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Old 11-14-2013, 05:07 PM   #61
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Then you better dump all your technology because it is all dependent on third and multiple parties....
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Old 11-14-2013, 05:58 PM   #62
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Hi guys,
Skipping to the end just to comment on the initial post and link. In the article, he says:
"I’ve never said Chromebooks are the best product for all. Because I know they’re not. They’re fantastic for a specific type of user and use cases. "
This is so true, but also, as an ADDITIONAL device, the Chromebooks can be great for an even broader set of users.
My wife uses her Chromebook as a Chromebook, because browsing web forums, watching videos, using gmail is the bulk of what she uses a computer for. and the Chromebook is small, fast, cheap and good for those tasks. For everything else: Calibre, library audio books, controlling her die cutting machine, printing photos, she also has a Windows machine, and often can use the Chromebook to RDP to it and do many of those tasks. The Chromebook is a great second machine for her.
For me, I use a Chromebook, but I use it as a Linux box, because it was very inexpensive way to get a decent little laptop.
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Old 11-14-2013, 06:23 PM   #63
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I must say that I've been fascinated by Chromebooks for a while. I think that they would be really great for doing work in places like libraries, so that I can leave my more expensive laptop at home and not have to worry about it. I'd love to see how the iWork for iCloud works on one. I can see myself picking one up in a few years.

At any rate, I'm glad that I had a chance to read up on your experiences using chromebooks here.
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Old 11-14-2013, 08:02 PM   #64
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I'd get another one if they go on sale for $130 again. That was a steal! If I got a second, I'd be tempted to try Linux on it.
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Old 11-14-2013, 08:28 PM   #65
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Originally Posted by kennyc View Post
Then you better dump all your technology because it is all dependent on third and multiple parties....
Uh... maybe I understand you the wrong way, but nothing of my current stuff except Windows 7 depends on anything or anyone to get it to work.

Even without internet, I would be able to use all the stuff I have. Of course the internet-enabled parts would not work (like multiplayer in games), but all of the main functionality is there.

Compare that to a program or a game that requires an always-on internet connection. As soon as the publisher deems the program to be "old", the authentication server goes off-line, and the program will be unusable.

The software I (still) have that does this is Windows 7, and I've resolved that by just keeping a clean, activated and updated image put away in case I ever need it.
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Old 11-14-2013, 08:49 PM   #66
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You're fooling yourself.
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Old 11-14-2013, 08:56 PM   #67
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Originally Posted by Katsunami View Post
Uh... maybe I understand you the wrong way, but nothing of my current stuff except Windows 7 depends on anything or anyone to get it to work.

Even without internet, I would be able to use all the stuff I have. Of course the internet-enabled parts would not work (like multiplayer in games), but all of the main functionality is there.

Compare that to a program or a game that requires an always-on internet connection. As soon as the publisher deems the program to be "old", the authentication server goes off-line, and the program will be unusable.

The software I (still) have that does this is Windows 7, and I've resolved that by just keeping a clean, activated and updated image put away in case I ever need it.
Now, you see, I have a completely different view of technology - call me the BIC disposable!
I consider that everything I have now will soon be obsolete, and that's fine with me. New stuff will soon be available that will be cheaper, better and do stuff I didn't even know I wanted! So I don't want tech that's expensive and durable. Call me cheap but I think Google is on the right track in recognizing that consumers are very price-sensitive and future success and market share depends on inexpensive stuff that grabs the world's imagination.
I consider the Chromebook to be a product in this vein.
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Old 11-14-2013, 09:21 PM   #68
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You're fooling yourself.
WTH man... you're just posting one-liners, without any explanation. That's irritating.

If I wish to re-install my computer from scratch up to the point where it is now, I can do so without actually connecting to the internet. The system will end up in exactly the same state as it is now, minus the latest Windows updates.

The only thing I *can't* do is download updates or newer versions of programs, but that's not the point; the point is that I can use what I have now, indefinitely, aka forever, as long as the computer does not break down. (Even if it breaks down, I can run all the software, minus the operating system, on any other computer I want, without ever connecting that computer to the internet either.)

I run software created by companies that have been gone for 10 years or longer. If that software had had activation crap in it, it would be useless now, but because it hasn't, I can use it as long as I have a computer/operating system that will install and run it.

That is independent in my book, and a Chromebook is anything but. It completely and fully depends on third-party services and online access to be able to do anything.
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Old 11-14-2013, 09:41 PM   #69
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Now, you see, I have a completely different view of technology - call me the BIC disposable!
So I don't want tech that's expensive and durable.
But I do.

I don't change anything if I don't have a good reason. I don't switch to a new operating system just because it's new. I don't replace my computer only because it's now three years old.

Probably, my next computer will also run Windows 7 (I still have an unused license), because I *KNOW* it will run any software I run now, *AND* all software produced between now and 2020.

You know what that means? It means that Windows 7, combined with a current version of DOSBox (and if you have to, Windows XP Virtual Mode, which is free for Win7 Professional), will be able to run software produced in a time span of thirty years (~1990-2020).

