Register Guidelines E-Books Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Go Back   MobileRead Forums > E-Book General > News

Notices

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 02-15-2013, 10:21 AM   #16
ApK
What did you call me?
ApK ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.ApK ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.ApK ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.ApK ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.ApK ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.ApK ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.ApK ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.ApK ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.ApK ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.ApK ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.ApK ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Posts: 3,867
Karma: 32984801
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: NJ, USA
Device: Kindle
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kali Yuga View Post
$475 = around 40 scanned books, at $12/each.

150 pages an hour just to do the photos. Probably an hour to convert it to an image PDF. If I OCR it, that's going to take even more time.

I think I'll just keep the paper versions.
Could make a little cottage industry out of scanning books for other people...or at least split the cost among several people.
ApK is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-15-2013, 10:23 AM   #17
HarryT
eBook Enthusiast
HarryT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HarryT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HarryT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HarryT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HarryT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HarryT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HarryT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HarryT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HarryT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HarryT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HarryT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
HarryT's Avatar
 
Posts: 61,015
Karma: 38191453
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: UK
Device: Kindle PW2, iPad Retina Mini, iPhone 4, MS Surface Pro
Quote:
Originally Posted by ApK View Post
Could make a little cottage industry out of scanning books for other people...or at least split the cost among several people.
If your time is worth anything to you, you really couldn't possibly compete with people like 1dollarscan, with their commercial sheet-fed scanners. This DIY scanner is interesting, but of really no commercial practicality.
HarryT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-15-2013, 10:30 AM   #18
AnemicOak
Bookaholic
AnemicOak ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AnemicOak ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AnemicOak ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AnemicOak ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AnemicOak ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AnemicOak ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AnemicOak ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AnemicOak ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AnemicOak ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AnemicOak ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AnemicOak ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
AnemicOak's Avatar
 
Posts: 9,376
Karma: 25820341
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Minnesota
Device: HDX 8.9, AuraHD, Nook HD+, Kindle 2,3,T , Opus, Nexus7, iPhone5, etc
Quote:
Originally Posted by HarryT View Post
If your time is worth anything to you, you really couldn't possibly compete with people like 1dollarscan, with their commercial sheet-fed scanners. This DIY scanner is interesting, but of really no commercial practicality.
I agree for the most part, although this is non-destructive unlike 1dollarscan and the like. That would have added value under some circumstances.
AnemicOak is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-15-2013, 10:36 AM   #19
HarryT
eBook Enthusiast
HarryT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HarryT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HarryT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HarryT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HarryT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HarryT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HarryT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HarryT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HarryT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HarryT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HarryT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
HarryT's Avatar
 
Posts: 61,015
Karma: 38191453
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: UK
Device: Kindle PW2, iPad Retina Mini, iPhone 4, MS Surface Pro
Quote:
Originally Posted by AnemicOak View Post
I agree for the most part, although this is non-destructive unlike 1dollarscan and the like. That would have added value under some circumstances.
True, although 1dollarscan do offer a non-destructive option at additional cost.

I do think this is a very interesting project, though. Love to have one of these myself at some point.
HarryT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-15-2013, 10:38 AM   #20
AnemicOak
Bookaholic
AnemicOak ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AnemicOak ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AnemicOak ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AnemicOak ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AnemicOak ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AnemicOak ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AnemicOak ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AnemicOak ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AnemicOak ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AnemicOak ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AnemicOak ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
AnemicOak's Avatar
 
Posts: 9,376
Karma: 25820341
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Minnesota
Device: HDX 8.9, AuraHD, Nook HD+, Kindle 2,3,T , Opus, Nexus7, iPhone5, etc
Quote:
Originally Posted by HarryT View Post
True, although 1dollarscan do offer a non-destructive option at additional cost.
Ahh, didn't know that.

