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Old 01-16-2013, 09:17 AM   #46
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No, they needn't give out sales figures. This isn't even about past sales figures. It's about a possible drop in future demand and how to allay the fears of shareholders. How about a short press release? Something as simple as this:

Recent media reports have indicated a large drop in Apple's first quarter orders for iPhone 5 LCD displays. These media reports are incorrect and misleading, and orders for these components are proceeding as originally planned. We expect first quarter demand of our flagship phone to be as strong as they were the previous quarter and the corresponding first quarter of 2012.

Apple will be releasing its quarterly earnings report next week, and the numbers will show continued strong growth in both revenues and profits for all areas of our operations.


It is fair to put shareholders through more days of potentially wild stock fluctuations if the information is in fact false?

--Pat
I think that Apple can communicate with its shareholders through means other than press releases. And stock fluctuations can benefit shareholders if they play the market well.
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Old 01-16-2013, 09:25 AM   #47
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But let me ask you this, murray: Why wouldn't Apple come out and refute the information if it were false and save its stockholders from potentially vast losses? Why not?
a) Stock price movements cause no-one gains or losses unless they are actually buying or selling.
b) They are releasing their full results next week anyway.

There is at least one rumour involving Apple every week. Should they respond to all of them?
Should they refute the iPhone Mini rumours?
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Old 01-16-2013, 09:25 AM   #48
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One clear reality. There is now serious competition in the smartphone space. And competition squeezes monopolistic practices. That's economics 101...

That is an important point about the Android space. Many similar competitors, making it easier to swap providers.
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Old 01-16-2013, 09:27 AM   #49
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One clear reality. There is now serious competition in the smartphone space. And competition squeezes monopolistic practices. That's economics 101...

That is an important point about the Android space. Many similar competitors, making it easier to swap providers.
Although in practice the smartphone market has become close to a duopoly, with only Samsung having significant success at the high-end.
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Old 01-16-2013, 09:27 AM   #50
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I think that Apple can communicate with its shareholders through means other than press releases. And stock fluctuations can benefit shareholders if they play the market well.
How then would they communicate over the next few days to individual stockholders that the reports are bunk? So as to keep the jittery ones from dumping some stock at a loss?

Also, it needn't be a press release. They just need to communicate. It could be simply giving an interview or a few quotable statements to a respected media outlet.

--Pat
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Old 01-16-2013, 09:40 AM   #51
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a) Stock price movements cause no-one gains or losses unless they are actually buying or selling.
b) They are releasing their full results next week anyway.

There is at least one rumour involving Apple every week. Should they respond to all of them?
Should they refute the iPhone Mini rumours?
a) Sure, but are you going to say there have been no large groups of investors who have taken a big loss so far due to transactions based on these "rumors?"

b) Past performance is no guarantee of future results!! Seriously, this isn't about past earnings so much as indications of current and future trends.

And, sure, rumors regarding the mobile market crop up every second. But this is one of the most significant ones regarding a major player, and seems to relate directly to trends in demand.

Also, an iPhone Mini or rumors of any future product wouldn't necessarily depress stock prices. It could actually boost prices.

--Pat
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Old 01-16-2013, 09:50 AM   #52
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Also, an iPhone Mini or rumors of any future product wouldn't necessarily depress stock prices. It could actually boost prices.
What does that have to do with it?
They should only correct misinformation that lowers the share price, but not misinformation that raises it?
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Old 01-16-2013, 10:00 AM   #53
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What does that have to do with it?
They should only correct misinformation that lowers the share price, but not misinformation that raises it?

They should correct any significant rumor that is an assertion of fact and that is incorrect. Especially when it can impact share prices so starkly.

The statements regarding decreased orders for screen displays were assertions of fact. The "rumors" of an iPhone Mini were not assertions of fact, but rather clearly predictions.

--Pat
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Old 01-16-2013, 10:12 AM   #54
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How then would they communicate over the next few days to individual stockholders that the reports are bunk? So as to keep the jittery ones from dumping some stock at a loss?
The jittery ones would have sold anyway. And selling at a loss means that they bought the stock less than a year ago. For any stock that they had for longer than a year, they would still sell at a profit, even today.

