Register Guidelines E-Books Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Go Back   MobileRead Forums > E-Book General > News

Notices

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 09-13-2012, 09:05 PM   #1
ScotiaBurrell
Banned
ScotiaBurrell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.ScotiaBurrell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.ScotiaBurrell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.ScotiaBurrell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.ScotiaBurrell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.ScotiaBurrell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.ScotiaBurrell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.ScotiaBurrell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.ScotiaBurrell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.ScotiaBurrell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.ScotiaBurrell ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Posts: 1,118
Karma: 3111746
Join Date: Oct 2011
Device: Kindle & little green monster
Google allegedly told Acer to drop a rival phone, or lose Android partnership

Seems anti-competitive and opposite the 'don't be evil' motto they tout.

In the end, being 'open' is a marketing slogan meant to separate you from yourmoney.

Quote:
Google has allegedly threatened Acer with termination of the companies' partnership on Android, forcing Acer to cancel the launch of a device running a rival mobile operating system.
Quote:
Android is open source, of course. Anyone can use it, even without a partnership with Google (see: Amazon's Kindle Fire). But Google gives favored device-makers early access to Android, and some Android devices launch with Google branding. Manufacturers must also obtain a license from Google to install the Google Play store. Acer makes both Android phones and tablets.
http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2012/...dump-rival-os/

Last edited by ScotiaBurrell; 09-13-2012 at 09:11 PM.
ScotiaBurrell is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-14-2012, 12:24 AM   #2
SeaKing
Frequent Flier
SeaKing ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.SeaKing ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.SeaKing ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.SeaKing ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.SeaKing ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.SeaKing ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.SeaKing ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.SeaKing ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.SeaKing ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.SeaKing ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.SeaKing ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
SeaKing's Avatar
 
Posts: 1,282
Karma: 2058837333
Join Date: Oct 2011
Device: KB kindle aboard, Galx Tab 7.0 Plus, trying out Droid 1 as mini-tab
Quote:
Originally Posted by ScotiaBurrell View Post
Seems anti-competitive and opposite the 'don't be evil' motto they tout.

In the end, being 'open' is a marketing slogan meant to separate you from yourmoney.


http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2012/...dump-rival-os/
In the end, being a "partner" and getting perks means certain things also including when you can compete and when you can't.

I would be interested in knowing who has that kind of relationship with Google and what they have given up, if anything, or a whole lot.
SeaKing is offline   Reply With Quote
 
Enthusiast
Old 09-14-2012, 12:30 PM   #3
fjtorres
Grand Sorcerer
fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Posts: 7,610
Karma: 59121037
Join Date: May 2009
Location: 26 kly from Sgr A*
Device: PRS-T1, KT, PB701/IQ, K2, PB360, BeBook One, Axim51v, TC1000
Quote:
Originally Posted by SeaKing View Post
In the end, being a "partner" and getting perks means certain things also including when you can compete and when you can't.
Uh-huh.
Acer likes partnering with Google to promote Android and undercut windows. And then they whine up a storm when MS does their own hardware.
Now they expect Google to stand idly by while they partner with Alibaba to undercut them.

Apparently Acer thinks partnerships are one-way streets; they get support for their hardware and their software "partners" have to meekly accept it when they get into bed with their competitors.

No sympathy here for either money-grubbing multinational corporation.
fjtorres is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-14-2012, 11:11 PM   #4
afv011
Captain Penguin
afv011 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.afv011 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.afv011 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.afv011 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.afv011 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.afv011 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.afv011 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.afv011 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.afv011 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.afv011 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.afv011 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
afv011's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,837
Karma: 2076640493
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Vancouver, BC
Device: nook*, nexus 10
Quote:
Compatibility is at the heart of the Android ecosystem and ensures a consistent experience for developers, manufacturers and consumers. Non-compatible versions of Android, like Aliyun, weaken the ecosystem. All members of the Open Handset Alliance have committed to building one Android platform and to not ship non-compatible Android devices. This does not however, keep OHA members from participating in competing ecosystems.
Source
afv011 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2012, 05:38 AM   #5
tompe
Grand Sorcerer
tompe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tompe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tompe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tompe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tompe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tompe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tompe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tompe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tompe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tompe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tompe ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Posts: 7,059
Karma: 3993884
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Linköpng, Sweden
Device: Nexus 7, Nexus 5, iPad 2, Kindle PW
So nothing strange at all with this. What Google did was a good thing.
tompe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2012, 07:52 AM   #6
fjtorres
Grand Sorcerer
fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Posts: 7,610
Karma: 59121037
Join Date: May 2009
Location: 26 kly from Sgr A*
Device: PRS-T1, KT, PB701/IQ, K2, PB360, BeBook One, Axim51v, TC1000
Interesting little brewhaha, actually.
1- Android is (conceptually) Mutant-Java (Dalvik runtime) on Linux funneling service income (from Play, Maps, search, etc) to Google.
2- Alibaba created an OS that tried to clone Google's Dalvik and run that on Linux to funnel service income to *their* services. It is not 100% Android compatible.
3- Anybody can fork actual Android to their heart's content (like Amazon does) as long as they're not a member of the Open Handset Alliance.
4- Members of the Open Handset Alliance signed a contract specifying they would not shipped forked Android products that introduced incompatibilities.
5- Acer signed the OHA contract (which they can void at any time) and received access to the proprietary Android apps that add Google ecosystem services (and consumer value) as well as Google developer support for free as long as they are members in good standing of OHA.
6- OHA members can (and do) ship product with non-Google OSes (WP7, Win8, etc) and Google doesn't complain. Those OSes, however, don't try to run Android apps.
7- Google told Acer they considered Alibaba's OS an android derivative and that shipping product with it would be in violation of the OHA contract.
8- Acer weighed the value of OHA membership versus the expected gains from partnering with Alibaba and stopped the intro. Maybe temporarily, just to study their legal options, maybe permanently.