I too think it's interesting. Having scanned a few books for myself however I know that I'd be unlikely to use it enough to make it worth it for me.
AnemicOak is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-15-2013, 11:13 AM   #21
AlbertaCowboy
Proud Daddy!
AlbertaCowboy ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AlbertaCowboy ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AlbertaCowboy ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AlbertaCowboy ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AlbertaCowboy ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AlbertaCowboy ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AlbertaCowboy ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AlbertaCowboy ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AlbertaCowboy ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AlbertaCowboy ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AlbertaCowboy ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
AlbertaCowboy's Avatar
 
Posts: 542
Karma: 6334320
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Alberta, Canada
Device: PRS-505, PRS-300, PRS-350, PRS-650, iPhone 4S, Samsung Galaxy Tab 2 7"
Quote:
Originally Posted by HarryT View Post
True, although 1dollarscan do offer a non-destructive option at additional cost.
Harry, where did you see this option?
I've been tempted to try the service out, but hate the thought of destroying my book in the process.
I know for a mass market pbook it's probably not worth the expense, but I've got some obscure pbooks that I'd love to digitize.
I'd even be tempted to shell out the half grand for the diy kit, but my wife would kill me!
AlbertaCowboy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-15-2013, 11:19 AM   #22
HarryT
eBook Enthusiast
HarryT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HarryT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HarryT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HarryT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HarryT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HarryT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HarryT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HarryT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HarryT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HarryT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HarryT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
HarryT's Avatar
 
Posts: 61,015
Karma: 38191453
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: UK
Device: Kindle PW2, iPad Retina Mini, iPhone 4, MS Surface Pro
Quote:
Originally Posted by AlbertaCowboy View Post
Harry, where did you see this option?
Actually, looking at the site, I see that the only time non-destructive scanning is available is for material for which you are the copyright holder. Sorry for the duff information!
HarryT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-15-2013, 12:02 PM   #23
BenG
Voodoo Man
BenG ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.BenG ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.BenG ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.BenG ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.BenG ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.BenG ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.BenG ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.BenG ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.BenG ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.BenG ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.BenG ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
BenG's Avatar
 
Posts: 3,554
Karma: 56320024
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: The Triad
Device: Paperwhite
All you need is a flatbed scanner and Finereader. This tutorial is for Finereader 5 but I've used it with Finereader 8 and perhaps could be adapted for later versions. I've scanned a medium sized paperback in a little over an hour while watching TV. It's non-destructive except for some stress on the spine.

http://sno2.iwarp.com/ebook-faq/documents/page-4-1.html
BenG is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-15-2013, 01:07 PM   #24
rkomar
Wizard
rkomar ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.rkomar ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.rkomar ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.rkomar ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.rkomar ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.rkomar ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.rkomar ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.rkomar ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.rkomar ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.rkomar ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.rkomar ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Posts: 1,513
Karma: 4065128
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada
Device: PRS-505, PB 902, PRS-T1, PB 623
If you don't mind shelling out a bit more, then Plustek has some scanners specifically built for scanning books. The scanning is done very close to one side of the flat bed, so that you can lay one page of the book down and get a truly flat scan (as long as the inside margin is about 1 cm or more to allow it to reach the scanner). No distortions or harsh pressures on the spine. The cheapest one is probably in the neighbourhood of $475, though, so the DIY option still makes sense.

I have the cheapest version (Opticbook 3600), and I can get about 120 pages per minute at 600 dpi (black/white) for large books. Paperbacks at 300 dpi can be scanned at about 200-300 pages per hour. So, I'm a bit disappointed that the DIY model is only 150 pages per hour. However, my scanner is quite a bit slower when doing colour scans, so it sounds like the DIY model would be faster for that.
rkomar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-15-2013, 01:23 PM   #25
wizwor
Guru
wizwor ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.wizwor ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.wizwor ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.wizwor ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.wizwor ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.wizwor ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.wizwor ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.wizwor ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.wizwor ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.wizwor ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.wizwor ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
wizwor's Avatar
 
Posts: 952
Karma: 20949157
Join Date: Nov 2011
Device: kindle, fire
Back in the 80s, I had an Atari computer and wanted to scan images for a newsletter. There were no affordable scanners at that time and none whatsoever for the Atari, so I did something similar.

