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Old 08-23-2013, 11:46 AM   #16
kennyc
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Old 08-23-2013, 02:40 PM   #17
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Originally Posted by Terisa de morgan View Post
I was checking the feedback group, and I thing I read a message from this author about the rating. Anyway, it's not feasible block ratings because of reading status. And about publish date, ARC, you remember?

Anyway, about publishing status... if she contact gooreads staff (or goodreads librarian group) and says: this book doesn't exist and it is not going to exist, I think it would be removed. But she prefers whining and PR, what a surprise!

It will not happen unless there is a legal precedent. GR is a cataloging site. The information on it is not owned by the authors or anyone else.

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Our goal at Goodreads is to have a database of all books ever printed in any language across all time.

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Also, soon a new option will be implemented for readers to REQUEST THEIR REVIEWS TO BE FROZEN. Meaning to not allow comments. It will be done by request, but it might help with the heated topics
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Old 08-23-2013, 02:45 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by auspex View Post
THIS is exactly how all this crap starts. People making silly comments on subjects they don't understand.

Goodreads is a site for readers. Readers rate books however and for whatever reason they want. They don't even need to share those ratings (and perhaps it might cause fewer hurt feelings if member defaults were to not share anything, but that seems to defeat the whole purpose of a social media site). I wouldn't generally give a rating to a book I hadn't read - but I would certainly add a book like this to my "don't even think of reading" shelf. Others though, might give a rating to an unread book as a way of ranking their interest in reading it when it does become available. I only give 1-star ratings to books I haven't read — though it will always be a book I started, but couldn't finish.
THIS is exactly why book ratings all across the web are almost always utterly useless. People rating books for utterly extraneous, stupid reasons and not for the quality of the books.
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Old 08-23-2013, 03:10 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by crdf View Post
Also, soon a new option will be implemented for readers to REQUEST THEIR REVIEWS TO BE FROZEN. Meaning to not allow comments. It will be done by request, but it might help with the heated topics
This was, in fact, done this past week.
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Old 08-23-2013, 03:14 PM   #20
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I honestly fail to see how anyone can meaningfully write a review on a book that they haven't read.
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Old 08-23-2013, 03:32 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by HarryT View Post
I honestly fail to see how anyone can meaningfully write a review on a book that they haven't read.
Because they don't....write a review I mean. Not always. Gosh I s*ck at explaining. Sould stop!

they express their expectations of the book. This is mostly seen in the YA genre. But no one is really considering the rating until there are at least a 1000. I find the system to be much less bias and accurate the others. Somehow a few hundred of thousand ratings make more sense, even if there are some that can hardly be called reviews, then 30 of them but all 5 stars.

I understand why the term reviews is misleading, but again, for the third time. GR allows use of the rating system to be personalized. Your rating doesn't need to mean anything to anyone but you. A lot of people rate as a way of categorizing.

of course it is all again about preference. No one have to use the system to rate, review or even to register. And I am sure a lot of people avoid GR and there will be even more "nice" PR in future. It takes one to lead them all.
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Old 08-23-2013, 03:44 PM   #22
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I honestly fail to see how anyone can meaningfully write a review on a book that they haven't read.
Well, let's start with the review I once wrote for a self-published piece of trash. In just one page it proved to be rambling, inconsistent, and illiterate. I said so. I believe that was meaningful without me having read the book.

However, the whole point of Goodreads is that you are allowed to use the review and rating fields for virtually anything you want. So they don't actually have to be "meaningful", though I would expect for all most all users they actually have meaning to the writer.

