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Old 04-26-2013, 06:43 AM   #61
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OSX on a laptop is not suitable for touch screen mobile use. It's not competing for the same buyers as Win8/RT is.
Never said it was. The problem is that as easy as a touchscreen is to use, it is a horrible interface for real productivity. You can't type very fast on the darn things, for one. Selecting text is a chore. And editing photos beyond applying presets? Forget about it!

Once you add a keyboard and a mouse to a tablet, you really do have a laptop. And by then, you might as well have a laptop, and then we're back to talking about OS X, which IMO is still best-of-breed when it comes to productivity.

The issue is that Win8/RT is trying to make a tablet into a productivity device, and it just plain isn't going to work. My PowerBook has a 15" screen - what tablet comes close to that size? Sure, it only has 1.5GB of RAM, but it also has 80GB of permanent storage, plus a DVD writer. What tablet has that kind of data capacity? Tablets are about consuming content, not creating it. And no OS is going to change that reality.
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Old 04-26-2013, 01:09 PM   #62
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Never said it was. The problem is that as easy as a touchscreen is to use, it is a horrible interface for real productivity. You can't type very fast on the darn things, for one. Selecting text is a chore. And editing photos beyond applying presets? Forget about it!

Once you add a keyboard and a mouse to a tablet, you really do have a laptop. And by then, you might as well have a laptop, and then we're back to talking about OS X, which IMO is still best-of-breed when it comes to productivity.

The issue is that Win8/RT is trying to make a tablet into a productivity device, and it just plain isn't going to work. My PowerBook has a 15" screen - what tablet comes close to that size? Sure, it only has 1.5GB of RAM, but it also has 80GB of permanent storage, plus a DVD writer. What tablet has that kind of data capacity? Tablets are about consuming content, not creating it. And no OS is going to change that reality.
As I have already said, it does work. The Surface enables all the productivity most people need in a mobile device. It's replaced my personal laptop and is far better at that than any laptop I've ever owned. Instant on, all day battery life, much less bulk, light weight, 96 GB storage (with memory card), a touchscreen interface, and the ability to remote control a PC if I really need to. It has a keyboard, but when you don't need it it simply snaps off or folds back. Laptops don't do that.

It's not for everyone, and it doesn't replace a home PC, but you overestimate what the majority of the general public needs or wants. Kind of like I did when the iPad was announced.

But if you still need a laptop Windows still has that market covered. It's not like they are forcing you into a handful of proprietary models like some other companies do.
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Old 04-26-2013, 01:59 PM   #63
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Ok sure, although the engine example has to do with inertia. My point was that not only have they not being fueling the engine, they've also been stepping on the brakes due to a series of misteps
"missteps" are a constant factor in all our lives.

In engineering, these missteps are exacerbated by Marketing, who is insistent that we hurry, hurry, so as not to miss the next sales cycle. We learn to live with that all the time, but sometimes it catches us and bites in the proverbial real end.

We owe a lot to Apple for innovation. I don't expect them to stop now, but they need to find a "Steve Jobs" replacement or at least slow down so as not to make mistakes that bite them hard.
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Old 04-26-2013, 05:44 PM   #64
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... but they need to find a "Steve Jobs" replacement or at least slow down so as not to make mistakes that bite them hard.
Jobs was very effective at diverting attention from mistakes.
Cook has been following the same development schedule but without the safety net of being able to get folks to ignore the man behind the curtain.

One lesson Cook should take from Jobs is to up his arrogance quotient when representing Apple. Jobs would never have apologized for Apple Maps; he would've blamed it on the road builders.
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Old 04-26-2013, 06:21 PM   #65
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I read an interesting article that suggested that the problem is that there's no new product to excite the people. Previously there was the ipod, iPhone and iPad. Each would follow a cycle where they take off and make huge amounts of money and then sales would level off and competitors would finally catch up somewhat and then Apple would release their new amazing product that no one knew they wanted. Well we've sort of hit that point and even though Apple is still selling a lot of ipads and iphones there's no revolutionary product on the horizon.
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Old 04-27-2013, 12:46 AM   #66
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Jobs was very effective at diverting attention from mistakes.
Cook has been following the same development schedule but without the safety net of being able to get folks to ignore the man behind the curtain.