I bought this device called ComputerEyes, attached it to a video camera, and digitized images taped to a nearby wall. No OCR back then, but I'm not sure why this impresses. For a fraction of the cost of this device with no effort, I can buy a scanner with an ADF that comes with free OCR software.
wizwor is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 02-15-2013, 03:00 PM   #26
Turtle91
Guru
Turtle91 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Turtle91 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Turtle91 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Turtle91 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Turtle91 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Turtle91 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Turtle91 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Turtle91 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Turtle91 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Turtle91 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Turtle91 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Turtle91's Avatar
 
Posts: 669
Karma: 3807234
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Shannon, Ireland today
Device: iPhone 5/iPad 1&2/Surface Pro/Kindle PW
Quote:
Originally Posted by HarryT View Post
Libraries? It's one thing to scan your own books - quite another to scan library books. That's just blatant copyright infringement.
I meant you can bring your own books in and use the scanner - just like at a hackerspace or makespace. Most communities have a library - not all have a hackerspace/makespace.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kali Yuga View Post
$475 = around 40 scanned books, at $12/each.

150 pages an hour just to do the photos. Probably an hour to convert it to an image PDF. If I OCR it, that's going to take even more time.

I think I'll just keep the paper versions.
As mentioned before, this wouldn't be worth it if you only have a few books. By your math $475 = 400 at $1.20 each, and $475 = 1000 at $0.48 each. Economies of scale apply.

If all you want is an image PDF - that is just a matter of a couple of minutes with a reasonably competent computer. However, the OCR itself is done automatically in the background as I take the images; It is usually done within a few minutes of me scanning the book. It does take longer to spell check and proofread...but most people would do the spell check and proofing anyway when they want to make a good ePub. The key is getting good quality images for the software to work from. These scanners have everything set up to take those consistent good quality images. This results in very few OCR errors....of course the quality of the book you are scanning is a big factor too, but a bad source would make ANY job harder on any device.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BenG View Post
All you need is a flatbed scanner and Finereader. This tutorial is for Finereader 5 but I've used it with Finereader 8 and perhaps could be adapted for later versions. I've scanned a medium sized paperback in a little over an hour while watching TV. It's non-destructive except for some stress on the spine.

http://sno2.iwarp.com/ebook-faq/documents/page-4-1.html
Yes, exactly. If you are only doing a few books this is an option - I've used it myself before building my own scanner. One problem I ran into was the distortion of the words as the page bends near the spine. That distortion is the source of most OCR errors.

The plattens/cradles used in most peoples designs are angled so the book is held in a non-spine-stressing position. The cameras are also positioned so you get a vertical and centered image of each page - that drastically reduces any errors that the OCR software needs to correct. You also get a lot of speed benefit when you use cameras to take an image of the page instead of scanning. Click-2 pages done, click-2 pages done instead of "chunk chunk whiz brrrrrrrr chunkety chunkety" - 1 page done.

Quote:
Originally Posted by HarryT View Post
If your time is worth anything to you, you really couldn't possibly compete with people like 1dollarscan, with their commercial sheet-fed scanners. This DIY scanner is interesting, but of really no commercial practicality.
"Time is Money"
I too have a life...and you won't see me spending all day every day scanning books. But I will spend an hour on a book here and there. Having my own scanner available when I want to use it is awesome. I'm not sure about this kit version, but I designed mine to be portable...I can take it down and set it up in just a few minutes. It fits into a box about the size of 3 shoe boxes and fits neatly in my closet.

If you have enough money then it is certainly easier to just buy a new ebook...but not all books are available electronically.

There is also an issue with paying for someone else to do the "format shifting" for you. In some countries you are only allowed to shift the format on your own personally owned copy.

There is a TON of commercial practicality in creating quick/accurate scanners. Check out the http://www.diybookscanner.org website and you will see several mentions of how governments and businesses are buying these things to digitize their records.

When reading about this device you must keep in mind that it was started as a DIY project. DIYers are a different breed of folk anyway - part of the draw is learning, designing, and building something yourself. However, there were so many requests from people who were not technically inclined to purchase scanners that others built, that the "founder", Daniel Reetz, started working on this KIT that could easily be assembled by anyone.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ghostyjack View Post
This may work on text but what about images?
Through experimentation they found that the ideal resolution for OCR of scanned text is 300dpi - anything more just slows down the software and anything less leads to more errors. If you do the math 300dpi for a 10in x 12in image is 3000 x 3600 pixels or 10.8 MegaPixels - definitely in the range of moderate to low priced cameras today.

That resolution is fine for simple images - especially black and white diagrams or images/maps. If you want really high resolution for the cover or artwork it is recommended to scan those separately and insert them later - a VERY easy process if you are using something like SIGIL.