Finally, in this particular case, the author didn't complain about the review, she complained about getting 2-star ratings, and it's hard to argue that ratings are meaningful on any site (though I'd argue that Goodread's ratings are slightly more meaningful than the ones you'll find on Amazon).
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Old 08-23-2013, 03:51 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by Istvan diVega View Post
THIS is exactly why book ratings all across the web are almost always utterly useless. People rating books for utterly extraneous, stupid reasons and not for the quality of the books.
You are still missing the point — Goodreads is a social media site. People are welcome to rate and review books for any purpose whatsoever, and those of us who use it quickly find the groups whose opinions we care about — no different, actually from choosing which newspaper or literary journal we'll look to for recommendations. And I'll argue that you (even if you happen to be an internationally renowned literary critic) are no more qualified to judge the quality of the books than those "rating books for utterly extraneous, stupid reasons". imo, book ratings everywhere are pretty much useless, not just on the web.
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Old 08-23-2013, 03:58 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by auspex View Post
Well, let's start with the review I once wrote for a self-published piece of trash. In just one page it proved to be rambling, inconsistent, and illiterate. I said so. I believe that was meaningful without me having read the book.
Sorry, you misunderstand me. There's no problem at all with abandoning a book after a page if that page shows that it's trash. I was referring to reviewing a book that you hadn't so much as seen - in fact a book which hasn't even been published, if I understand this story correctly.
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Old 08-23-2013, 04:00 PM   #25
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A lot of people dislike the fact that someone can rate and review a book before it is released. This has been discussed multiple times and GR will not change it, to the authors dislike.
To some authors' dislike. Authors who understand the system would be as upset as readers if they couldn't get some good reviews from ARC readers before the publication date.

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Also talking about bullying, there has no less coming from authors.
And that, of course, was the whole start of this issue. When the author complained (in the wrong forum anyway — if she'd complained to GR support, she'd have had her error explained in private) that she was getting 2-star reviews, the readers in that forum took it as an attempt to manipulate the system. That, in itself, is not an author bullying reviewers, but it's so very often the first step before the author starts bullying, that many GR users are getting gunshy.
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Old 08-23-2013, 04:00 PM   #26
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Originally Posted by auspex View Post
You are still missing the point — Goodreads is a social media site. People are welcome to rate and review books for any purpose whatsoever, and those of us who use it quickly find the groups whose opinions we care about — no different, actually from choosing which newspaper or literary journal we'll look to for recommendations. And I'll argue that you (even if you happen to be an internationally renowned literary critic) are no more qualified to judge the quality of the books than those "rating books for utterly extraneous, stupid reasons". imo, book ratings everywhere are pretty much useless, not just on the web.
I got the point just fine and yes, if I have read a book I certainly am more qualified to review it than someone who has not. Social media site or not, giving someone's book a crap rating because you don't like the author, the author's opinions on something, or anything other than the quality of the story and the writing - is simply moronic.
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Old 08-23-2013, 05:45 PM   #27
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There was a paper done discussing why people write bad reviews of products they haven't used. I haven't had a chance to read it yet. http://web.mit.edu/simester/Public/P...ve_Reviews.pdf

There's a blog post about the paper from the NY Times site. http://bits.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/0..._20130716&_r=0
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Old 08-23-2013, 06:10 PM   #28
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Originally Posted by HarryT View Post
Sorry, you misunderstand me. There's no problem at all with abandoning a book after a page if that page shows that it's trash. I was referring to reviewing a book that you hadn't so much as seen - in fact a book which hasn't even been published, if I understand this story correctly.
That is one aspect of GR that irritates me! I don't understand why people give star reviews, good or bad, to unpublished books or why GR allows this. The response is usually that people who receive ARCs should be allowed to review it whenever they please. I get that. What I don't get is people giving reviews when the author hasn't even finished writing the book and hence, no one could have possibly read the book. I have seen this happen, especially with books by popular authors.
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Old 08-23-2013, 07:18 PM   #29
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You are still missing the point — Goodreads is a social media site. People are welcome to rate and review books for any purpose whatsoever ...
That was his point: Ratings at GoodReads are useless, and you confirmed that. Now, that wouldn't be a problem if various vendors and stores didn't USE those meaningless ratings in their catalogs (even Kobo does) and purchase decisions were influenced by them.

To the average person out there it is not at all obvious that GoodReads is a playground for children between 8 and 90 ("social media"), so those meaningless "reviews" and ratings have an impact that goes beyond just amusing the kids who use the rating feature for all kinds of purposes other than actually rating a book they have read.
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Old 08-23-2013, 07:44 PM   #30
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That was his point: Ratings at GoodReads are useless, and you confirmed that. Now, that wouldn't be a problem if various vendors and stores didn't USE those meaningless ratings in their catalogs (even Kobo does) and purchase decisions were influenced by them.

To the average person out there it is not at all obvious that GoodReads is a playground for children between 8 and 90 ("social media"), so those meaningless "reviews" and ratings have an impact that goes beyond just amusing the kids who use the rating feature for all kinds of purposes other than actually rating a book they have read.
Perhaps, if there are a small number of ratings. But the few "questionable" reviews soon become insignificant as more readers add their reviews.
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