Les Misérables

stop__dreaming · 01-20-2013, 04:25 PM

Going to start Les Misérables soon and wondered why in the Kindle version words are displayed as this 'D----' for Digne. It also happens again with 'B------' for Brignolles.

Any reason why this is? And also, they've released a 50p Kindle version on Amazon. Is that to rake money in off the back of the film?

LovesMacs · 01-20-2013, 05:55 PM

I have read somewhere that the names are omitted to convey the impression that the people and events are real and it would be scandalous to reveal the exact places and identities.

Ravensknight · 01-20-2013, 08:23 PM

That "D---" is a standard "trope" of writing of that time. It ranges from Dickens to Tolstoy...

haydnfan · 01-20-2013, 09:38 PM

What LovesMac said.

What translation did you choose? I've read Lee Fahnestock and Norman McAfee's translation the first time I read it back in high school.

After watching the recent movie I want to reread it and chose the Norman Denny translation, which can be found on the kindle for $2.99.

I don't know what the 50p one is that you mention, but if it's Wilbour or Hapgood those should be public domain and thus free, don't pay.

HarryT · 01-21-2013, 01:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ravensknight

That "D---" is a standard "trope" of writing of that time. It ranges from Dickens to Tolstoy...

It goes back a lot earlier. Jane Austen does it a lot. Eg in "Pride and Prejudice", the militia regiment that Wickam is a member of is always referred to as the "-----shire" militia.

stop__dreaming · 01-21-2013, 06:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by haydnfan

What LovesMac said.

What translation did you choose? I've read Lee Fahnestock and Norman McAfee's translation the first time I read it back in high school.

After watching the recent movie I want to reread it and chose the Norman Denny translation, which can be found on the kindle for $2.99.

I don't know what the 50p one is that you mention, but if it's Wilbour or Hapgood those should be public domain and thus free, don't pay.

I believe it's Hapgood, which looks exactly the same version as the free one on Amazon but the 50p version seems to display the words instead of 'D----' and 'B-----'.

Which translation is the best?

haydnfan · 01-21-2013, 07:06 AM

Denny seems to be the only to respect the fact that grammatical structure should be changed to reflect the differences between the French and English languages. The other translations read like Henry James with long elliptical sentences. Whether that is an artifact of the translation or a key attribute of Hugo's style... Your personal opinion on that question will decide what you think is best. I don't know how the modern translations compare to the classics aside from that issue... But the English language hasn't changed in that time so I doubt that it matters.

stop__dreaming · 01-21-2013, 08:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by haydnfan

But the English language hasn't changed in that time so I doubt that it matters.

Okay. Thanks

I may opt to pay the 50p version. Call me a snob, but I think I'll find it irritating if I find words missing i.e 'D----'.

HarryT · 01-21-2013, 08:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stop__dreaming

I may opt to pay the 50p version. Call me a snob, but I think I'll find it irritating if I find words missing i.e 'D----'.

Are you saying that these words are not represented thus in the French original?

stop__dreaming · 01-21-2013, 08:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HarryT

Are you saying that these words are not represented thus in the French original?

No idea. Every version I've seen, besides the free Kindle one, display it as Dignes and Brignolles.

HarryT · 01-21-2013, 08:32 AM

Can you give an example of where the word occurs, and I'll look in the original.

stop__dreaming · 01-21-2013, 08:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HarryT

Can you give an example of where the word occurs, and I'll look in the original.

Fantine - First chapter called 'Myriel'.

"In 1815, M. Charles-Francois Bienvenu Myriel was bishop of D-- He was an old man of above seventy-five years of age; he had occupied the see of D-- since 1806."

If you click preview of the free Kindle version of Amazon, you'll see it again and again on various paragraphs.

Thanks for looking!

HarryT · 01-21-2013, 08:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stop__dreaming

Fantine - First chapter called 'Myriel'.

"In 1815, M. Charles-Francois Bienvenu Myriel was bishop of D-- He was an old man of above seventy-five years of age; he had occupied the see of D-- since 1806."

If you click preview of the free Kindle version of Amazon, you'll see it again and again on various paragraphs.

Thanks for looking!

It is in full in the original:

Quote:

En 1815, M. Charles-François-Bienvenu Myriel était évêque de Digne. C'était un vieillard d'environ soixante-quinze ans; il occupait le siège de Digne depuis 1806.