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Also, it needn't be a press release. They just need to communicate. It could be simply giving an interview or a few quotable statements to a respected media outlet.
Right, because any statement that ends with something along the lines of "can't give you the numbers until next week" will really keep the jittery ones relaxed.

Besides, from this graph it looks like the market was overexcited about the iPhone 5, and now it's back on the previous track:
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Old 01-16-2013, 10:27 AM   #55
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They should correct any significant rumor that is an assertion of fact and that is incorrect.
--Pat
You can't really run a business with that policy. Denying all incorrect rumours effectively confirms all true ones. This would allow competitors, by seeding of rumours, do determine a company's direction, financial situation, etc.

/JB
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Old 01-16-2013, 10:31 AM   #56
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The jittery ones would have sold anyway. And selling at a loss means that they bought the stock less than a year ago. For any stock that they had for longer than a year, they would still sell at a profit, even today.
What do you mean the jittery ones would have sold anyway? If Apple had come out right away on day 1 and said that the information was incorrect, then the jittery ones might have held on.

Regarding folks who bought less than a year ago, you think it's OK then that they may have taken a loss due to potential stock manipulation? How does the date of purchase make a stock loss due to stock manipulation any more or less acceptable?


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Right, because any statement that ends with something along the lines of "can't give you the numbers until next week" will really keep the jittery ones relaxed.
Again, this isn't about the earnings report. AFAIK, they won't be putting in numbers for display orders in that report next week either. So it's not about telling then to wait next week for further numbers.

Quote:
Besides, from this graph it looks like the market was overexcited about the iPhone 5, and now it's back on the previous track:
That chart is too small to read clearly. I can't make out what it's really saying. Unless it relates directly to first quarter orders for the iPhone 5 specifically, I'm not sure how it is very relevant to the rumors in question.


--Pat
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Old 01-16-2013, 10:32 AM   #57
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Just to clear up my view (I'm having a bad day, sorry if that came through).

I don't particularly care one way or another about this story or whether Apple respond to it.
What I do dislike is the modern trend for executives to have more concern about managing their share price than their company.
I don't think share price concerns should have any effect on a companies decision making, they should be focusing on the company itself, and increasing revenue and profit. Instead (fulled, no doubt, by share-price related bonuses), success is measured by whether the share price goes up or down.
Shareholders are rewarded through dividends, and the best way to increase dividends is to run a profitable company.
The success or failure or short-term speculators (where medium term would be years if not decades) should not affect business decisions.
Rant over.
(I also hate the modern 'journalism' that regards reporting rumours from another site as somehow being a real story. Second rant over too.)

Last edited by murraypaul; 01-16-2013 at 10:49 AM.
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Old 01-16-2013, 10:36 AM   #58
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You can't really run a business with that policy. Denying all incorrect rumours effectively confirms all true ones. This would allow competitors, by seeding of rumours, do determine a company's direction, financial situation, etc.

/JB
Again, not ALL incorrect rumors. Simply significant ones regarding incorrect assertions of fact that have the potential to impact their stock prices greatly.

I am not the only one asking this question. Others writing on the "rumor" of the decreased orders have also asked it. For example, here:

http://gizmodo.com/5976163/yes-apple...?post=56225033

--Pat
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Old 01-16-2013, 10:41 AM   #59
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Again, not ALL incorrect rumors. Simply significant ones regarding incorrect assertions of fact that have the potential to impact their stock prices greatly.
My point still holds - if a competitor knows Apple is bound to confirm or deny any such rumours, suitable rumours can be seeded which allow the competitors to gain an advantage.

/JB
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Old 01-16-2013, 10:48 AM   #60
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My point still holds - if a competitor knows Apple is bound to confirm or deny any such rumours, suitable rumours can be seeded which allow the competitors to gain an advantage.

/JB

How so in cases such as this regarding a potential incorrect assertion of fact? Again, I'm only saying it should be done for major rumors. Not every little thing. And only things which could be potential stock manipulation.

--Pat
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