Register Guidelines E-Books Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Go Back   MobileRead Forums > E-Book General > News

Notices

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 09-01-2012, 10:51 AM   #16
Catlady
Wizard
Catlady ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Catlady ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Catlady ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Catlady ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Catlady ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Catlady ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Catlady ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Catlady ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Catlady ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Catlady ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Catlady ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Catlady's Avatar
 
Posts: 3,143
Karma: 9192378
Join Date: Oct 2010
Device: jetBook Lite, Libre Color
Is a library allowed to offer a physical book that is not available in Braille or in an audio version? If so, shouldn't someone sue?
Catlady is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-01-2012, 11:08 AM   #17
fjtorres
Grand Sorcerer
fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Posts: 8,072
Karma: 61930674
Join Date: May 2009
Location: 26 kly from Sgr A*
Device: PRS-T1, KT, PB701/IQ, K2, PB360, BeBook One, Axim51v, TC1000
Quote:
Originally Posted by Catlady View Post
Is a library allowed to offer a physical book that is not available in Braille or in an audio version? If so, shouldn't someone sue?
Don't give them ideas!

Fortunately, ADA has limits.
Unfortunately, the way Congress drafts laws like that they leave them fuzzy on purpose. The limits are whatever judges say they are, afer long and expensive litigation.
That's why ADA and similar laws are colloquially known as Lawyer Full-Employment Acts.
fjtorres is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-01-2012, 11:10 AM   #18
HarryT
eBook Enthusiast
HarryT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HarryT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HarryT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HarryT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HarryT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HarryT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HarryT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HarryT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HarryT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HarryT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.HarryT ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
HarryT's Avatar
 
Posts: 65,567
Karma: 44144193
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: UK
Device: Kindle Voyage, iPad Mini, iPhone 4, MS Surface Pro, N7
Presumably, then, American libraries aren't allowed to have CDs, because deaf people can't listen to them?
HarryT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-01-2012, 11:30 AM   #19
Terisa de morgan
Wizard
Terisa de morgan ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Terisa de morgan ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Terisa de morgan ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Terisa de morgan ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Terisa de morgan ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Terisa de morgan ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Terisa de morgan ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Terisa de morgan ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Terisa de morgan ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Terisa de morgan ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Terisa de morgan ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Terisa de morgan's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,424
Karma: 2534978
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Madrid, Spain
Device: Kobo Aura, Kobo Mini, Kobo Aura HD, iPhone, iPad, Galaxy Tab3 8
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kali Yuga View Post
If B&N had included a text-to-speech option, or the library had used Amazon Kindles or some other e-ink device with text-to-speech, the costs would be the same. If they used iPads from the start, it'd probably cost them an extra $2000.
That some text-to-speech option that it's disabled at almost all the ebooks? And I agree, get a Kindle device, you'll see the wide selection at your library.
Terisa de morgan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-01-2012, 11:30 AM   #20
fjtorres
Grand Sorcerer
fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.fjtorres ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Posts: 8,072
Karma: 61930674
Join Date: May 2009
Location: 26 kly from Sgr A*
Device: PRS-T1, KT, PB701/IQ, K2, PB360, BeBook One, Axim51v, TC1000
Quote:
Originally Posted by HarryT View Post
Presumably, then, American libraries aren't allowed to have CDs, because deaf people can't listen to them?
That may be grandfathered since they were doing it before the ADA was passed.
Then again, many deaf people refuse to think of themselves as disabled so they may simply be refusing to sue over it.
http://www.beyonddiscovery.org/conte...page.asp?I=261
fjtorres is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-01-2012, 12:51 PM   #21
taming
Trying for calm & polite
taming ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.taming ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.taming ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.taming ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.taming ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.taming ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.taming ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.taming ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.taming ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.taming ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.taming ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
taming's Avatar
 
