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Old 09-06-2013, 12:42 AM   #61
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Originally Posted by Josieb1 View Post
I agree, it's £99 in the UK
According to the Sony UK store website it's £119 not £99?

http://www.sony.co.uk/product/rd-rea...cpint=15044709
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Old 09-06-2013, 02:40 AM   #62
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Originally Posted by AnemicOak View Post
According to the Sony UK store website it's £119 not £99?

http://www.sony.co.uk/product/rd-rea...cpint=15044709
When I checked yesterday the T2 was £119 and the T3 was £99. Today the T3 price is missing. But if it turns out the £99 was a mistake then the T3 is even dearer than we thought, so even less competitive compared to Amazon and Kobo.

That's not a good thing. You cannot sell a non lighted ereader for more than a lighted one. Even if the screen was a better resolution it looks like a lower spec device to the average buyer.

Last edited by Josieb1; 09-06-2013 at 02:43 AM.
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Old 09-06-2013, 04:36 AM   #63
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Sony decided that it isn't making devices with built-in light. The people who want built in light aren't going to be happy anyway. The people who don't care about the built in light aren't going care if the other readers have a built in light for the same price, because they aren't interested in the feature.

The Paperwhite (the first one) doesn't have expandable memory, has a 800 MHZ CPU processor instead of 1 GHz and is priced at $139 without ads. How were these good specs and price for 2012? Let me guess: the people who thought that it was great don't care about expandable memory, processor speed and don't mind the ads.
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Old 09-06-2013, 07:36 AM   #64
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Originally Posted by Josieb1 View Post
You cannot sell a non lighted ereader for more than a lighted one.
Yes you can.

I am not interested in a light but I do want a protective cover. The T3 is now top of my shortlist for an upgrade. I am looking for an ePub reader with good firmware, excellent book rendering and physical page turn buttons.
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Old 09-06-2013, 09:15 AM   #65
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Originally Posted by Sil_liS View Post
The Paperwhite (the first one) doesn't have expandable memory, has a 800 MHZ CPU processor instead of 1 GHz and is priced at $139 without ads. How were these good specs and price for 2012? Let me guess: the people who thought that it was great don't care about expandable memory, processor speed and don't mind the ads.
With regard to CPU speed and storage space, I think these are moot points for many people, and they certainly are to the manufacturers.

First, the CPU speed is only a marketing thing. They could have *easily* fitted a 1 GHz CPU into the KPW in 2012, and probably also in the Touch in 2011. The only reason they don't is so the next year, they can advertise by saying the reader got 25% faster. Next year (or the year after that), the CPU will be 1200 MHz, making the that Kindle another 20% faster (compared to the KPW2). It will have gained 50% speed compared to the Touch.

You can feel the speed increase when booting the device, when opening huge books, looking up words, or when using the device (menu's, and such), but you can't when reading books. There are people who are still using the Kindle 3 (or even the Kindle 2 / DGX), and they also work fine. (FYI: 532 MHz CPU.)

The point is, if Amazon wanted epic speed, NOW, and blow all other e-readers to kingdom come, they could have just stuck a 1.8 or 2.0 GHz CPU in there, along with maybe a battery a bit bigger to compensate for the extra power drain.

They don't, because in that case, they can't advertise with 200 MHz speed bumps for 5 or 6 years.

Same with internal memory.

First, it costs NOTHING. SD-Cards and controllers are practically free, and software (libraries) to control them is available as open source. Even when not providing an external slot, it would be easy enough to just have the internal memory be a flash card. Kobo did it. It's actually possible to crack open a Kobo and stick a 32 GB card in it. If I'd been them, I'd have used that as marketing: slide-off back, with a slot beneath to determine your own internal memory, and provide a replaceable battery to boot. What the frack if the e-reader becomes 1mm thicker to offer that. But noooo, "marketing" wants to be able to advertise with the fact that their reader is now 0.5mm thinner than others (VERY IMPORTANT if you're below the 10mm mark, or your reader will become impossible to handle!), and with the extra SD-Card slot. No matter that this arrangement splits up the memory and ditches the exchangeable battery...

