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Old 06-11-2013, 07:43 PM   #46
BearMountainBooks
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I read samples of the these two titles, about 15 pages each. The first, The Man Who Crossed Worlds, was IMO poorly written. I would put it in the "rubbish" pile. He overused pronouns. "I turned to the left ...", "I opened the refrigerator ...", "I looked up.", etc. He needs to show me and not tell me.

Stained Glass Monsters is better written although not my type of reading material. Her sentences did tend to ramble. She used very few adjectives instead preferring long prepositional phrases and run on sentences. Writing could be more concise. I also wasn't sure (possibly because I didn't read enough) whether this was a cozy para or low fantasy novel. I wouldn't call it "rubbish" but I wouldn't recommend it either. Easily forgettable.
I loved them both and I'm pretty picky. I thought Stained Glass got off to a slow start. It's fantasy. I wouldn't call it cozy. Just a good fantasy. I don't recall a huge amount of violence, so some might consider it cozy fantasy.

I really liked Man Who Crossed. I have started something else by Chris Strange and it wasn't my thing. But I did think both books were decently edited and as good as a lot of what is out there.

Different tastes, I guess!
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Old 06-11-2013, 08:13 PM   #47
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Don't think many people are saying that; most of us think there is nothing inherently superior to the gatekept books from the point of view of readers: there is crap on both side, there are jewels on both sides.
There's a lot more crap on the self-pub side.

That's not a condemnation of self-publishing. It's just that, at the very least, mainstream publishing books have been through a handful of readers--the agent, the editor, the proofreaders--all of whom had to agree, "this book does not make me want to throw it through a window and then punch out the person who wrote it."

There's no comparison. Mainstream books have been through a filter. Sometimes the filter works well; sometimes it fails to block out the stuff it should; it always, at the very least, blocks totally incomprehensible and/or hideously offensive drivel. Mainstream books are full of sentences with subjects and verbs. The run-ons, which they try to avoid, are rarely more than 35 words long. "I" is capitalized except for deliberate, stylistic-choice situations. A character named "Mary" is not called "Marry" in half the dialogue.

Self-pub books have *no* filters. So while they have plenty of terrific authors who, for whatever reason, are not going with mainstream publishers, they also have plenty of offerings that *no reader anywhere* thinks are worth spending money on.

It's like comparing art gallery paintings to refrigerator art. Sure, some galleries show awful stuff. And some refrigerators host terrific artworks--especially by those people who could also have art careers. But the criteria are so different there's not really any point in directly comparing them, as a group.
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Old 06-11-2013, 08:31 PM   #48
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Every time someone talks about all the quality checks that trad pubbed books go through, I think of a Lora Leigh book that came out a few years ago - I forget the title. One of the man characters changes names partway through the book, and a crucial scene was dropped and had to be pubbed on Leigh's blog. Yeah, sure, quality checks.
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Old 06-11-2013, 08:32 PM   #49
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So where are the editors looking to try to help indie ebook authors? I haven't seen a single one offering their services, although that just means I haven't seen them.

And yes, if one was to offer reasonable rates, I'd definitely consider hiring them.
Are you kidding? Editors need to make a living too. Editing isn't a hobby.
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Old 06-11-2013, 08:56 PM   #50
BearMountainBooks
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Are you kidding? Editors need to make a living too. Editing isn't a hobby.
Neither is writing for a lot of us.
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Old 06-11-2013, 09:25 PM   #51
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Some authors I enjoyed (and whose books were well formatted and practically free of spelling/grammar errors):

Patricia Ryan (Still Life with murder)

There's life outside the big publishers...
For what it's worth, Patricia Ryan's mystery series that included Still Life With Murder was actually published by one of the traditional publishers under a pseudonym P.B. Ryan. She released her own ebooks when she was legally able to.

I've been happy to buy reissued ebooks that otherwise look self-pubbed, but had originally been through traditional review/editing.
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Old 06-11-2013, 10:23 PM   #52
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So where are the editors looking to try to help indie ebook authors? I haven't seen a single one offering their services, although that just means I haven't seen them.

And yes, if one was to offer reasonable rates, I'd definitely consider hiring them.
As a matter of interest what would you call reasonable rates?

Editors like to make a living as well - so many people seem to ignore a simple fact that time is a most valuable commodity and if you want someone to use chunks of it on your behalf then it's not unreasonable for them to expect suitable remuneration...
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Old 06-12-2013, 12:45 AM   #53
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I loved them both and I'm pretty picky.

Different tastes, I guess!
I'm glad you enjoyed them. Honestly.
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Old 06-12-2013, 01:41 AM   #54
Fluribus
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Old 06-12-2013, 08:44 AM   #55
BearMountainBooks
Maria Schneider
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I'm glad you enjoyed them. Honestly.

I know. I didn't take that wrong. Do you UF at all? For the worst cover ever, but a very good book: Demon Hunter with Baby. Pretty kick-ass. A few typos. I've probably already rec'd Frank Tuttle on here (most of his work is via Samhain, so technically he's not indie. And his work could be considered on the cozier side. Some awesome stuff though. I have turned in a few 'typos' in his stuff; hopefully they have been fixed!)
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Old 06-12-2013, 08:46 AM   #56
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The Dank Side of the Moon
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No big deal; a good chunk of popular videos and music is also rubbish. The bottom line is sales; quality is secondary. Let the masses decide.
Well yeah, Sturgeons Law - "ninety percent of everything is crap."
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Old 06-12-2013, 09:37 AM   #57
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Do the books you review undergo any sort of initial screening process? In all seriousness, when I've looked at indie books (which I do from time to time), the majority (I'd estimate at least three quarters) have been riddled with elementary errors in spelling and grammar (eg not knowing the difference between "its" and "it's", or "your" and "you're"), and I'm afraid that's "instant fail" as far as I'm concerned.
Those must be books written by non-native speakers, or is English deteriorating as much as Dutch is? I don't really think so; most English sites and forums I read are quite OK with regard to spelling and grammar, but most Dutch that I read online makes me cringe. I feel as if every line (in Dutch) has fishing hooks sticking out of it, catching one of my eyes every third word. I actually feel as if people are not just making mistakes... They're just guessing the grammar and spelling, being wrong most of the time.
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Old 06-12-2013, 09:38 AM   #58
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Do the books you review undergo any sort of initial screening process? In all seriousness, when I've looked at indie books (which I do from time to time), the majority (I'd estimate at least three quarters) have been riddled with elementary errors in spelling and grammar (eg not knowing the difference between "its" and "it's", or "your" and "you're"), and I'm afraid that's "instant fail" as far as I'm concerned.
Yes the books I review that are self published go through at least one editor.
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Old 06-12-2013, 09:43 AM   #59
BearMountainBooks
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Yes the books I review that are self published go through at least one editor.
Do you have a blog link to your reviews? Or are you on GR for your reviews?
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Old 06-12-2013, 09:44 AM   #60
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I read genre romance stories, and tbh whilst I am more than happy with the quality of both publisher and self published stories the majority of readers are too emersed in a love story with hopefully a happy ending to worry too much about grammer. Formatting is a bigger issue as we all want our ebooks to look good on whatever device we have, but grammer we are more forgiving on.
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