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Old 01-14-2013, 05:09 PM   #31
xendula
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It just boggles my mind because it's a lot of work. And I assume most of them do it anonymously so they aren't going to get a whole lot of "feel good." Or maybe I just wouldn't get anything out of it so I can't quite place myself in their position.
If I am not mistaken, you don't understand why someone would be donating their time to what they believe is a good cause, if they do it anonymously?

Some people do good (up to everyone to interpert their own way what good is) out of conviction, not for the thanks. That itself makes them "feel good".

Project Gutenberg would not exist without people like this.

Last edited by xendula; 01-14-2013 at 05:23 PM.
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Old 01-14-2013, 05:58 PM   #32
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If I am not mistaken, you don't understand why someone would be donating their time to what they believe is a good cause, if they do it anonymously?

Some people do good (up to everyone to interpert their own way what good is) out of conviction, not for the thanks. That itself makes them "feel good".

Project Gutenberg would not exist without people like this.
No, I don't understand how someone who is stealing a work can feel good about making it available to other people (they are giving away something that does not belong to them). I don't really think anyone interprets it as "good" because even if you think you have a reason for doing it, you have to know it hurts the author.

I get the difference between donating time anonymously to a good cause (and legal ones) and respect volunteers greatly.

But uploading something to an illegal site--no matter your personal feelings on "information wants to be free" ... well, anyone doing it has to know it is illegal for a reason. Anyone doing it has to know they are taking revenue from an author and to put hours and hours of work into something like that...I can't see feeling good about it, nor can I see how they can feel they are doing someone else a favor because it is not "Theirs" to give. I'm not saying they don't feel as you describe, but I don't see how they can feel that way.

But in any case, that's not what the thread was/is about, so no need to continue discussion on my reaction to it.
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Old 01-14-2013, 07:23 PM   #33
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But uploading something to an illegal site--no matter your personal feelings on "information wants to be free" ... well, anyone doing it has to know it is illegal for a reason. Anyone doing it has to know they are taking revenue from an author and to put hours and hours of work into something like that...I can't see feeling good about it, nor can I see how they can feel they are doing someone else a favor because it is not "Theirs" to give. I'm not saying they don't feel as you describe, but I don't see how they can feel that way.
Yet it's been going on for years, think about all the groups that spent a lot of time working on cracking software. There's a lot of pride for these people in being the one that provides something "first", even if all they're ever known by is some pseudonym.

Heck, there's enough people out there writing viruses, rootkits, trojans, etc to keep a large industry of antivirus vendors in business. And these are people that are actively doing something that will hurt a *lot* of people. There's just enough people in the world that there's always going to be some that just don't feel that they need to follow the same rules everyone else does. Trying to understand them is really probably just a waste of one's time.
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Old 01-14-2013, 07:34 PM   #34
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No doubt, Piper, no doubt.
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Old 01-14-2013, 09:21 PM   #35
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Originally Posted by BearMountainBooks View Post
No, I don't understand how someone who is stealing a work can feel good about making it available to other people (they are giving away something that does not belong to them). I don't really think anyone interprets it as "good" because even if you think you have a reason for doing it, you have to know it hurts the author.

I get the difference between donating time anonymously to a good cause (and legal ones) and respect volunteers greatly.

But uploading something to an illegal site--no matter your personal feelings on "information wants to be free" ... well, anyone doing it has to know it is illegal for a reason. Anyone doing it has to know they are taking revenue from an author and to put hours and hours of work into something like that...I can't see feeling good about it, nor can I see how they can feel they are doing someone else a favor because it is not "Theirs" to give. I'm not saying they don't feel as you describe, but I don't see how they can feel that way.

But in any case, that's not what the thread was/is about, so no need to continue discussion on my reaction to it.
In that case must have misunderstood you when you said (emphasis mine):
Quote:
And no, I wasn't trying to start THAT argument again. It just boggles my mind because it's a lot of work. And I assume most of them do it anonymously so they aren't going to get a whole lot of "feel good." Or maybe I just wouldn't get anything out of it so I can't quite place myself in their position.

It's just WEIRD. They could make actual money doing this sort of thing working for authors with a backlist. Or they could join communities where they wouldn't need to be anonymous and actually be thanked for helping proof/upload public domain works...
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Old 01-14-2013, 09:46 PM   #36
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There's a huge difference to me in putting in a lot of work for a project that is legal and respected and helps people and hurts no one compare to putting in a huge amount of work to get zero out of it and it hurts a number of people along the line. So in that regard, it's possible you misinterpreted one sentence to cover all bases when for me they are two very different things.
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Old 01-15-2013, 05:36 PM   #37
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Originally Posted by BearMountainBooks View Post
There's a huge difference to me in putting in a lot of work for a project that is legal and respected and helps people and hurts no one compare to putting in a huge amount of work to get zero out of it and it hurts a number of people along the line. So in that regard, it's possible you misinterpreted one sentence to cover all bases when for me they are two very different things.
The tricky bit is that "respected", "helps people" and "hurts no one" are very subjective.
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Old 01-15-2013, 07:21 PM   #38
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The tricky bit is that "respected", "helps people" and "hurts no one" are very subjective.
Well, I can only speak for myself (notice the words "to me"). And really unless anyone here is the person uploading to a torrent site, it's all speculation as to what motivates said person to do it. Just as I am assuming they get "nothing" for it, others are assuming they get some sort of feel good thing. But unless one of us is actually doing the uploading we're all writing fiction. They could be deranged, against government, getting paid, doing it for malice, doing it for the sheer joy of scanning copies...


My only real point was that it boggles MY mind that anyone would bother.
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Old 01-15-2013, 09:15 PM   #39
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My only real point was that it boggles MY mind that anyone would bother.
As you keep saying, and not letting the subject die...
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