Posts: 4,013
Karma: 9455193
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Mostly in Canada
Device: kobo original, WiFI, Touch, Glo, and Aura
The key issue, it seems to me, is captured in this quote:

Quote:
The goal of the agreement is "to provide a library e-reader circulation program where library patrons, with and without vision disabilities, are able to access and use the same technology to the maximum extent possible." Under the agreement, the library will "acquire only technology that does not exclude persons who are blind or others" who need accessibility features such as text-to-speech or Braille output and the ability to access the device's menus and controls independently.
Similar suits were successful in the days before websites were coded in such a way as to make it easy for people who were blind, had other visual impairments, or mobility problems to use screen readers. Now accessibility compliant websites are the rule, rather than the exception.

The comments about CDs are something else entirely. It is not a case of simply being able to choose or foster the development of a competing technology to allow deaf people to enjoy CDs. And, if I remember correctly, in the US, the one exception for DRM removal is for usage by people with disabilities.
taming is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-01-2012, 06:57 PM   #22
Kali Yuga
Professional Contrarian
Kali Yuga ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kali Yuga ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kali Yuga ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kali Yuga ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kali Yuga ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kali Yuga ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kali Yuga ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kali Yuga ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kali Yuga ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kali Yuga ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kali Yuga ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Kali Yuga's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,045
Karma: 3289631
Join Date: Mar 2009
Device: Kindle 4 No Touchie
Quote:
Originally Posted by HarryT View Post
Presumably, then, American libraries aren't allowed to have CDs, because deaf people can't listen to them?
They can't "listen" to them in terms of hearing the audible signals, but they can experience music.

There are even some well-known and, in one case, highly accomplished, deaf musicians.

http://www.ted.com/talks/evelyn_glen...to_listen.html

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p3q8W...2&feature=plcp
Kali Yuga is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-01-2012, 07:01 PM   #23
Kali Yuga
Professional Contrarian
Kali Yuga ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kali Yuga ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kali Yuga ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kali Yuga ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kali Yuga ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kali Yuga ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kali Yuga ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kali Yuga ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kali Yuga ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kali Yuga ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Kali Yuga ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Kali Yuga's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,045
Karma: 3289631
Join Date: Mar 2009
Device: Kindle 4 No Touchie
Quote:
Originally Posted by Terisa de morgan View Post
That some text-to-speech option that it's disabled at almost all the ebooks?
Every single book in Amazon's current top 10 (paid) has TTS enabled.

Publishers objected at first, but seem to have calmed down.

There's also an incredible resource of public domain books, where no publisher can turn off TTS.
Kali Yuga is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-01-2012, 07:52 PM   #24
Phogg
PHD in Horribleness
Phogg ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Phogg ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Phogg ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Phogg ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Phogg ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Phogg ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Phogg ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Phogg ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Phogg ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Phogg ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Phogg ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Phogg's Avatar
 
Posts: 1,693
Karma: 17586646
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: In the ironbound section, near avenue L
Device: Just a whole bunch. I guess I am a collector now.
Quote:
Originally Posted by xg4bx View Post
Let's be honest though, how many blind people A) use the library, B)
California is bankrupt, I don't know why they're buying ereaders in the first place but hey, that's just me.
Rationally, There really isn't any possible view of this whole thing that trumps that.

The only way libraries in Cali should be getting anything new is if patrons donate things.
Phogg is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 09-01-2012, 11:54 PM   #25
crich70
Grand Sorcerer
crich70 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.crich70 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.crich70 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.crich70 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.crich70 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.crich70 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.crich70 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.crich70 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.crich70 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.crich70 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.crich70 ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
crich70's Avatar
 
Posts: 7,512
Karma: 24029999
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Monroe Wisconsin
Device: K3, Kindle Paperwhite, Calibre, and Mobipocket for Pc (netbook)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kali Yuga View Post
They can't "listen" to them in terms of hearing the audible signals, but they can experience music.

