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Old 02-05-2013, 02:15 PM   #16
Namekuseijin
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who cares for covers, fonts or paragraph indentation?
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Old 02-05-2013, 02:25 PM   #17
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Originally Posted by Namekuseijin View Post
who cares for covers, fonts or paragraph indentation?
People who are used to proper books, with good covers, typography, and finishing like good ToC's and such. Basically, most people born before 1995 or so.
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Old 02-05-2013, 02:31 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by Katsunami View Post
People who are used to proper books, with good covers, typography, and finishing like good ToC's and such. Basically, most people born before 1995 or so.
I was born in the '60s and I don't care about most of that. Never could care about covers... even on print books—the author rarely has anything to do with them anyway. Never worried about how pretty the envelopes were that people sent me letters in either. There are no "givens" concerning age and these sort of preferences.
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Old 02-05-2013, 02:33 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by Namekuseijin View Post
who cares for covers, fonts or paragraph indentation?
Presentation is a huge part of the package. If we carried your question further...
Who cares about spelling, punctuation, grammar...

I wonder if a book written in nothing but text talk, with no spaces, paragraph indents, scene changes, chapters..."all in Edwardian Script Font"... wrapped with a picture of a pile of dog poo...would sell very well??
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Old 02-05-2013, 02:33 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by Katsunami View Post
I have actually been thinking to export a book into a plain TXT-file, and then create my own EPUB out of it in Sigil. Then I will have a perfect eBook in the end, but who has the time to do it? It can take hours for a long book, especially when you have to put things such italics back in there.
I typically grab the HTML files from Calibre, cat them back into one file then run the lot though a bunch of search and replaces I got saved in my text editor, usually takes me 30 minutes to sort out one book. I don't save as text because, as you say, you're then having to put back all the italics manually. I archive all my books as HTML files, it's the next best thing to straight text files in terms of long term readability.
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Old 02-05-2013, 02:37 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by Turtle91 View Post
Presentation is a huge part of the package. If we carried your question further...
Who cares about spelling, punctuation, grammar...
That's not carrying it further... that's taking it in an entirely different direction.
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Old 02-05-2013, 02:40 PM   #22
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I must be fortunate in that I've never read a book with serious formatting issues. Other than a few typos and a partial picture all my books have been good quality.
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Old 02-05-2013, 02:52 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by m00min View Post
I typically grab the HTML files from Calibre, cat them back into one file then run the lot though a bunch of search and replaces I got saved in my text editor, usually takes me 30 minutes to sort out one book. I don't save as text because, as you say, you're then having to put back all the italics manually. I archive all my books as HTML files, it's the next best thing to straight text files in terms of long term readability.
I've actually been looking into something like this to make (almost) sure that I can still use my books in the future. Therefore I'm also re-ripping all my music in FLAC format and save pictures in both DNG and Tiff. Also, I refuse to buy any software that I never intend to replace (mostly games) if they have any form of drm. Same with un-de-drm-able books. Yes, I'm quite anal about this.
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Old 02-05-2013, 02:55 PM   #24
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Normally I'm happy just being able to change to my font. So I'll open up an epub only if I find I can't override the font and usually just fix that.

I'm currently reading a book though where they went nuts trying to use tables multiple times, and each instance left it unreadable. One instance was for a press conference setting, putting the person or paper's name at the left, with their text in a right column. Which forced the text each said at the right so it would only be about 1/2 the width of the screen. And if the entire text from one person or source didn't fit on the same one page (and it often didn't), it was just lost... it didn't flow to the next page, it was just cut off. It's maddening to run into bad formatting like that.

I was happy at least that I was at home reading and could instantly fix it. If I had been out for the day where I often read a lot, I would have been fuming for the next 8 hours until I got back home. I'd pretty much have to start another book if I wanted to keep reading, which I don't like reading 2 at once, or just live with missing a lot of key interchanges, equally unacceptable to me.

But I find screwups like this just impossible to understand how and why they manage to do it as publishers. And after this one I just might do as others have posted, always open up the book first and see what needs to be fixed before I open it on my reader to sit down with.
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Old 02-05-2013, 04:00 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DiapDealer View Post
I was born in the '60s
Funny, I had always pictured you as being much older.



I, too, was born in the 60s, and formatting isn't a huge issue for me. I generally only read a book once and move onto the next one. The tragic result of a far too large to-be-read list.
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Old 02-05-2013, 04:45 PM   #26
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Funny, I had always pictured you as being much older.

Oh, I am; physically. I've just always been slightly temporally challenged. I accomplish my chronological age in fewer years than most.
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Old 02-05-2013, 04:53 PM   #27
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That's not carrying it further... that's taking it in an entirely different direction.
Why?? Spelling, punctuation, and grammar are just presentation....the idea of the story is still there!

From Jellby's version of P & P...

Quote:
Ryght honorable, Salutem in Christo Jesu, and Syr here ys no lesse joynge and rejossynge in thes partees for the byrth of our prynce, hoom we hungurde for so longe, then ther was (I trow), inter vicinos att the byrth of S. J. Baptyste, as thys berer, Master Erance, can telle you. Gode gyffe us alle grace, to yelde dew thankes to our Lorde Gode, Gode of Inglonde, for verely He hathe shoyd Hym selff Gode of Inglonde, or rather an Inglyssh Gode, yf we consydyr and pondyr welle alle Hys procedynges with us from tyme to tyme. He hath over cumme alle our yllnesse with Hys excedynge goodnesse, so that we are now moor then compellyd to serve Hym, seke Hys glory, promott Hys wurde, yf the Devylle of alle Devylles be natt in us. We have now the stooppe of vayne trustes ande the stey of vayne expectations; lett us alle pray for hys preservatione. Ande I for my partt wylle wyssh that hys Grace allways have, and evyn now from the begynynge, Governares, Instructores and offyceres of ryght jugmente, ne optimum ingenium non optimâ educatione deprevetur.

Butt whatt a grett fowlle am I! So, whatt devotione shoyth many tymys butt lytelle dyscretione! Ande thus the Gode of Inglonde be ever with you in alle your procedynges.
granted...that's just spelling...but a GREAT story lives inside there...

Last edited by Turtle91; 02-05-2013 at 04:57 PM.
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Old 02-05-2013, 05:03 PM   #28
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Originally Posted by Katsunami View Post
I've deleted 10 books from my Kobo library yesterday; all free ones, granted. I'll make them myself, using the Gutenberg text (edit: or get them here at MR). I've written school reports in LaTeX that looked more professional than some eBooks I've bought (free, and for prices between €2 and €7.50 or so) in the last few days.
Gets pretty bad when you pay for ebooks and they look like they came out of the garbage. If you bought a paperback you'd take it straight back.

I notice with both Kobo and Amazon the free public domain titles are all very average in their format. I think feedbooks has the best finished product for public domain books. To me it looks like Kobo in particular automate pulling from Gutenberg, and post on the online store.

That said some of Baens books are average, but no DRM means quick convert.
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Old 02-05-2013, 05:16 PM   #29
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Feedbooks? Don't know them. Will check that out.

I find it epically stupid to present cheap or even free works so badly. They don't need to be up to the standards of an $20 eBook, but when nicely presented, that *does* instill confidence in the store. First impressions, you know. Like "If this is the free stuff, and that good, how great will the paid stuff then be?"

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Old 02-05-2013, 05:24 PM   #30
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I feel your pain, but I'm a lot more irritated by crappy writing than by crappy formatting.
Crappy formatting is distracting when reading. That's why I fix it so it's not crappy and I can get on with just reading.
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