Second, many people don't need to take their entire library of books with them. I can understand it on an MP3 player; it's entirely possible to say: "Now I want to hear this or that album" (or even one song), and be annoyed if it's not on there. It's not really possible to say: "Now I'm going to read this book", and 5 minutes later read another, and the next hour, read yet another. That would be quite useless. Also, you don't read books once every other day, as you can with regard to listening to a music album. Of course people will tell you: "But if I'm going on vacation, I may not know what to read so I want to take everything." Did you also do that 15 years ago? Did you also take 5000 paper books with you? In case you're afraid of not knowing what to read, just stuff 500 or 1000 books on the reader, and you'll be able to find something. Many people haven't even seen 500 or 1000 books in their entire life, outside a library.

Third, Amazon doesn't even want you to store books on the e-reader. It's just a device to read the book and then read another, preferably by buying it directly from the device, in their store. They'll be "nice" and save it in the cloud for you, so you can find it there, if you ever need it again. If they'd be completely honest though, they'd rather much have you read the book and then have it dissappear, leaving you to pay again if you wanted to read it again. They would, if they could get away with it.

It's not about the specifications; they are all just marketing. A company such as Amazon could create one reader to end all readers for the next 10 years, if they wanted to, but they don't. It's not good for marketing and keeping the people buying for 10 years. And the same goes for any other big technology company.

Last edited by Katsunami; 09-06-2013 at 09:52 AM.
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Old 09-06-2013, 09:37 AM   #66
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Originally Posted by Agama View Post
Yes you can.

I am not interested in a light but I do want a protective cover. The T3 is now top of my shortlist for an upgrade. I am looking for an ePub reader with good firmware, excellent book rendering and physical page turn buttons.
okay, yes you can. But you won't get full market share.

Lets hope enough readers by them to keep Sony in the business
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Old 09-06-2013, 09:40 AM   #67
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Sony will keep for shure in the business. There is not only the normal reader. Sony is also working on big reader called mobius:
http://www.gizmag.com/sony-student-e...-mobius/27489/
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Old 09-06-2013, 09:41 AM   #68
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Originally Posted by Agama View Post
Yes you can.

I am not interested in a light but I do want a protective cover. The T3 is now top of my shortlist for an upgrade. I am looking for an ePub reader with good firmware, excellent book rendering and physical page turn buttons.

Me too. I will upgrade my T1 to the T3. Looks very fine. There could be some more improvements on the firmware, but it still very nice. Far better the the upgrade T1 to T2.
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Old 09-06-2013, 09:49 AM   #69
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Yes you can.

I am not interested in a light but I do want a protective cover. The T3 is now top of my shortlist for an upgrade. I am looking for an ePub reader with good firmware, excellent book rendering and physical page turn buttons.
Yes you can-to 3 people. All of them on this forum!
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Old 09-06-2013, 11:32 AM   #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Josieb1 View Post
You cannot sell a non lighted ereader for more than a lighted one.
Of course you can. A bad ereader with light is not a match for a good ereader without one and i am not saying such and such are good or bad, just stating that there are more specs that are important to a user than front light, and using just that parameter to judge the quality and suitability of a ereader is reductive.
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Old 09-06-2013, 12:18 PM   #71
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With regard to CPU speed and storage space, I think these are moot points for many people, and they certainly are to the manufacturers.
Just like a lit screen is a moot point to many people, and it certainly is to Sony.

