanders and sponsorship mean honest reviews are rarer than hens teeth. The only way to be sure if you like something is to test it yourself.
Well, I'm sure that Chip tests are not sponsored and most (online) available test are quite subjective (too me at least) or only sum up the features of the device (and sound like a PR press release).
All my follow up postings in this thread were only post to put the test results in the right perspective: bring the discussion back to the more objective numbers as most posts denounced the test results only because their personal experience and opinion is different or simply could/would not believe the test result.
To put the discussion back into perspective I used the numbers of the battery life (page turns) as an example. The gap between the Aura and other new readers is large. If Kobo only used a more powerful battery pack the test results would be completely different (it would probably jump several positions higher).
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anak View Post
I was probably just as surprised as you when I learned that the Kobo Aura final rank was so low.
Quote:
Originally Posted by RobertJSawyer View Post
Anak, you're missing the possibility that the Kobo Aura actually might have the same (or even more) battery capacity as other devices, but that one or more of the features it offers draws more power.
If the device uses that more power then Kobo should have added a battery with a much higher capacity. A battery that keeps it on par with competitive devices. It doesn't have to be the best in class.
Quote:
Originally Posted by RobertJSawyer View Post
the Kobo Aura uses a completely different sort of page change -- it's not quite as rapid (although still very fast) as the page change on other devices
If it is completely different I don't now. The test results show that other devices are faster on the aspect of page turns and therefore end up higher on the list on that particular aspect. Is it fast enough? Probably. But what is fast enough? It is quite vague if you can't put a number on it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RobertJSawyer View Post
Kobo Aura offers that other devices don't (the capacitive touch screen, for instance)
The Amazon Kindle Paperwhite (2013), Amazon Kindle Paperwhite, PocketBook Touch eReader and Kobo Aura all have a capacitive touch screen.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RobertJSawyer View Post
it's not, as you chose to paint it, that Kobo chose a smaller/less powerful battery. You simply don't know
Maybe you're right about the powerful battery or capacity. I should have used "Akkulaufzeit (max. Beleuchtung) 15:04 hours" for a more balanced judgment on the aspect of battery life.
Quote:
Originally Posted by RobertJSawyer View Post
which is precisely why these sorts of supposedly hard-data test-score charts are at best highly misleading and at worse meaningless.
I don't agree but maybe we do agree that charts should not be taken as absolute truths. But my opinion is that it puts results in a relative order. That makes it not misleading as every device is tested exactly the same way on every aspect.
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Old 12-23-2013, 07:41 PM   #69
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I'm just the messenger here. I didn't test it. How Chip got to the "Ausstattung" results: I don't know but I'm sure that the calculation method that gave that result is the same for all tested devices. Maybe you or other readers should contact Chip about it?

To be clear: I just posted it here only for one reason: to provide a ereader test with some hard numbers in it so anyone who is interested in buying an ereader can make a personal comparison based on aspects they find most important for themselves.
There are so many ereaders on the market today (at least in Europe) and what it makes fairly complicated to choose a reader that suits your personal needs.
This test at least has some data on battery life and other aspects. Which could aid to steer away from the "I like", "I don't like", "It's fine" or "It's not fine" comments. But reading just this thread: it didn't work.

If you don't like or agree with the outcomes: don't blame me or blame Chip for testing a device using their own test benchmarks or methods. Then the best thing you could do is ignore the test results completely.

You could or even should wonder or question why Kobo build the Aura the way the build it. Why did they use a particular component (e.g a battery with a relatively short battery life) instead of a slightly more powerful one?
Don't get me wrong Kobo or any other manufacturer makes and has to make such decisions. That is fine. Just as choices also mean that trade offs have to be made. But choices also mean some common sense. If the average reader lasts for about 30,000 page turns now, should you release a devices that only lasts 14,000? All Kobo readers (and most of the other brands) do (see test results) except the Aura (about 14,000) and the Touch (23,000). But the Touch is an old ereader so it should be no surprise it falls behind. But the Aura is one of the newest readers available on the market today.
If Kobo simply compared the Auras battery life (14,000) with their other newer readers (about 30,000) and latest models of the competition (30,000 and up) the could figure out beforehand that 14,000 page turns is at the very low end of the spectrum. Kobo figured it was "enough". But what is "enough"? If you compare it to the competion it clearly isn't.

I was probably just as surprised as you when I learned that the Kobo Aura final rank was so low.

Maybe other readers can provide test reviews that also show similar hard data.
That's quite a long post for someone who's "just the messenger". If I didn't know better I'd think you had some kind of agenda. As for "enough", that is whatever the user defines it as, not something that needs to be equivalent to the competition. If I buy a car that goes 140km/h is that suddenly "not enough" because McLaren has a car that does 280? Perhaps I'm not ready to trade away the heated seats that I get in my 140km/h car.
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Old 12-23-2013, 09:59 PM   #70
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Old 12-24-2013, 01:53 AM   #71
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That's quite a long post for someone who's "just the messenger". If I didn't know better I'd think you had some kind of agenda. As for "enough", that is whatever the user defines it as, not something that needs to be equivalent to the competition. If I buy a car that goes 140km/h is that suddenly "not enough" because McLaren has a car that does 280? Perhaps I'm not ready to trade away the heated seats that I get in my 140km/h car.
You don't want to own the type of car that says: "Please, officer, can I have a ticket."

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Old 12-24-2013, 06:59 AM   #72
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That's quite a long post for someone who's "just the messenger". If I didn't know better I'd think you had some kind of agenda. As for "enough", that is whatever the user defines it as, not something that needs to be equivalent to the competition. If I buy a car that goes 140km/h is that suddenly "not enough" because McLaren has a car that does 280? Perhaps I'm not ready to trade away the heated seats that I get in my 140km/h car.
Yes, it was a long post. But why was it a long post in the first place? All I did was post a link to a test. The reactions were hardly about the test results. They only expressed the posters view that it didn't match their experience. It's okay to have a personal opinion but that doesn't make a test rubbish or bulls**t. I also said: "anyone who is interested in buying an ereader can make a personal comparison based on aspects they find most important for themselves". To your car analogy if a heated seat is important for you, then always buy a car that has this feature and draw up a list of cars that have this feature. And then factor in other aspects that are important for you and choose the perfect car available within your budget.
Comparing a expensive sportscar with a family car is a bit flawed. But I get your point, I'll see a MacLaren as metaphore for a high(er) end family car. Then it makes sense that how fast it is isn't the most imortant aspect.

I never thought that one test would stir up emotions so much. The easiest way to put this particular test in perspective is to post links to other tests that also contain objective data. That's why I asked for more objective tests.
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Old 12-24-2013, 07:53 AM   #73
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No attack on you, Anak, just an observation:

The real joke about that test is that the Sonys get full points, more than any of the other readers, for "Ausstattung" (features, roughly), even though it doesn't have a frontlight. That is beyond ridiculous.
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Old 12-24-2013, 09:29 AM   #74
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No attack on you, Anak, just an observation:

The real joke about that test is that the Sonys get full points, more than any of the other readers, for "Ausstattung" (features, roughly), even though it doesn't have a frontlight. That is beyond ridiculous.
My point exactly, and again, nothing against Anak here
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Old 12-24-2013, 11:09 AM   #75
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