What I find interesting here is that Dalvik itself has a disputed heritage (the Oracle Java lawsuit) and that google is in effect saying that anything with a Dalvik-like runtime is an android derivative or fork and thus forbidden to OHA members. Given that OHA includes Samsung, HTC, Motorola, Acer, and pretty much all the Android Phone vendors that pretty much forecloses the market to any android clone phones and ensures that the service revenue from those phones goes to Google.

That makes OHA a multivendor walled-garden much like Apple's.
It also means Alibaba is going to have to sell its own phones.
Take the Acer name off them, brand them Alibaba, and case closed.

Just another small gotcha for the manufacturers using the "free" phone OS.
These gotchas are piling up, though...

Interesting indeed.
This story's not done. I'm thinking this one's going to court.

Last edited by fjtorres; 09-15-2012 at 07:55 AM.
fjtorres is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2012, 09:23 AM   #7
Graham
Wizard
Graham ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Graham ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Graham ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Graham ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Graham ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Graham ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Graham ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Graham ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Graham ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Graham ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Graham ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Posts: 2,587
Karma: 30629999
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: North Yorkshire, UK
Device: Sony PRS-650, Nexus 4, HP Touchpad, Nexus 7.
Um, if a walled garden is multi-vendor how is it still a walled garden?

The OHA seems like a pretty good thing to me, as it's allowed multiple vendors to move forward together, providing choice to consumers while remaining compatible - with the results we've seen in operating system market share. In fact you could say that the 'successful version' of Android is 'OHA' Android. So successful, in fact, that the biggest non-OHA competitor, Amazon, has taken pains to stay compatible with it, in spite of forking the OS considerably to create its own store interface.

Graham
Graham is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2012, 01:03 PM   #8
afv011
Captain Penguin
afv011 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.afv011 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.afv011 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.afv011 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.afv011 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.afv011 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.afv011 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.afv011 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.afv011 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.afv011 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.afv011 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
afv011's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,837
Karma: 2076640493
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Vancouver, BC
Device: nook*, nexus 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by fjtorres View Post
I'm thinking this one's going to court.
I doubt it. Acer would have much to lose from getting out of the OHA, a phone without access to the market loses most of its appeal. They signed a contract and tried to circumvent it - and got caught. Lick your wounds and move on.

And Alibaba? They don't have a leg to stand on.
afv011 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2012, 06:43 PM   #9
fjtorres
Grand Sorcerer
fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Posts: 7,610
Karma: 59121037
Join Date: May 2009
Location: 26 kly from Sgr A*
Device: PRS-T1, KT, PB701/IQ, K2, PB360, BeBook One, Axim51v, TC1000
Quote:
Originally Posted by afv011 View Post
And Alibaba? They don't have a leg to stand on.
They're the ones I think might sue. In China.
The heart of the argument is Google's assertion that, in effect, *any* Dalvik-clone on Linux is an android fork. That is legally debatable.
fjtorres is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2012, 07:19 PM   #10
fjtorres
Grand Sorcerer
fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Posts: 7,610
Karma: 59121037
Join Date: May 2009
Location: 26 kly from Sgr A*
Device: PRS-T1, KT, PB701/IQ, K2, PB360, BeBook One, Axim51v, TC1000
And it looks likke Alibaba is not going away quietly:
http://news.cnet.com/8301-1035_3-575...-about-our-os/

Quote:
Spelich told CNET in an e-mail that Aliyun is "not a fork. Ours is built on open-source Linux." And he added that Aliyun "has our own applications. [It's] designed to run cloud apps designed in our own ecosystem. [It] can run some but not all Android apps."