One lesson Cook should take from Jobs is to up his arrogance quotient when representing Apple. Jobs would never have apologized for Apple Maps; he would've blamed it on the road builders.
Hell yes!

(check your karma award for that gem!)
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Old 04-27-2013, 06:05 AM   #67
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Jobs was very effective at diverting attention from mistakes.
Cook has been following the same development schedule but without the safety net of being able to get folks to ignore the man behind the curtain.

One lesson Cook should take from Jobs is to up his arrogance quotient when representing Apple. Jobs would never have apologized for Apple Maps; he would've blamed it on the road builders.
I don't really think that's the case, Steve is on record saying at a keynote, how can you trust us with icloud when we brought you mobileme, and he was under no pressure then to admit a mistake. Similar with the iphone debacle, which was as close to admitting a mistake as he could without completely ruining sales of the device.

Cook's problem wasn't in the apology, but that he let maps out of the door to begin with.
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Old 04-27-2013, 07:07 AM   #68
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I don't really think that's the case, Steve is on record saying at a keynote, how can you trust us with icloud when we brought you mobileme, and he was under no pressure then to admit a mistake. Similar with the iphone debacle, which was as close to admitting a mistake as he could without completely ruining sales of the device.
This doesn't sound like an apology:

Quote:
Gripping any phone will result in some attenuation of its antenna performance with certain places being worse than others depending on the placement of the antennas. This is a fact of life for every wireless phone. If you ever experience this on your Phone 4, avoid gripping it in the lower left corner in a way that covers both sides of the black strip in the metal band, or simply use one of many available cases.
http://www.wired.com/gadgetlab/2010/...ding-it-wrong/

Jobs simply obfuscated until he couldn't any more and then threw the faithful a bone:

Quote:
Apple's not really ready to say it's sorry about the iPhone 4 antenna design, but it is willing to give all you darn squeaky wheels free cases for your trouble. Since Apple can't build its own Bumpers fast enough, it will give you a few options and let you decide, then send it your way for free as long as you purchased the phone before September 30th. Not good enough for you? Well, if you already bought a bumper from Apple you'll get a refund, and you can also return your phone for a full refund within 30 days as long as it's unharmed.

This solution comes at the end of 22 days of Apple engineers "working their butts off," according to Steve, with "physics" ultimately being pinned as the main culprit. Apple claims you can replicate the left-handed "death grip" bar-dropping problem on the BlackBerry Bold 9700, HTC Droid Eris, and Samsung Omnia II, and that "phones aren't perfect." Steve also claims that only 0.55% of people who bought the iPhone 4 have called into AppleCare to complain about the antenna, and the phone has a 1.7% return rate at AT&T, compared to 6% with the 3GS, though he would cop to a slight increase in dropped calls over the iPhone 3GS.
http://www.engadget.com/2010/07/16/a...phone-4-users/

Three weeks of "you're holding it wrong" followed by "everybody has the same problem" and "98.3% are willing to put up with it". Followed by a giveaway of 50-cent hunks of molded plastic.

Until the end of time, if you look up chutzpah in the Encyclopedia Galactica you'll find a picture of Steve Jobs, ca June 2010.

Seriously: very few companies do outright mea culpas even when they are 100% in the wrong. Protecting the brand is always foremost. (Even BP's.)

Coming right after the change of command, the unprecedented apology *and* public "execution" of the guilty parties opened the door to threads like this. The mess was big but Cook overreacted. What was needed was a quick patch, some vague promises and a new ad campaign to change the subject.

(Mind you, he's by all indications a top manager but he shouldn't be running dog and pony shows any more than "monkey boy" Ballmer. )

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wvsboPUjrGc

Expect more Microsoft parallels from here on out: Apple *is* evolving down the same road. Maybe the next great thing will be a gaming device; Nintendo is hurting enough they might be vulnerable to an iGame.

Last edited by fjtorres; 04-27-2013 at 07:10 AM.
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Old 04-27-2013, 08:58 AM   #69
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Well he said we are not perfect, it was as much an apology as he could say in order to not severely hurt apple's sales. Btw, apple is the only company in the world calls a press conference about a problem in their hardware, admits the mistake (we are not perfect), then denies the mistake, then modifies the product in the next iteration (apparently because they made no mistake to begin with ), all the while selling millions of the device and not having the slightest dent in their sales. Only apple with Jobs could ever pull this off.