Video cameras have been tried but the resolution - and time/difficulty in picking the best frame from within the video to use for OCR made digital cameras the best option...unless you want to go with super fast video and lasers and such...that can read a whole book in a few seconds. You are talking several thousand dollars for that kind of setup. Here's a cool video showing some university developing that technology: HERE


Cheers!

Last edited by Turtle91; 02-15-2013 at 03:04 PM.
Turtle91 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-15-2013, 04:21 PM   #27
Turtle91
Guru
Turtle91 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Turtle91 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Turtle91 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Turtle91 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Turtle91 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Turtle91 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Turtle91 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Turtle91 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Turtle91 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Turtle91 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Turtle91 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Turtle91's Avatar
 
Posts: 669
Karma: 3807234
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Shannon, Ireland today
Device: iPhone 5/iPad 1&2/Surface Pro/Kindle PW
I just checked out 1dollarscan. Interesting. For 1 Dollar (plus tax, shipping/handling) you get your book destroyed - they throw it away - and they give you a PDF.

As some of you already know - PDF's are a major nightmare to convert to ePub. They are mostly non-reflowable... good luck trying to read that on a 4" screen!

So, you spent $1 for a nightmare to convert to a readable state, and lost your $9.99 paperback.... According to Kali Yuga you would break even with your own scanner after only 40 books!!
Turtle91 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-15-2013, 09:00 PM   #28
rkomar
Wizard
rkomar ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.rkomar ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.rkomar ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.rkomar ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.rkomar ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.rkomar ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.rkomar ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.rkomar ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.rkomar ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.rkomar ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.rkomar ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Posts: 1,513
Karma: 4065128
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada
Device: PRS-505, PB 902, PRS-T1, PB 623
I think you get a PDF of scanned images for the cheap price. You can always OCR those yourself, just like you would do with the DIY scans.
rkomar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-15-2013, 09:45 PM   #29
kevinp
Fanatic
kevinp ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.kevinp ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.kevinp ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.kevinp ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.kevinp ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.kevinp ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.kevinp ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.kevinp ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.kevinp ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.kevinp ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.kevinp ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
kevinp's Avatar
 
Posts: 532
Karma: 3549018
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Orlando
Device: Nook HD+; Kindle for Android on HTC One SV
Quote:
Originally Posted by rkomar View Post
Paperbacks at 300 dpi can be scanned at about 200-300 pages per hour. So, I'm a bit disappointed that the DIY model is only 150 pages per hour.
The DIY model is getting 150 pages per MINUTE. Watch the video. He says the average user is getting around 1,000 pages per hour with the DIY.

150 pages per hour would be something like 20 seconds per page. I do a lot faster than that with my flatbed scanner.
kevinp is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-15-2013, 11:05 PM   #30
rkomar
Wizard
rkomar ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.rkomar ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.rkomar ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.rkomar ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.rkomar ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.rkomar ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.rkomar ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.rkomar ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.rkomar ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.rkomar ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.rkomar ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Posts: 1,513
Karma: 4065128
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada
Device: PRS-505, PB 902, PRS-T1, PB 623
Quote:
Originally Posted by kevinp View Post
The DIY model is getting 150 pages per MINUTE. Watch the video. He says the average user is getting around 1,000 pages per hour with the DIY.

150 pages per hour would be something like 20 seconds per page. I do a lot faster than that with my flatbed scanner.
As I said before, 150 pages per minute would a pair of pictures every 0.8 seconds. That's not possible manually. 15 pages per minute (900 per hour) would be 8 seconds per shot, which sounds more reasonable. So far, the two numbers put forth (150/min and 150/hr) both seem wrong compared to what people say on the DIY website.
rkomar is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Min screen size for A4 pages aero13792468 General Discussions 9 05-24-2011 08:00 AM
DIY Scanner Eratosthenes News 14 04-16-2010 04:21 PM
DIY Book Scanner article in Wired sassanik News 3 12-12-2009 02:43 PM
High-speed book scanner works as pages turn Shadowplay News 5 08-13-2009 07:29 PM
DIY High-speed Book Scanner Plans danielreetz Workshop 17 06-25-2009 08:17 AM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 06:51 AM.


MobileRead.com is a privately owned, operated and funded community.