Chi Cygni · 01-21-2013, 08:55 AM

I tried to read this but discontinued in the middle of 3rd volume

stop__dreaming · 01-21-2013, 09:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HarryT

It is in full in the original:

How strange. I won't be using the free version then.

Thank you

01-20-2013, 04:25 PM	#1
stop__dreaming Groupie Posts: 173 Karma: 1211098 Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Bristol, England Device: Kindle 3	Les Misérables Going to start Les Misérables soon and wondered why in the Kindle version words are displayed as this 'D----' for Digne. It also happens again with 'B------' for Brignolles. Any reason why this is? And also, they've released a 50p Kindle version on Amazon. Is that to rake money in off the back of the film? __________________ Twitter: @GagneDouze

01-20-2013, 05:55 PM	#2
LovesMacs Spring has sprung. Posts: 260 Karma: 1166338 Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: Somewhere with seagulls. And bunnies. Device: Kindle Touch, iPhone, books beginning with "e"	I have read somewhere that the names are omitted to convey the impression that the people and events are real and it would be scandalous to reveal the exact places and identities. __________________ A happy day is a day with a bunny.

01-20-2013, 08:23 PM	#3
Ravensknight Serpent Rider Posts: 613 Karma: 5200000 Join Date: Jun 2009 Device: PRS-505, Superpad Tablet, Sony T1, Sony 350, Nook STR	That "D---" is a standard "trope" of writing of that time. It ranges from Dickens to Tolstoy... __________________ My Goodreads Profile Join the Science Fiction Book Club and we both get rewarded

01-21-2013, 08:32 AM	#11
HarryT eBook Enthusiast Posts: 54,657 Karma: 26165759 Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: UK Device: Kindle Touch, PW, Fire HD, iPad 3, iPhone 4, Samsung Tab 2 7 + More	Can you give an example of where the word occurs, and I'll look in the original. __________________ Harry Currently proofreading The Poison Belt, by Sir Arthur Conan Doyle.

01-21-2013, 08:55 AM	#14
Chi Cygni Addict Posts: 530 Karma: 4458321 Join Date: Dec 2010 Location: Europe Device: iPad, black Cybook Opus, Kindle 3 3G, Novo 7 Fire	I tried to read this but discontinued in the middle of 3rd volume __________________ Midnight Snacker http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chi_Cygni

01-20-2013, 09:38 PM	#4
haydnfan Addict Posts: 206 Karma: 1222434 Join Date: Dec 2011 Device: Kindle PW, Kindle 4B, iPad Mini	What LovesMac said. What translation did you choose? I've read Lee Fahnestock and Norman McAfee's translation the first time I read it back in high school. After watching the recent movie I want to reread it and chose the Norman Denny translation, which can be found on the kindle for $2.99. I don't know what the 50p one is that you mention, but if it's Wilbour or Hapgood those should be public domain and thus free, don't pay.

01-21-2013, 07:06 AM	#7
haydnfan Addict Posts: 206 Karma: 1222434 Join Date: Dec 2011 Device: Kindle PW, Kindle 4B, iPad Mini	Denny seems to be the only to respect the fact that grammatical structure should be changed to reflect the differences between the French and English languages. The other translations read like Henry James with long elliptical sentences. Whether that is an artifact of the translation or a key attribute of Hugo's style... Your personal opinion on that question will decide what you think is best. I don't know how the modern translations compare to the classics aside from that issue... But the English language hasn't changed in that time so I doubt that it matters.

Thread Tools	Search this Thread
Show Printable Version Email this Page	Search this Thread: Advanced Search

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
Which version of Les Miserables is best for Kindle?	angelbleu	Amazon Kindle	15	02-12-2013 10:50 PM
Tom Hooper's Les Misérables	BenG	Lounge	2	06-01-2012 01:06 PM
Other Fiction Hugo, Victor: Les Miserables v1.0 English	Goshzilla	ePub Books	0	04-09-2010 06:33 PM
Les Miserables - TOC / Chapter Flags?	gshipley	Amazon Kindle	1	09-28-2009 10:07 PM
Hugo, Victor: Les Miserables. May 2007	Roy White	BBeB/LRF Books	2	08-17-2008 01:24 PM


Advertisement Enthusiast