But if people feel that the price of the device should reflect the specs, then they should consider all the specs.
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Old 09-06-2013, 01:11 PM   #72
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Of course you can. A bad ereader with light is not a match for a good ereader without one and i am not saying such and such are good or bad, just stating that there are more specs that are important to a user than front light, and using just that parameter to judge the quality and suitability of a ereader is reductive.
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Just like a lit screen is a moot point to many people, and it certainly is to Sony.
But if people feel that the price of the device should reflect the specs, then they should consider all the specs.
The thing that is generally being missed in all this discussion is that while the points being made (on both sides) are quite applicable to the people reading these forums BUT the people reading this forum represent a small (and likely tiny) portion of the e-reader buying public. While you and I may know what we want/like in an e-reader, probably the majority of buyers don't (at least on anything more than a superficial level). These devices are sold/marketed for mass consumption so you need to look at if from the perspective of a buyer who probably doesn't know or care about a lot of the features that we love or hate. If you look at it from that perspective, a reader with a light that costs the same/similar or less is automatically going to come across as a better deal to to the AVERAGE buyer (not necessarily the case to a more educated buyer) because they are getting another very obvious feature. Again I say this is what the AVERAGE buyer (who likely make up the majority of buyers) perceive. Yes there is a market for a reader specifically without a light and a reader with buttons, but the reality is that those more niche markets and I doubt you can make successful business case for them as a mass market reader. Alas, the same can be said for the possible large (13"?) reader that Sony is developing. I'd love to have one, but it's likely going to be really expensive because it likely doesn't have broad market appeal.
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Old 09-06-2013, 02:55 PM   #73
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Oh, Sony. You really are more out of touch then I thought.

Putting all that design effort into a $50 fancy lighted cover that is attached, and then STILL using the glossy finish on the readers. It's bad enough that glossy finish causes glare with the old stem lights, but the new cover has a fixed position, so you're stuck with the glare. At least I can attempt to reposition the stem light to lower a hot spot. That white sure looks like glossy finish, although maybe the black is matte like the T2 black was.

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Originally Posted by ersott View Post
Lighted cover in video



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wxqHlMENMTk
On the plus side, the pop-off back appears to expose the battery, so in theory the battery could be user-replaceable, if Sony or a third party offers one. I know many people prefer replaceable batteries.
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Old 09-06-2013, 03:10 PM   #74
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The thing that is generally being missed in all this discussion is that while the points being made (on both sides) are quite applicable to the people reading these forums BUT the people reading this forum represent a small (and likely tiny) portion of the e-reader buying public. While you and I may know what we want/like in an e-reader, probably the majority of buyers don't (at least on anything more than a superficial level). These devices are sold/marketed for mass consumption so you need to look at if from the perspective of a buyer who probably doesn't know or care about a lot of the features that we love or hate. If you look at it from that perspective, a reader with a light that costs the same/similar or less is automatically going to come across as a better deal to to the AVERAGE buyer (not necessarily the case to a more educated buyer) because they are getting another very obvious feature. Again I say this is what the AVERAGE buyer (who likely make up the majority of buyers) perceive. Yes there is a market for a reader specifically without a light and a reader with buttons, but the reality is that those more niche markets and I doubt you can make successful business case for them as a mass market reader. Alas, the same can be said for the possible large (13"?) reader that Sony is developing. I'd love to have one, but it's likely going to be really expensive because it likely doesn't have broad market appeal.
I think the AVERAGE buyer of a device that is made specifically for reading, is more knowledgeable and educated than the AVERAGE buyer of mass market electronics, so the assumption you are making to put forth your argument is not very valid for me.

I could argue also that a person that spends money in a device just for reading (since web browsing is not very practical) does that because it gives a great value to the experience of reading, and to books. I think having a light OR having a great screen or readability will have very different impacts in the buying choices of these customers.
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Old 09-06-2013, 03:22 PM   #75
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...and when i say educated, i don't mean necessarily educated in technical stuff, but willing and able to differentiate between his or hers main requirements, finding them in the devices and able to choose accordingly.

And i believe people who value reading value the experience, consequently put some value on the device and do not, as you say "don't know or care" about the specs of the device they choose to read. What i think it happens is that not everyone who uses and likes ereaders comes to a forum to talk about them, but i do believe that the majority of readers that choose to have an ereader does not choose one as you pretend they do.

People who read and love books are special.
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