There are even some well-known and, in one case, highly accomplished, deaf musicians.

http://www.ted.com/talks/evelyn_glen...to_listen.html

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p3q8W...2&feature=plcp
There has even been at least one deaf composer. Beethoven was deaf by age 25 I believe, and yet he composed some wonderful music.
crich70 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-02-2012, 01:20 AM   #26
meeera
Wizard
meeera ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.meeera ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.meeera ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.meeera ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.meeera ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.meeera ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.meeera ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.meeera ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.meeera ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.meeera ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.meeera ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
meeera's Avatar
 
Posts: 2,327
Karma: 8097760
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Australia
Device: Kobo Aura, iPad MiniRet, MBP;support AuraHD,Kindle,2xKobo Glos
Quote:
Originally Posted by xg4bx View Post
Likewise I wouldn't pitch a fit if a library didn't cater to my particular disability, it would be unfair to the other taxpayers to cater to my needs.
What? I certainly would 'pitch a fit' if my library decided to install a flight of stairs at the entryway, or got rid of their accessible parking, or made their doorways too narrow for wheelies. All the way to lawsuits if necessary.

Thanks for illustrating why anti-discrimination legislation is necessary.
meeera is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-02-2012, 02:19 AM   #27
Andrew H.
Grand Master of Flowers
Andrew H. ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Andrew H. ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Andrew H. ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Andrew H. ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Andrew H. ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Andrew H. ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Andrew H. ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Andrew H. ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Andrew H. ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Andrew H. ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.Andrew H. ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
Posts: 2,193
Karma: 8233324
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Naptown
Device: Kindle PW, Kindle 3 (aka Keyboard), iPhone, iPad 3 (not for reading)
Quote:
Originally Posted by xg4bx View Post
Am I in bizarro world? A blind woman was disgruntled because she can't use an ereader.....*clears cobwebs from head*...am I missing something here? How is this discrimination? I hate to break it to this lady but she's BLIND, there are always going to be things she can't do; that's simply the hand that nature dealt her. Borrow a book on tape. And suing a library that is probably already hanging on by a thread is just low. Sorry.

Absurd.
What's absurd is your lack of sympathy for people who don't have your abilities, as well as your missing the point that the library was violating the law.


Quote:
Originally Posted by fjtorres View Post
It was a limited-scope pilot to identify issues to be addressed in case they went with a full deployment. (Which in the end they did not.)
First, knee-jerk, reaction was to sue.
(shrug)
Modern practice is sue first, discuss later.
Well, it looks like they found an issue. And issue that was, however, blindingly obvious. For lack of a better word.

And no one sued anyone. Someone complained to the office of civil rights.

Quote:
Originally Posted by xg4bx View Post
Let's be honest though, how many blind people A) use the library, B) would even be interested in said program. I'd dare say the costs would far outweigh any benefits.
Lots. Do you know any blind people?
Quote:

Like everything else in America, what may have started out as a good intention (the disabilities act) has mutated into an abomination and a form of abuse backed by the power of government. She should have gone to the library first and if it didn't work out, she should have shrugged and gone on with her life. Life is unfair sometimes. *shrug* I don't lose sleep because Abercrombie doesn't carry clothes that fit my husky boy needs. Likewise I wouldn't pitch a fit if a library didn't cater to my particular disability, it would be unfair to the other taxpayers to cater to my needs.
You don't lose sleep because the blind are denied access to public services since you are not blind. Again, great attitude.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Catlady View Post
Is a library allowed to offer a physical book that is not available in Braille or in an audio version? If so, shouldn't someone sue?
Yes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by HarryT View Post
Presumably, then, American libraries aren't allowed to have CDs, because deaf people can't listen to them?
No.