Yes, I plan stuff like that very far ahead. I now sometimes run games created in 1998. I can see myself running 2012-era games in 2027; either on a new computer, in some way or the other, or on this one or it's 2015 successor.
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Old 11-14-2013, 11:11 PM   #70
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To me it just doesn't seem like the price differential between a Chromebook and a Windows laptop is enough to appeal, but I suppose that just means I'm out of the target demographic. If it were around $150, I think it would be far more appealing.

However, what also makes it unappealing to me is that Android has cheaper devices and a wider and more open app selection.
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Old 11-15-2013, 06:13 AM   #71
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However, what also makes it unappealing to me is that Android has cheaper devices and a wider and more open app selection.
Don't forget that you're also paying for a near-12 inch screen and a keyboard. If you don't need those, then yes, Android makes more sense.

However, even Android requires more ongoing maintenance than ChromeOS. I love my Nexus devices, but they're always installing app updates, some of which I have to go and do by hand.

Android and ChromeOS devices do work brilliantly together though. I don't even think of it as 'synchronisation' any more, it's all so transparent. When I think back to times gone by, the way now mail, calendar, tasks, bookmarks, contacts, documents, outlines, project plans, secure passwords, music, notes, etc., even the webpage you were on, are all available from all devices seems almost magical.

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Old 11-15-2013, 10:40 AM   #72
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Don't forget that you're also paying for a near-12 inch screen and a keyboard.
That's the absolute key for us. We thought our tablets would take over our "couch computing" but it turns out both my wife and I need a decent size screen and a real keyboard and mouse a high percentage of the time.
I can't stand to do more than trivial amount of text entry on a small touch screen.
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Old 11-15-2013, 11:36 AM   #73
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If I wish to re-install my computer from scratch up to the point where it is now, I can do so without actually connecting to the internet.
Not quite true. If you have to re-install Windows 7 or 8 you need to activate it.

From Microsoft's FAQ:

Quote:
Is activation required?

Yes. You have 30 days after installing Windows to activate it online or by telephone. When Windows is activated, you'll be able to use every feature of Windows.

Will I ever need to activate Windows on my computer again?

Maybe. You might have to activate Windows again if:

•You make a significant hardware change to your computer, such as upgrading the hard disk and memory at the same time. If a major hardware change requires activating Windows again, you'll be notified and will have three days to activate Windows.

•You reinstall Windows. In this case, you’ll have 30 days to activate Windows again.

Last edited by pl001; 11-15-2013 at 11:38 AM.
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Old 11-15-2013, 12:47 PM   #74
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Not quite true. If you have to re-install Windows 7 or 8 you need to activate it.

From Microsoft's FAQ:
And from my own posts: I've resolved that by keeping an activated image on an external hard drive. Once in a while, that image gets updated. When I'd need to re-install, I'll just put that image onto the computer and it's activated already.

Microsoft should have been prohibited to employ this activation crap. Since they started it, basically every big software manufacturer does it, some even requiring a permanent internet connection or reactivation every X number of days.

The latter is what the "official" chess engine in my chess program requires. You need to put the original CD/DVD into the drive, and connect to the internet to reactivate the engine. I resolved that by removing the chess engine and replacing it with the open source Stockfish engine.

In the newer versions, the manufacturer has expanded this crap policy from engine-only throughout the entire program (basically, the user interface); now the program not only needs activation and reactivation, it also requires an account and to be logged in to the manufacturer's servers to receive updates.

Therefore I will never update this program ever again. I'd rather run it in a Virtual Machine, using my permanently activated Windows XP VLK license, or switch to something like the Arena GUI.

This company, and many others such as game publishers, have lost me as a customer by employing such crap schemes that make software dependent on their whims.

IMHO, to get back on topic, a Chromebook is the epic culmination of this dependence, and therefore I'll never ever buy one.

Last edited by Katsunami; 11-15-2013 at 12:57 PM.
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Old 11-15-2013, 01:57 PM   #75
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And from my own posts: I've resolved that by keeping an activated image on an external hard drive. Once in a while, that image gets updated. When I'd need to re-install, I'll just put that image onto the computer and it's activated already.
So long as you never upgrade your hardware for any reason, sure, that will work. But you still had to do the initial activation. You can't set the PC up in the first place without this reliance on Microsoft, which was my point. You also can't do major upgrades to it, which makes it more disposable. And are you really going to want to run Windows 7 beyond 2020? I guess if what you do on a PC never changes, that could work out. That won't be the case for most PC users though.

Personally, I didn't bother making a complete image, but I did used to back up all my important stuff to an external drive. Then the damn thing failed when I needed it. I could have set up a RAID arrangement but that's a lot of hassle. Instead all my backups are in the cloud now, which has had the side effect of making my life a lot easier. No more hassle syncing and transferring. It's all there and it's all accessible to all my devices. There's no going back for me.

Last edited by pl001; 11-15-2013 at 01:59 PM.
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