He also accused the Android ecosystem of being closed and restrictive:

Aliyun is an open-source based OS that is also an open ecosystem that allows others to host their mobile-enabled Web sites in our cloud and we make those Web sites available to users who use Aliyun OS phones. So we are an ecosystem that includes other Internet companies, whereas Android does not because it provides apps through downloads. It's the crux of the whole cloud vs. app debate. Cloud is open, apps system is closed because it is controlled by the operator of the apps marketplace. So you see: Two competing ecosystems, one that's open through the cloud, the other is closed and restricts users to only the apps that they want you to see.
fjtorres is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2012, 08:08 PM   #11
afv011
Captain Penguin
afv011 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.afv011 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.afv011 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.afv011 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.afv011 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.afv011 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.afv011 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.afv011 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.afv011 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.afv011 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.afv011 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
afv011's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,837
Karma: 2076640493
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Vancouver, BC
Device: nook*, nexus 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by fjtorres View Post
And it looks likke Alibaba is not going away quietly:
http://news.cnet.com/8301-1035_3-575...-about-our-os/
To Alibaba: cry me a river. They tried to ride on the success of Android without playing by the rules.
afv011 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2012, 09:26 PM   #12
fjtorres
Grand Sorcerer
fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Posts: 7,610
Karma: 59121037
Join Date: May 2009
Location: 26 kly from Sgr A*
Device: PRS-T1, KT, PB701/IQ, K2, PB360, BeBook One, Axim51v, TC1000
Quote:
Originally Posted by afv011 View Post
To Alibaba: cry me a river. They tried to ride on the success of Android without playing by the rules.
Yup.
Thing is, it looks like they're doing to google as google did to java.

If they *really* wrote their own Dalvik-emulator without google code then it wouldn't really be an android fork, but rather a clone. Forks start with the same code base, not the api specs. And as the Oracle vs google trial made clear, that is perfectly safe.
As I said, this could get interesting.
fjtorres is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-15-2012, 09:57 PM   #13
HansTWN
Wizard
HansTWN ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HansTWN ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HansTWN ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HansTWN ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HansTWN ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HansTWN ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HansTWN ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HansTWN ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HansTWN ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HansTWN ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HansTWN ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Posts: 4,540
Karma: 264065402
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Taiwan
Device: HP Touchpad, Sony Duo 13, Lumia 920, Kobo Aura HD
Quote:
Originally Posted by afv011 View Post
To Alibaba: cry me a river. They tried to ride on the success of Android without playing by the rules.
Since when did Chinese companies play by the rules??
HansTWN is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-16-2012, 12:46 AM   #14
Graham
Wizard
Graham ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Graham ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Graham ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Graham ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Graham ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Graham ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Graham ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Graham ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Graham ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Graham ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Graham ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Posts: 2,587
Karma: 30629999
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: North Yorkshire, UK
Device: Sony PRS-650, Nexus 4, HP Touchpad, Nexus 7.
Quote:
Originally Posted by fjtorres View Post
Yup.
Thing is, it looks like they're doing to google as google did to java.

If they *really* wrote their own Dalvik-emulator without google code then it wouldn't really be an android fork, but rather a clone. Forks start with the same code base, not the api specs. And as the Oracle vs google trial made clear, that is perfectly safe.
As I said, this could get interesting.
Note that Google isn't going after Alibaba. They're simply holding Acer to the terms of the Alliance. The fact that this alternate OS can run many Android apps natively means that it's reasonable to apply the terms within the spirit if not the exact letter of the OHA agreement.

Spyke
Graham is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-16-2012, 01:12 AM   #15
afv011
Captain Penguin
afv011 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.afv011 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.afv011 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.afv011 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.afv011 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.afv011 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.afv011 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.afv011 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.afv011 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.afv011 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.afv011 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
afv011's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,837
Karma: 2076640493
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Vancouver, BC
Device: nook*, nexus 10
There's a good analysis here.

Quote:
Of course, Aliyun is trying to play both sides — remain separate from the Android ecosystem, while being Android binary-compatible. Although it does say its focus is on web apps. Obviously, what tipped off Rubin (as he alludes to in his Google+ post) and Google was the fact that Aliyun is running Android apps. It can’t have it both ways, so if it drops the APK, perhaps Google wouldn’t block the rim…
afv011 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Intel, Google unveil Android mobile partnership kennyc Android Devices 9 09-15-2011 06:08 AM
Google announces Android open mobile phone platform Bob Russell Alternative Devices 18 02-06-2008 11:36 AM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 08:28 AM.


MobileRead.com is a privately owned, operated and funded community.