The issue here is that there are e-readers accessible to the blind (including Kindles and the iPads and iPod touches mentioned in the article), and the library chose e-readers that were not accessible to the blind. You aren't required to do the impossible, but you have to make an accommodation if it can be done reasonably.
Andrew H. is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-02-2012, 02:30 AM   #28
tubemonkey
monkey on the fringe
tubemonkey ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tubemonkey ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tubemonkey ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tubemonkey ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tubemonkey ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tubemonkey ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tubemonkey ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tubemonkey ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tubemonkey ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tubemonkey ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tubemonkey ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
tubemonkey's Avatar
 
Posts: 17,319
Karma: 84322551
Join Date: May 2010
Device: FireHDX8, FireHD6, FirePhn, Nex7, K4S, ClipZip
From the article:

Quote:
As part of the settlement agreement, the Justice Department directed the library system to purchase at least 18 e-readers that are accessible to the blind, something that comes in the midst of budget cuts that have forced Sacramento libraries to implement one employee furlough day each month for two years.

The library says it will add iPod touch and iPad devices, which read e-books aloud with a computerized voice.

Adding the Apple devices could cost the library anywhere from $3,582 with the purchase of 18 of the most inexpensive iPod Touch models, to $14,922 if they wish to provide the high-end version of the iPad, which cost $829 a piece.
iPads? Sure hope no library would stupid enough to waste money on iPads for the TTS feature when the much cheaper iPod touch is just as capable.
tubemonkey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-02-2012, 02:51 AM   #29
AnemicOak
Bookaholic
AnemicOak ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AnemicOak ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AnemicOak ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AnemicOak ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AnemicOak ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AnemicOak ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AnemicOak ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AnemicOak ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AnemicOak ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AnemicOak ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.AnemicOak ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
AnemicOak's Avatar
 
Posts: 10,428
Karma: 28936355
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Minnesota
Device: HDX 8.9, AuraHD, Nook HD+, Kindle 2,3,T , Opus, Nexus7, iPhone5, etc
Quote:
Originally Posted by tubemonkey View Post
From the article:



iPads? Sure hope no library would stupid enough to waste money on iPads for the TTS feature when the much cheaper iPod touch is just as capable.
The Google Nexus (and some other Android devices) has accessibility features similar to those of the ipad for a lot less too. Of course if the iPads/Touches are primarily to be bought and loaned out as reading devices there's no need for the most expensive versions, as mentioned in the article, of either device. The cheapest versions would be fine.

Last edited by AnemicOak; 09-02-2012 at 02:54 AM.
AnemicOak is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-02-2012, 03:07 AM   #30
tubemonkey
monkey on the fringe
tubemonkey ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tubemonkey ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tubemonkey ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tubemonkey ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tubemonkey ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tubemonkey ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tubemonkey ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tubemonkey ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tubemonkey ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tubemonkey ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.tubemonkey ought to be getting tired of karma fortunes by now.
 
tubemonkey's Avatar
 
Posts: 17,319
Karma: 84322551
Join Date: May 2010
Device: FireHDX8, FireHD6, FirePhn, Nex7, K4S, ClipZip
Quote:
Originally Posted by AnemicOak View Post
The Google Nexus (and some other Android devices) has accessibility features similar to those of the ipad for a lot less too. Of course if the iPads/Touches are primarily to be bought and loaned out as reading devices there's no need for the most expensive versions, as mentioned in the article, of either device. The cheapest versions would be fine.
For that matter, why not go with the $130 Galaxy Player 3.6? It's much cheaper than the $199 iPod touch.
tubemonkey is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Which is the best eReader for library books? Carolshusband Which one should I buy? 45 12-16-2010 10:50 PM
How do I transfer library to new ereader? gdaydigger Kobo Reader 8 08-13-2010 12:03 PM
Compare calibre library with ereader library Danthier Calibre 3 06-16-2010 12:58 AM
So which is the best ereader for library books? ensyed Which one should I buy? 14 11-08-2009 03:38 PM
Kansas library offers free podcasts, online programs Brian News 2 09-12-2005 12:28 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 11:40 PM.


MobileRead.com is a privately owned, operated and funded community.