You might be right that he did overreact. But it was a pretty big debacle to be sure, whole towns wiped off the map, major monuments obscured by clouds, hundreds of thousands of locations misnamed. It's not like image retention in the retina macbook pros (ignored, it's normal for lcd screens according to apple, as if they were plasma screens...) as well as ui lags and stutters, or yellow and purplish panels in the first retina ipad (under the carpet too), or bugs and mind bogglingly bad ui choices in the lions, the mac pro, etc. etc.

IMHO Tim Cook is not a great ceo, btw. He just happened to be at the right place in the right time. Nothing about him shows brilliance. He might not be a complete moron like the coke guy John Sculley or apple's own Phil Schiller (a real embarrassment to apple every time he opens his mouth without Jobs to dictate what he should say), but a great CEO I don't think so. He's been patting himself on the back talking to Goldman Conferences these last two years while allowing one mistake after the other, product delays, software stagnating, overpricing and under equipping (then cutting down on prices and offering better specifications), alienating loyal and pro users, etc. etc. And of course overseeing the biggest stock drop they had in the last 6-7 years. He's been executing Steve's recipe to t, but doing so badly, in terms of the execution. And it's very doubt able Steve would have continued to follow his own recipe had he been alive. What works at one point doesn't always work at other points in a companies history.

Apple's saving grace is that the ceo's of other tech companies are even more inept. Seriously, after 15 or so years of apple simplifying their line up and having simple choices to offer computers, and how well this worked for them, how come no one in the manufacturing business from the likes of sony, dell, toshiba, hp etc. has realize that they should do the same bloody thing and instead of confusing users with X84S3208ABD type of gazillion product numbers and models, just simplify their line ups and offer a small number of devices, optimizing the experience on all, cutting down on costs and presenting a clear picture where someone can choose from.

The fact that still even after 15 years they haven't taken their head out of their behind and followed one simple lead apple is responsible for, shows how utterly inept they are.

Windows notebooks and pcs are also still pop up and bloatware galores, I got one recently, and I thought, boy after so many years, it's still the same shit, it's as if they still haven't got a clue.

Hence apple's pretty safe.
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Old 04-27-2013, 10:01 AM   #70
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How good a CEO Cook might be is TBD but he is by all reports a top notch COO for manufacturing; a master of the supply chain and distribution. PR management? Not his strength. But compared to Jobs anybody was bound to pale. And regardless of who might be in charge, their product line was going to stabilize for '13-14.
I'd wait til '16 to crucify him.
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Old 04-27-2013, 12:55 PM   #71
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And have refrained from shouting its sins. But what I’m really trying to point out is that without Jobs’ marketing genius I believe they are going to have a hard time of it, and their current woes are merely the first indication.
They did, when Jobs left (was thrown out) in the late 80s. While Apple struggled and finally went under in 97, to be rescued by (ironically) Microsoft, Jobs created Next Step. Apple bought Next Step, and Steve Jobs with it, and it became profitable again. (Somewhere along the road Jobs also turned Pixar around.)

Now that Steve Jobs or the The God of Hip Technology is dead, I expect Apple to become just another Tech / IT company after some time.
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Old 04-27-2013, 01:23 PM   #72
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Cook's problem wasn't in the apology, but that he let maps out of the door to begin with.
Not just letting it out the door, but creating a lot of hype about it with the now infamous quote "most beautiful, powerful mapping service ever". They certainly fell short on that.
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Old 04-27-2013, 02:22 PM   #73
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Not just letting it out the door, but creating a lot of hype about it with the now infamous quote "most beautiful, powerful mapping service ever". They certainly fell short on that.
Shhh...
My mom would say, don't mention it, don't look at it. You might embarrass them.

My mom was old school. One day in Jr. High, she had done the wash, and she brought me the old underpants I had had for some years and which were now way too small, stretched out, and holey as well. She said "this is shameful." Why didn't you tell me they were so bad, I would have gotten some more. I said "ah mom, they do the job." She said, well what if you are taken to the hospital, other people would see them. Remember I was maybe 12 or 13 so it was logical doctors and nurses would be the only ones to see them besides me.
But now thinking about it, I could have said, Ah mom, none of the medical staff would say anything, or even look at it. They wouldn't want to embarrass me. (and certainly not her)
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